6 replies to this topic

[malbecman]

Another in vivo study with rats at equivalent pharmacological doses.  Clear increase in aerobic capacity which many of us have reported.  Also some increases in telomere length and telomerase activity but
no apparent effect on lifespan despite these increases.  Hmmm....


Atherosclerosis. 2012 Jun 26. [Epub ahead of print]
Red wine and equivalent oral pharmacological doses of resveratrol delay vascular aging but do not extend life span in rats.

da Luz PL, Tanaka L, Brum PC, Dourado PM, Favarato D, Krieger JE, Laurindo FR.

Source

Clinical Division, Heart Institute (Incor), School of Medicine, University of São Paulo, SP, Brazil; Genetic and Molecular Cardiology Laboratory, Heart Institute (Incor), School of Medicine, University of São Paulo, SP, Brazil; Vascular Biology Laboratory, Heart Institute (Incor), School of Medicine, University of São Paulo, SP, Brazil.

Abstract

OBJECTIVE:

To investigate, in male Wistar rats, the effects of long-term moderate red wine (RW) consumption (equivalent to ∼0.15 mg% resveratrol RS), or RS in low (L, 0.15 mg%) or high (H, 400 mg%) doses in chow.
BACKGROUND:

Both RW and RS exhibit cardioprotection. RS extends lifespan in obese rats. It is unclear whether RW consumption or low-dose RS delay vascular aging and prolong life span in the absence of overt risk factors.
METHODS:

Endpoints were aerobic performance, exercise capacity, aging biomarkers (p53,p16,p21, telomere length and telomerase activity in aortic homogenates), vascular reactivity. Data were compared with controls © given regular chow.

RESULTS:

Expressions of p53 decreased ∼50% ∼with RW and LRS (p < 0.05 vs. C), p16 by ∼29% with RW (p < 0.05 vs. C) and p21 was unaltered. RW and LRS increased telomere length >6.5-fold vs. C, and telomerase activity increased with LRS and HRS. All treatments increased aerobic capacity (C 32.5 ± 1.2, RW 38.7 ± 1.7, LRS 38.5 ± 1.6, HRS 38.3 ± 1.8 mlO(2) min(-1) kg(-1)), and RW or LRS also improved time of exercise tolerance vs. C (p < 0.05). Endothelium-dependent relaxation improved with all treatments vs. C. Life span, however, was unaltered with each treatment vs. C = 673 ± 30 days, p = NS.
CONCLUSIONS:

RW and LRS can preserve vascular function indexes in normal rats, although not extending life span. These effects were translated into better aerobic performance and exercise capacity.
Copyright © 2012 Elsevier Ireland Ltd. All rights reserved. PMID: 22818625

[scottknl]

Going strictly by the numbers it looks as if both red wine and resveratrol suppress "tumor suppressor" genes.   In humans, wouldn't you expect more cancers because of P53 and p16 suppression?

In the wild you would expect mice to use their new found athletic abilities to find more food compared to controls and thus cancel out any benefit that might naturally accrue from a lean diet.

[niner]

It's hard to say how much wine they got, since it was based on the resveratrol content.  I hope it's more clear in the paper.  The comparison might make one think that resveratrol was the "active ingredient" in red wine, which wouldn't be correct, IMHO.  Interesting that the low dose resveratrol does so well.  In my entire life, I don't recall ever seeing the unit "mg %".  Anyone know what they mean by that?

[Hebbeh]

scottknl, on 24 July 2012 - 09:53 PM, said:

Going strictly by the numbers it looks as if both red wine and resveratrol suppress "tumor suppressor" genes.   In humans, wouldn't you expect more cancers because of P53 and p16 suppression?

In the wild you would expect mice to use their new found athletic abilities to find more food compared to controls and thus cancel out any benefit that might naturally accrue from a lean diet.

P53 was only decreased by red wine and low dose resveratrol and P16 decreased only with red wine....so sounds like high dose resveratrol is the way to go.  It's been known for some time that resveratrol has differing effects at low vs high dosing.  Maybe I need to up my gram/day.  And mice are foragers and scavengers eating seeds, etc...and as such, won't be using any energy or athletic ability "running" down their food like a carnivore.

[scottknl]

Hebbeh, on 25 July 2012 - 03:20 AM, said:

scottknl, on 24 July 2012 - 09:53 PM, said:

Going strictly by the numbers it looks as if both red wine and resveratrol suppress "tumor suppressor" genes.   In humans, wouldn't you expect more cancers because of P53 and p16 suppression?

In the wild you would expect mice to use their new found athletic abilities to find more food compared to controls and thus cancel out any benefit that might naturally accrue from a lean diet.

P53 was only decreased by red wine and low dose resveratrol and P16 decreased only with red wine....so sounds like high dose resveratrol is the way to go.  It's been known for some time that resveratrol has differing effects at low vs high dosing.  Maybe I need to up my gram/day.  And mice are foragers and scavengers eating seeds, etc...and as such, won't be using any energy or athletic ability "running" down their food like a carnivore.

Too bad I can't up my resveratrol similarly.  I find that I get sore ankle tendons if I go much over 50 mg per day.  However, that small amount helps me stay at or very near my personal best times for 10Km running (~45 min@age 46), so it ain't all bad.  

I'd suggest that endurance is significantly increased with resveratrol supplementation and that might encourage  the mice to scavenge over a wider range to find food, and thus the benefit.

[Hebbeh]

Yes, I was experiencing some joint issues with resveratrol and it has been my experience that it is caused by lowered estrogen due to the suppression of aromatase by resveratrol.  When I added 50 mg of DHEA which readily aromatases into estrogen, the joint issues disappeared.

[fruitlover]

Hebbeh, on 25 July 2012 - 06:38 PM, said:

Yes, I was experiencing some joint issues with resveratrol and it has been my experience that it is caused by lowered estrogen due to the suppression of aromatase by resveratrol.  When I added 50 mg of DHEA which readily aromatases into estrogen, the joint issues disappeared.

Thank you for this info. I am beginning to take my resveratrol supplement as advised by my doctor and I also encounter joint pains most of the time. At least I know what questions to ask my doctor since I have a checkup again tomorrow. I will ask if it's fine to add DHEA to my prescriptions and won't give me any side effects.