10 replies to this topic

[brainslugged]

So, I have have tried Ritalin 2 times this week, Tuesday and Thursday, in the form of 36mg concerta, once in the morning.

It works too well, and I think I may be getting high from it, but I don't know. Supposedly 36mg is about like 8-10mg in constant, 10-hr form, so I wouldn't think it would be this way, but let me describe the symptoms/effects.

1. Very little social anxiety, almost gone. No more than a normal person's.
2. I kinda feel important or something. Kinda like IDGAF, but not too strongly. I just don't really care as much what others thing or something, I feel like I can screw up because who cares or something, I am pretty cool. hard to explain. Not so much that I feel like I am amazing, but something.
3. VERY productive. Almost too much. People abuse stims to be more productive, and I can't tell if this is stims or if the work was just easy all along and I was too screwed up to do it right.
4. No confusion, like ever.
5. I paradoxically feel sleepy and alert, like when I take the pseudoephedrine, but more on the sleepy side. Kinda like I could fall asleep instantly if I felt like it. I know the "ADHD people get tired on stims because they affect them different" is BS, so I am not trying to imply that. I think maybe this means the dosage is too high. My friend said they make him a zombie when he takes 2 (what is instructed), so I figure that this is that? I haven't actually tried to fall asleep on them because I don't want to waste any, but I may try for science!
6. There is better willpower. I can just think "okay, I think I will do homework for an hour and then play for an an hour", and... I actually do it. I dunno, it is weird. I was thinking "hey, I should probably clean my car because it is pretty filthy", and I just went inside and got a trashbag and cleaned it out. Just like it was nothing, like "hey, somebody's got to do it, why not". But NORMAL people dread cleaning their car, right? I mean, this is abnormal to not mind.
7. Learning/doing complex things is more fun. I was having a blast listening to my programming online lectures for class. Everything was more interesting. Didn't really apply for stats which is just boring, but I
8. The internet isn't as fun. I don't know. I only opened like 5 new tabs in an hour. I don't have as much ability to find interesting things which kinda sucks, but I guess individual things being more interesting kinda makes up for it.

The crash is kinda meh. The first time, it was pretty bad and I had a headache, but I was told it was because I only drank one softdrink the whole day, and that I have to drink more than normal, and so I drank some extra water the 2nd time, and it didn't happen. I am less productive on the crash/comedown (I don't know where one ends and the other starts, it is around 9 or 10 hours after taking it), and more scattered, but not too bad or anything. I do feel more tired than usual afterwards, but I think that is to be expected.

There is kinda a constant comfortable feeling. Is that normal, or is it being high or something? I mean, normally you sit there and ache kinda where you are sitting or whatever, you know? But I am pretty sure I could just lean a car seat back and chill on ritalin. Hard desks still aren't very comfy, but way more stuff is.

I don't know. I have done almost all the work for the rest of the semester in my compsci class now (from being behind by a week), and I talked to people today (not close to extrovert, but I had a few conversations with spoken words) and went to have lunch with my lab class without getting nervous the whole time. I did lab without even being confused at all the whole time. It was just one of the easiest things in the world, and it doesn't even make sense now how I was confused before. When I am on it, it seems like "WTF, I don't need this stuff to be able to work like this. Why don't I just do this normally. I don't need it anymore now that I know how to do it," but then, like now, when it wears off, I feel the feeling again of why I can't work like that.

It just seems like, most people don't do that much work, and I don't think they feel that comfortable, but with the work, it just feels like "I got the time, might as well". But obviously most people don't have the willpower to do that sort of thing or everyone would just make perfect on everything. So, what do I do about that? Should I reduce the dosage?

I am a bit confused by the anti-anxiety and sleepy stuff, because I thought that amphetamine was the one that made people more extroverted, and ritalin pretty much made everyone more anxious. Even my friend with diagnosed ADHD said that ritalin makes him nervous, and if anyone in the world is ADHD, it is him. I DO KNOW it's concerta, not a benzo, which I was kinda worried about with the sleepy feeling and anti-anxiety (of course, a benzo wouldn't give you more concentration). I am 100% sure it is concerta. Maybe I just have a screwed up adrenergic system like someone said in my pse post. I didn't test my BP or heart rate, but it didn't feel high.

I don't know. Even though I don't feel high, is this like semi-abuse levels? There isn't any euphoria (not even on the level of pseudoephedrine) I may take apart a pill and titrate it to lower doses since I don't have a .001g scale. I love the productivity, but it is kinda scaring me. I've rarely ever gotten work done ahead of time in my life, and now I am a month ahead in a class from 2 days. I mean, is this right? Is it healthy to do this good? I feel like if it is working this good, I am maybe taking too much, but how low should I cut it to? 5mg IR?

I want to go to a psych and tell them and get their advice, but I think they would frown upon my self-medding. It's a shame I will probably have to act to get medicine. I can try honestly first I guess. I am rambling now, really tired (past time to sleep, so I guess that is expected).

[waldemar]

I know the will power effect very well!

Try to reduce the dosage to 10 mg daily, 36 mg is way too much.
If 10 mg are not enough you can try to increase it to 15 or 20. Either take everything in the morning, or split it up 50:50 between morning or lunch.

[matthewebbert]

Yes Agree 36 mg too much its better to try with 15mg..

[xEva]

brainslug, how do you self-med a schedule 2 drug? I wanna try it too

[brainslugged]

In lieu of the fact that ritalin and pse have the pro-sleep effect. I think I may try guanfacine or another alpha-2 agonist. That may help with the uncomfortable feeling when trying to sleep.

I need to see a doc about this, but I have so much anxiety that just talking to a doctor makes me feel like "screw this, never mind, I want to get out of here", and I can't even think about what is actually wrong. It is the worse when they give you that "what's wrong?" look. I feel like I need to say "oh, nevermind, there isn't a problem, ha ha. I don't even know why I am here. I must just be exaggerating everything in my mind or something, I'll be leaving now, sorry for wasting your time." (which is basically what I told to my GP). I will have to go to a psych on ritalin to not have the anxiety, but then I will be the oposite of ADHD, sigh. Maybe alpha-2 agonism will help.

I know the will power effect very well!

Try to reduce the dosage to 10 mg daily, 36 mg is way too much.
If 10 mg are not enough you can try to increase it to 15 or 20. Either take everything in the morning, or split it up 50:50 between morning or lunch.

Yes Agree 36 mg too much its better to try with 15mg..

Sounds good. I will try that. However, in the long term, from a psych, the only lower dose is 18mg/day if it is concerta. IRs seems like a PITA, but I guess I could deal with it. To clarify, I took 36mg concerta, which, from what I understand is like being at a constant peak from 10mg IR medicine. Still, 10mg could be to much. 5mg 2 times daily seems like a good thing to try. Now that I think about it, though, playing with dosage seems pointless since I won't be able to tell a psych the dosage .

brainslug, how do you self-med a schedule 2 drug? I wanna try it too

Well, I am not planning on consistently self-medding with it. I don't LIKE breaking the law (and don't have anywhere to keep getting it from for that matter). I mean that psychs wouldn't appreciate my trying it and all the nootropics/general attitude, lol. Everyone (my GP) wants to give me SSRIs, and I am certainly not going to look insane by spouting my crap about why I don't want SSRIs and how they are dangerous. But why ask me, not the people who try to self-med with schedule 1 drugs . IMHO, the schedules for drugs is a joke. Benzos are considered low potential for physical dependence...

[IA87]

I am prescribed concerta 45 (27 + 18) mg. What you are feeling is a weak high that occurs for many people for the first few weeks. It goes away, although the positive effects deteriorate somewhat as well.

[ithinkican]

In my youth I was prescribed Ritilian for about five years. 20mg time release and a 10mg normal eventually caused me some emotional and self control issues but that took a few years of constant use, weaning my self off of the ritilian was also a difficult process. for any long term use beware of dopaminergic neurons being damaged. aka the body can't regulate dopamine itself anymore

thanks for the excellent post

[Bron]

brainslug, how do you self-med a schedule 2 drug? I wanna try it too

Never been to a university huh?

Kids sell their meds all the time.

[Reformed-Redan]

I'd rather use TDCS long term. Cheaper and safer long term.

[brainslugged]

So, I have tried it a bit more, this time for 3 days in a row, sat, sun(both in the morning and a few hours before bed), mon. I also took it wed and today.

The initial "high" has pretty much died, and the side effects are more apparent. I can see how someone would not like it, the main things are

• Boredom with free time, although I am still content to do SOME kinds of work, mostly just the stuff I am interested in like programming. The boredom comes from not generating as many things to do. I have no real urges to look random things up or anything like that. I don't feel as much wanting to open new tabs or look at every link I see. I also don't write much on it. I haven't posted on forums while it was in me. I always have other things to do.
• It kills music. I don't even bother to listen to it normally on the Ritalin. It just sucks with the Ritalin, and it doesn't make much sense to me, but it does. The imagery[?] goes away, and it doesn't seem as pleasing in some way. Not too big of a deal, though for me. I can see how this would be a really big deal for some people.
• Empty, soul-less(metaphorical, of course) feeling. This is the worst part, and very hard to describe, but it doesn't happen ALL the time. So far, it seems like tyrosine may help this, but I need more experiments to really now.
• A certain type of tiredness maybe related to the empty feeling. Kinda a mind-blurriness if that makes sense. Have you ever used the sponge-tool in those "fun" image editors, you know, where it kinda greys everything and makes it blurry? Like the above, it doesn't happen all the time, and it doesn't really get in the way, it is just unpleasant. I suspect it may be due to the dosage being too high or some kinda of dopamine depletion since it happens most around the middle of the effects or during the later parts of it.

Overall, however, my experience with it is good. I am very surprised, actually, considering how much people seem to hate ritalin. It REALLY helps me to get things done and be able to focus, and that is the most important thing right now.

Social anxiety effects are still present, but a bit altered. The increased confidence is pretty much gone. There is some social anxiety that has returned, but it seems to be leveled out at a relatively low amount of anxiety. Mostly, the mind-racing is gone when talking to people. Although it is still difficult, there is not the definite impairment that normally happens where I feel like my mind is just going to collapse in on itself. Nor do I feel the need to get away. It is a bit easier to talk, especially if spoken to first. It is surprisingly easy to make verbal responses.

The deep uncomfortableness around others is the main aspect of social anxiety that remains. This would probably be best fixed by actual therapy or exposure; I don't think a drug is likely to fix it. The ritalin notably helps me socialize in spite of this, however.

It is still easier to do every day tasks, which mostly just includes small organizational things like throwing away things and washing dishes after I use them. Not as effortless as the first few times I took it, but it has stayed at a steady mild improvement.

There is still a moderate level of mood variability. Normally, I have cycles, not anywhere close to bipolar, but mostly swinging between avoidant and schizoid behaviors. The underlining swing is still there, and last night + this morning, I was in a swing to a very active/good(avoidant) mood, although that was pretty much killed by my dog, who is already very old and small, eating an entire bag of M&Ms and subsequently having a lot of stomach problems and general hyperactivity/shakiness. I thought he was going to die (was just at the vet's office a week ago, and they were saying they would probably have to put him down soon due to his age and that he was in a fragile state, and that euthanasia would probably be the best option if anything else went wrong(it was stomach problems at the time, but he recovered)), but he fortunately seems to be okay. It still killed the mood, and it was right when I was coming down, too. Mood cycles in general seem to be mostly unaffected by it, and I am glad that it is not causing hypomania or anything.


Our insurance is changing soon, and I hope to go to a psych in the near future.

I'd rather use TDCS long term. Cheaper and safer long term.

I don't know if I would say it is safer. There isn't a ton of data on tDCS, and ritalin seems to be a fairly safe drug. It is mildly toxic and changes the brain some, but that is to be expected from a dopaminergic, and I would say that the benefits so far outweigh the price. The lessening of stress caused by the ritalin probably helps me more than the drug hurts.

TDCS is very interesting, though. I am trying to keep an eye on it. I am still interested in alternatives, but I am doubting the effectiveness of tDCS in place of stimulants. Only time will tell. I will certainly try it out when it reaches the consumer market, but I don't have enough faith to try to build one myself. I have electrocuted myself quite a few times (mostly touching exposed computer parts, lol) and don't really trust myself to build something that will pass a current through my brain when I tend to unknowingly screw up triggers and read the resistor bands wrongly :D

In my youth I was prescribed Ritilian for about five years. 20mg time release and a 10mg normal eventually caused me some emotional and self control issues but that took a few years of constant use, weaning my self off of the ritilian was also a difficult process. for any long term use beware of dopaminergic neurons being damaged. aka the body can't regulate dopamine itself anymore

thanks for the excellent post

That is very unfortunate. I don't understand, though, if you had ADHD, I would imagine that the emotional or self-control issues were already present? Anyway, I don't agree with giving stimulants to a child in most cases. I wish you the best of luck.

I am prescribed concerta 45 (27 + 18) mg. What you are feeling is a weak high that occurs for many people for the first few weeks. It goes away, although the positive effects deteriorate somewhat as well.

I feel like it has mostly deteriorated for me. Most good effects have been stable for this school week.

Thanks for the responses, everyone!

[medievil]

When i was taking just the prescribed doses of dex i seemed a bit hypomanic myself weeks ago, dont have that reaction right now tough, didnt fully read the thread so not saying your hypomanic but it can happen.