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Why not let people decay into oblivion?

oblivion why not? life death life and death

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#1 brokenportal

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Posted 27 May 2010 - 02:01 AM


Why shouldn't we let people decay into oblivion? List your reasons in this topic.



There are many reasons to not want to let people decay into oblivion if they dont have to.


People should get to see the future if they can. There’s no reason to stop them if we don’t have to, even if it means hard work. We shouldn’t be afraid of hard work, it’s fun and pioneering. Humans are entrepreneurs and it’s the entrepreneurs spirit. Where there is not need for limit, then limits must not be had. Progress continues to open doors and we must continue to keep up.

Like Theodore Roosevelt once said, "Far and away the best prize that life offers is the chance to work hard at work worth doing."

We cannot be content to die if we don’t know what is going on.

Attached File  strange_unexplainable_world_indefinite_life_extension.jpg   58.98KB   5 downloadsIf you woke up tomorrow on a pink planet with walking trees and birds that flew backwards singing Elvis songs then you need to figure out what is going on. You would be looked upon with shame if you weren’t deeply interested in figuring it out, but rather were indifferent to it and content to live out the rest of your life on that planet. That is exactly what this earth is like. Just because we have gotten used to it doesn’t mean its normal. This is an off the charts bizarre, seemingly infinite mystery. If you don’t fully realize this yet then this is because you are unable to spot fallacy in your thinking. In order to alleviate this, read up on fallacy and work to learn how to spot when your thoughts are fallacy or not. Those of us who view our entrapment and as of yet inevitable decay on this earth as normal need to realize that we have succumbed to what many call the Stockholm syndrome for one, and realize it for what it is.

Like the people trapped in the cave in Platos parable, we cannot ever remain content to live out a life with limited understanding. We must constantly seek to uncover the mystery. We must do this until we finally know, and can decide what to do next, live or die, and other things, based on the big picture, and not be eager to jump into our graves, be content to be pushed into our graves, based on such a limited understanding of what is going on. We must do this until we finally know, or until we are crushed by the randomosities of existence.
Attached File  plato_cave_parable_movement_for_indefinite_life_extension.jpg   41.1KB   2 downloads

People are trained in to guide the world only to be continuously massacred and replaced by people who have to learn everything over again from scratch.

Attached File  wild_horse_indefinite_life_extension.jpg   44.33KB   2 downloadsIts like the world is a wild stallion. We are like horse trainers with week long life spans. In one week we have to try to learn how to train horses. Then we get on the wild horse, try to train it and rein it under control, but we die after a week and another trainer jumps on, tries to put the reins on it, but they die after a week and so on. If we had longer life spans we would have time to get on the problems of this world, put the reins on it and get it under control.

People are unique, extremely valuable and rare wealths of knowledge and insight.

Posted Image
Many of you are probably familiar with the fate of the library of Alexandria one of the largest and greatest libraries of ancient times. It was burned to the ground by invading forces and lost forever to time. It is widely regarded as one of the biggest losses of ancient knowledge in history. What would we do to be able to get our hands on just one of those scrolls? What kinds of fantastic wonders might they go over, what epic stories might they be able to tell us about, what morals and lessons have been lost there? What advancements were made long before we think they were? What great thinkers are we now unable to give credit to for where we are today? What inspirations are lost forever to the landfills of time? It is a great loss no doubt but why aren’t we wishing for the writers back? Rather than the scrolls themselves, why not wish for the very writers of the scrolls themselves back? Every person who dies is like many library of Alexandria’s being burnt to the ground and lost forever to time. Let’s make sure we don’t lose any more of them, lets fortify our walls and send the invaders back into the sea.

We owe it to our ancestors for struggling to achieve all we have today.

Attached File  ancestors_struggle_to_deliver_to_transhuman_era_indefinite_life_extension.gif   420.12KB   3 downloadsThis is the next great human mission. Through blood, sweat and tears, progress, joys, and dreams, our ancestors have delivered us to this cusp at the end of the technology era, which is emerging into the grand new Transhuman era. In a way, we have been preparing through out all of human existence for this. We cannot let our ancestors down. This is an immense homage we owe to them for their great sacrifices and hard work, as well as an obligation that we owe to ourselves and all of our dear progeny of the future.

The pain that comes with end of life years is unreal.

We must sacrifice for the movement for indefinite life extension like we were on fire, because we are. Aging is burning us alive from the inside out. The price is not too high. If you doubt it, ask the 36,500,000 people that are living in the fires of aging, getting set to die in this next year. That’s an astonishing 100,000 every single day until the movement for indefinite life extensions goals are all accomplished.

Ask the Hospice patients across the world whether great sacrifice for this cause is worth it. Attached File  elderly_pain_immortality.jpg   49.96KB   3 downloads

Ask the cancer patients amongst them that are dissolving away on the inside, wracking in pain, sweating in the empty, many times compassionless nursing home rooms.

Attached File  elderly_pain_movement_life_extension_indefinite.jpg   12.26KB   0 downloadsAsk the heart disease victims, in their 80s and 90s, going under the knife, through the horrifying procedure of having your ribs sawed and cracked open, long arteries cut from their arms and legs and wrapped around their hearts so that they may contemplate their severely deteriorated states as they wait in the flames of aging for imminent death.

Ask those dreamers whos joys and aspirations have been truncated and met with their new hospital death beds.

Ask those families who are being strangled by the reality of being forced to come to terms with the eternal obliteration of their loved ones. Attached File  elder_pain_movement_indefinite_life_extension.jpg   9.98KB   0 downloads

Ask the rich, vibrant, colorful, fascinating annals of history, that are having their hard earned, profound and original volumes ripped from their shelves, burned and buried, lost forever until the end of time.

Attached File  elderly_pain_movement_for_indefinite_life_extension.jpg   40.52KB   1 downloadsAsk them what sacrifices are enough.

To quote Felicia Nimue Ackerman, professor of philosophy at Brown University, “The blanket presumption that the latter states [of poverty, pain, ill health] bring ‘misery’ that is worse than death is disrespectful to those who, having experienced them, disagree.”

This movement cannot be impeded by the faint of heart, those who would make excuses, and those who would put their own limited selfish interests above those of the worlds indefinite life extension.

Not only do the fires of affliction consume us in horrible mind melting torture for many years. They also rob us of an endlessly big and multifaceted gift of existence. The universe and all of existence is a big, incredible mysterious place that we hardly know anything about. All of humanities combined experience with it to date is equivalent to not even having taken it out of the box yet. These countless opportunities can be summed up in this list of 8 things.

There are many more reasons to not want people to decay into oblivion as well. Fight death, stop aging, join the cause. If you want your life, if you want to try to learn more about the wonders of the universe and existence then join the cause.

Edited by brokenportal, 06 March 2012 - 08:52 PM.


#2 Elus

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Posted 02 September 2010 - 05:12 AM

I often think of the two grandfathers I lost to aging. The first died of stomach cancer. I remember playing chess with him and he would masterfully defeat me every time (I was a total noob, and he played with some of the best players in Russia). He was also an engineer. I can only imagine what I could have learned from him. Why didn't we have more time together? I can't quite put into words how much I miss him.

My other grandfather died to a stroke. I heard epic stories of him. He was a sailor, and he rescued people during a flood while braving a lightning storm. When I was too young to remember, he would take me to the circus. Once when it was raining he slipped and fell with me still in his arms. Instead of propping himself up to try to avoid injury, he embraced me to prevent me from getting hurt and took the fall himself.

I have lost them forever. Nothing I do can bring them back, and the sheer frustration of this realization evokes fury, sadness, hopelessness, and disgust within me.

In the present, my two grandmothers remain alive. Will I be able to save them? Will we make enough progress to prevent them from slipping into oblivion? How about my friends? My parents? Myself? I cannot stand by while aging ravages humanity. This is why I am studying biology, chemistry, mathematics, and science in general. Once I obtain my PhD a few years from now, I too will join the ranks of the scientists who will obliterate aging from existence.

Our current situation is simply unacceptable. We must rage against it. Fight it. Aging, disease, and death MUST become primitive relics of our civilization. We will one day look back and say to one another, "Can you imagine how horrible it was to have to die?"

Edited by Elus, 02 September 2010 - 07:17 PM.


#3 maxwatt

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Posted 02 September 2010 - 05:22 PM

Spring and Fall, to a Young Child

Margaret, are you grieving
Over Goldengrove unleaving?
Leaves, like the things of man, you
With your fresh thoughts care for, can you?
Ah! as the heart grows older
It will come to such sights colder
By and by, nor spare a sigh
Though worlds of wanwood leafmeal lie;
And yet you will weep and know why.
Now no matter, child, the name:
Sorrow's springs are the same.
Nor mouth had, no nor mind, expressed
What heart heard of, ghost guessed:
It is the blight man was born for,
It is Margaret you mourn for.
-- Gerard Manley Hopkins

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#4 brokenportal

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Posted 24 September 2010 - 08:21 PM

I often think of the two grandfathers I lost to aging. The first died of stomach cancer. I remember playing chess with him and he would masterfully defeat me every time (I was a total noob, and he played with some of the best players in Russia). He was also an engineer. I can only imagine what I could have learned from him. Why didn't we have more time together? I can't quite put into words how much I miss him.


Me too. I one of my grandfathers died. My great grandmother sticks with me the most for some reason though. She was the first person I knew well that died. It still seems like yesterday that she was a live vibrant person with a full existence ahead of her to continue tackling. It doesnt make sense to me that she doesnt deserve that chance any more.

One of my other grandfathers is still alive. Hes very old, he has a stroke that I thought was going to kill him and now recently had multiple heart bypasses. At least once a week I think about how somebody is going to be calling me any time to tell me that hes dead. Its a horrible race against the clock type of feeling to have in paralleling that reality with the urgent need to move with this cause. Then you run to the next mile marker in the cause, only to find another group of people sitting on the curb playing cards, you hold up signs, give out flyers and messages and speeches and links and directions and information and are tempted to scream it louder and louder but they wont get the fuck up and move while the time bombs are going off in peoples brains left and right sending them in to the eternal abyss, and your grandfather and others are standing there right on the brink. Some times I just want to punch people in the face, but I just havent figured out a way to do it respectfully yet.


I have lost them forever. Nothing I do can bring them back, and the sheer frustration of this realization evokes fury, sadness, hopelessness, and disgust within me.


me too

In the present, my two grandmothers remain alive. Will I be able to save them? Will we make enough progress to prevent them from slipping into oblivion? How about my friends? My parents? Myself? I cannot stand by while aging ravages humanity. This is why I am studying biology, chemistry, mathematics, and science in general. Once I obtain my PhD a few years from now, I too will join the ranks of the scientists who will obliterate aging from existence.


Exactly

Our current situation is simply unacceptable. We must rage against it. Fight it. Aging, disease, and death MUST become primitive relics of our civilization. We will one day look back and say to one another, "Can you imagine how horrible it was to have to die?"


Hence we must build an organization to do this, or is it more accurately that we must organize a building of? Hence of course, Imminst and the organizations and the whole movement for indefinite life extension. We have a lot to offer and "sell" to the world as we have been putting it in a recent discussion. I often wonder if everybody else around is picking up on exactly what that is we have to "sell" to the world. We advertise and talk about it all around. Can you name what it is? How would you describe it?

#5 Droplet

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Posted 20 July 2011 - 06:08 AM

The pain at the end of life and from aging is a bloody outrage! I'm off the opinion that we really need to push that one home. "It's gonna hurt like Hell and then you're deleted by no choice of your own."

I too mostly support life extension because as you say, we learn so much only to have it all erased. Like making a perfect, most amazing computer then being told that after so long you cannot upgrade the hardware or add more data and must destroy it. It has no reason (other than nature deciding that everything cannot last) and I can't understand why we allow it. As for "tinkering with nature" we've done it all the time and if anyone is going to complain about it, I ask them this: Have you ever eaten carrots? Do you own a dog? If yes then you are a bit of a hypocrite because dogs were selectively bred and have had their genetics changed to suit us and carrots were only orange due to us changing them. In event of apocalypse, many of our vegetables would be unrecognisable in a century or so because no one is there to selectively breed them. We've changed the natural world for our needs since centuries ago but it's just that we weren't as capable as now nor do we have labs to do it in.

If any of my points are wrong, I welcome correction. :)
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#6 brokenportal

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Posted 05 January 2012 - 05:47 AM

Like making a perfect, most amazing computer then being told that after so long you cannot upgrade the hardware or add more data and must destroy it. It has no reason (other than nature deciding that everything cannot last) and I can't understand why we allow it. As for "tinkering with nature" we've done it all the time and if anyone is going to complain about it, I ask them this: Have you ever eaten carrots?



That's right, would we take a complex computer and then say, "well, this one is one of the oldest, its got quite a bit of dust on it. It contains a ton of information, it has the archives of the news from 2001 in it, and it is the hub of a variety of websites, but lets drop a 200 lb anvil on it. That would make sense."
Attached File  anvil computer longecity death is like erasing important information.JPG   40.56KB   6 downloads


I saw somewhere recently, maybe it was here at Longecity, that like the carrot, the banana used to be a lot different before the ones we see today were selected for.
Attached File  wild banana longecity unlimited lifespans natural.jpg   26.8KB   5 downloads

Edited by brokenportal, 05 January 2012 - 05:47 AM.

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#7 Mind

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Posted 06 March 2012 - 10:26 PM

I will certainly try to persuade all of my loved ones and society at large to pursue indefinite life extension and health, but if someone truly desires to go off into oblivion, for whatever odd or rational reason, then I won't stop them.
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#8 Droplet

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Posted 07 March 2012 - 06:54 AM

I will certainly try to persuade all of my loved ones and society at large to pursue indefinite life extension and health, but if someone truly desires to go off into oblivion, for whatever odd or rational reason, then I won't stop them.

I agree 100%. No one asks to be born and if people truly choose not to exist then they should have a choice. :)





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