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How to Potentiate Modafinil


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#1 pheonickx

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Posted 20 July 2010 - 06:14 AM


I have a very limited amount of modafinil available and want to pro-long effects (final year medstudent here).
Caffeine and piracetam seemed to have done the trick in the past but not too sure now.
please shoot your ideas on how to get about this .......thankyou so much!!

#2 Imagination

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Posted 20 July 2010 - 06:54 AM

Cannot you not just buy some more?
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#3 pheonickx

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Posted 20 July 2010 - 09:04 AM

would i be putting up this entire post had that been the case?
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#4 Animal

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Posted 20 July 2010 - 01:50 PM

Deprenyl will potentiate it, but it takes a couple of weeks to reach full effect.

#5 chrono

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Posted 20 July 2010 - 08:57 PM

Deprenyl will potentiate it, but it takes a couple of weeks to reach full effect.

I'm curious, are there any potential consequences to taking DPR with modafinil (acute or chronically), or is this a generally safe combination? (I haven't looked into modafinil's MOA that thoroughly yet).

#6 Animal

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Posted 20 July 2010 - 10:25 PM

Deprenyl will potentiate it, but it takes a couple of weeks to reach full effect.

I'm curious, are there any potential consequences to taking DPR with modafinil (acute or chronically), or is this a generally safe combination? (I haven't looked into modafinil's MOA that thoroughly yet).


I would assume it's safe since modafinil is only mildly dopaminergic through a secondary mechanism, so I doubt there will be any neurotoxicity due to excess dopaminergic oxidative stress. I have consumed this combination many times and I must say it doesn't feel toxic (obviously not a conclusive indicator) in that the potentiation is only in duration and not intensity of effect.

Of course I could be wrong, but good luck finding a study on this.

Personally I would never take deprenyl solely for the purpose of potentiating modafinil, it has too many side-effects, but I take the deprenyl for other reasons.
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#7 NR2(x)

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Posted 21 July 2010 - 05:16 AM

Dopaminergic is a classification for an effect not a cause, there are many dopamine like molecules, particlularly with sulfur one or two positions off the phenyl. However many references are to specifically dopamine, and can be just an indicator, its abit of an art telling when.

You spot on about deprenyl, the casacades come together, Im interested how you knew?

Modafinil shows some really interesting changes in some specific protien buts its MOA is through amine bonding, similar to amphetamine.

My concern with using caffeine is that it enhances narrow task positive functions while deminishing fluency and the holistic mind, so maybe for some task but not for others, and as a final year med student i imagine your really starting to have to use higher end function.
Exercise?

Memantine could be interesting in a low dose but both can show NMDA antagonistic effects
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#8 pheonickx

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Posted 21 July 2010 - 07:01 AM

I think im going to try the very good ole classics :

piracetm
centrophenoxine
vinpocetine
pyritinol

im really hoping synergy gets about by itself own self LOL


Deprenyl and Memantine have been suggested so far but dont seem to have much feasibility cred.

If anyone else has any ideas or experiments they ran .......please toss them about :)
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#9 aLurker

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Posted 21 July 2010 - 10:17 AM

Well I have no idea why more Modafinil isn't an option for you(legal/cost/whatever?). But you could consider the predecessor Adrafinil instead even though it seems worse in every way (more sides) except it has fewer legal issues in some countries and is way cheaper than Modafinil. Just tossing the idea out there for you to consider.

#10 NR2(x)

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Posted 21 July 2010 - 11:12 AM

I have used vinpocetine and you definitly notice the positive effects with a mild tension headache, I am abit concerned about reduced working memory form the anti dopamine-1 effect tho, enough for me to desist. There are other metabolic enhancers that cause vasiodilation.
Pyritinol,speculatively could have some dangers in higher dose through pathway Pyridoxine toxicity, requires high as dose

#11 Heisenberg

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Posted 21 July 2010 - 11:44 AM

I doubt you will be able to replace Modafinil with any of the substances suggested. Seriously, re-ordering may be your most successful and time-sensitive option, unless you have an adverse reaction to Modafinil in the first place.

#12 pheonickx

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Posted 22 July 2010 - 05:51 AM

im starting to get a feeling that there's no substance out there that enhances the effects of modafinil ......no bonnine for my clyde :( .... i was assuming thered be smthg like DMAE for Piracetam type for syngery for modafinil too :( :sad:

#13 Wylie

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Posted 22 July 2010 - 07:00 AM

im starting to get a feeling that there's no substance out there that enhances the effects of modafinil ......no bonnine for my clyde :( .... i was assuming thered be smthg like DMAE for Piracetam type for syngery for modafinil too :( :sad:


Nicotine gum. Cigs even more so, but obviously an even worse idea.

Seriously, no nootropic will even come close in enhancing modafinil like Nicotine. I can not only personally attest to this, but it makes perfect sense; the mild dopamine release of modafinil with the reuptake effects of the nicotine...

Gum by itself will never be as addictive as cigs but this is still something to be careful with. I've not been a regular smoker for years, but with those, the addict will crave a smoke and at least know their mood is effected and why. With the gum, I find that I never crave it; as a result I'll start to become moody and won't realize it.

So, there's your answer. :D The best potentiator you could ask for, but it's a really bad idea.... just order more. :D
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#14 kbal

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Posted 22 July 2010 - 04:57 PM

Nicotine patches are quite expensive, I snort. Snuffing tobacco is pleasurable, lots of flavors, cheap :)
Nasal cancer? Can't find much evidence, but not a lot of people use snuff, hopefully my nose won't fall off :(
But you do look like an junkie- snuffing brown powder. If somebody asks me what is that I'm doing, I just reply that I'm snuffing brown cocaine :)

#15 pheonickx

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Posted 23 July 2010 - 05:33 AM

agreed .....i do smoke up when on modafinil and yes it does help

but where is my magic syngergy!!!! no thelma to my louise? :sad: :sad:

#16 pheonickx

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Posted 23 July 2010 - 05:43 AM

and since this keeps coming up over and over and over again : NO I CANNOT BUY MORE IM FLAT EFFIN BROKE!

#17 dilenja

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Posted 23 July 2010 - 05:57 AM

Some individuals have subjectively reported synergies with Straterra. I'm unable to report specifics now but a quick google search should provide more information if interested

#18 Animal

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Posted 23 July 2010 - 05:40 PM

and since this keeps coming up over and over and over again : NO I CANNOT BUY MORE IM FLAT EFFIN BROKE!


Then how do you expect to buy a potentiator? Most of the substances mentioned in this thread are fairly expensive.

#19 zeropoint

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Posted 23 July 2010 - 06:33 PM

I'm in a similiar situ, what I do is take the very least possible(100 mg.), always drink coffee(caffiene) with it in as a big quantity as possible, and sometimes take bioperine with it(a black pepper extract that is sold for using with vitamin supplements to increase absorbtion). L-tyrosine and n-acetyl-tyrosine help also as would L and DL-phenylalanine supps, but not sure how to time these supps for optimal potentiation,would probably be different for everyone. Of course only use the modafinil when absolutely necessary,not everyday. Take it only before a long planned study session and don't let anyone disturb and waste your valuable "enhanced" study time,something I learned the hard way(ppl stopping by wanting to BS and all and next thing you know hours flew out the window,learn how to say NO!)
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#20 NR2(x)

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 10:47 AM

Donepezil and modafinil are an extreme mixture. I would liken it the 'Red Pill' from the matrix, You can intergrate ideas very easily, episodic memory and working memory are strongly enhanced. It will test your emotional stability etc, you've been warned, you will feel like a farmed product and you might learn things that you cannot deal with.
I would not use more 1.5mg donepezil in any 24hour period, 5mg ed will make you depressed and sick.

The Article on Sciencedirect; Botox for the brain: enhancement of cognition.
2. Cognitive enhancement
2.1. Currently available enhancers
2.1.1. Donepezil
2.1.2. Modafinil
2.1.3. Dopamine agonists: d-amphetamine, bromocriptine and pergolide
2.1.4. Guanfacine
2.1.5. Methylphenidate
(I believe this maybe a ranked list)


5. General principles of enhancement
5.1. The inverted U-shape
5.1.1. Non-linear dose response curves
5.1.2. Baseline dependency
5.2. Trade-offs
5.2.1. Long-term memory versus working memory
5.2.2. Stability versus flexibility of long-term memory
5.2.3. Stability versus flexibility of working memory
5.2.4. Cognition versus mood
5.3. Summary
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#21 waldemar

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 11:30 AM

I think I read somewhere that milk thistle decreases the enzymes that break down modafinil. Has anyone seen this somewhere?

#22 pheonickx

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 07:49 AM

---- :excl: THE RED PILL :excl: ---

OMG!! this be hella exciting! :D ........okay pple gear up ..my posting my results soon! :|o
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#23 pheonickx

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 07:50 AM

forgot to mention the red pill is donezepil and modafinil taken together

i might ace the USMLE after all :ph34r:

#24 chilp

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 10:36 AM

Sodium Oxybate, otherwise known as GHB, might be the answer.

http://www.drugs.com...um-oxybate.html

Sodium oxybate is a central nervous system depressant. It is used to treat cataplexy (sudden loss of muscle strength) and reduce daytime sleepiness in patients with narcolepsy.


A recent study, but no abstract :-(

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/20643579









#25 Animal

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 05:19 PM

forgot to mention the red pill is donezepil and modafinil taken together

i might ace the USMLE after all :ph34r:


Why do you think an acetylcholinesterase inhibitor is going to potentiate modafinil? Besides there are more effective and cheaper ACE inhibitors available.

#26 Imagination

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 07:12 PM

What nootropic effects do you actually get from it though? I have only tried it the once and felt awake but nothing really in the nootropic sense, a 30 minute nap in the afternoon seems to works the same way. I may try it again but have not really had a chance, don't really like experimenting on work days encase I react badly!

#27 Animal

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 11:41 PM

What nootropic effects do you actually get from it though? I have only tried it the once and felt awake but nothing really in the nootropic sense, a 30 minute nap in the afternoon seems to works the same way. I may try it again but have not really had a chance, don't really like experimenting on work days encase I react badly!


Personally I think it only exhibits significantly noticeable effects on those who suffer from fatigue. If you are healthy in this regard it won't feel like more then a cup of coffee since it promotes wakefulness rather then stimulates. Some people have a completely unrealistic expectation of modafinil, as if it'll affect them like amphetamine or something. :|?

#28 pheonickx

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Posted 27 July 2010 - 08:27 AM

for me modafinil is like IT .. mostly becuase im beaten down with all the study ...more like always raping my brain with overstudy.

plus the concept of - :excl: THE RED PILL :excl:- (whatever the mechanics of AchE and modafinil synergy) seem worth investigating :wub:
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#29 NR2(x)

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Posted 28 July 2010 - 05:09 AM

Donepezil mediates AChe inhibition through sigma-1 agonism(stimulant), search sigma-1 and depression to findout the implications of this. Notice a modified "methyldopamine"?. RED PILL

Modafinil has shown a strong ability to enhance intelligence in people with an IQ below 140. The improvements are chiefly in working memory and tend not to be noticed by the individual. The enhancement is chiefly through dopamine like effects. source;american air force studies

Edited by NR2(x), 28 July 2010 - 05:19 AM.


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#30 Animal

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Posted 28 July 2010 - 01:25 PM

So if you have an IQ above 140 you'll not notice any statistically significant improvements in cognitive ability? That's not fair, it should have a proportional effect resulting in people with greater intelligence getting a comparatively greater boost in intellect!

Then again if you have an IQ over 140 you can't really complain too much. :cool:
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