11 replies to this topic

[calm--]

Hey guys, I've been taking aniracetam for about 6 weeks, and piracetam for about 4 weeks. I am still experimenting with dosage, but mostly my dosage is 800 mg piracetam and 750mg aniracetam, both twice a day, around breakfast and lunch. Without choline, because I've tried some choline source and they made feel crappy (choline bitartrate, alcar, cdp-choline).

I really like the effects of both nootropic, but I've been having problem with sleep since I started piracetam (I think ani didn't cause the sleep problem). While usually I could sleep for 7-8 hours, now I could only sleep for 5 hours. I have no problem going to sleep, but after 5 hours, I woke up and couldn't sleep again.

At first, I could still function pretty well, but days after days I slept on 5 hours, I got weaker and weaker. And the "good feeling" I got from the racetams diminished each days, probably because of the lack of sleep. Even when I feel tired, I can't fall asleep when I tried to take a nap. I have to be really really tired before I could fall asleep on my nap, but it usually don't last long.

I'm hoping I don't have to drop the piracetam. Is there anyway I could still sleep for 7-8 hours while still taking piracetam? Is it possible this happened because I didn't take choline?

I'm thinking of adding something to my bedtime stack, to make me sleep longer, but I'm not sure what. Some people mention L-Tryptophan for sleep so I'm thinking about it. I've tried adding 100 mg L-Theanine at bedtime, but I still woke up after 5 hours.

Right now these are my stack :

- Morning : 800 mg pira, 750mg ani, 200 mg calcium, 1 cap AOR Multi Basic, 2000 IU vitamin D3, 1 gram fish oil (500 epa, 250 dha), 600mg NAC
- Lunch : 800 mg pira, 750mg ani
- Dinner : 1 gram fish oil (500 epa, 250 dha), 600mg NAC
- Bedtime : 450mg ashwagandha, 500mg bacopa, 400mg magnesium citrate, 1 cap solaray sleep blend (400 mg of valerian and hops)

Edited by Susilo Saja, 16 July 2013 - 05:28 AM.

[JohnnyP]

Try and use some extra energy exercising throughout the day.

[Tom_]

Take the racetams as early in the day as possible.

Long acting sedative at night. L-typtophan at 1-2grams would work.

[calm--]

Thanks guys. I'm ordering L-tryptophan now. I used to exercise quite a lot, but since I was only able to sleep 5 hours, my body feels weak, and it made me don't feel like doing exercise. But yeah, I totally agree exercise made a very good sleep.

[lehm]

Did you get it work for you or whats new?

[calm--]

I've tried adding sleeping pills like L-theanine, L-trytophan, Source Naturals NightRest, Irwin Power to Sleep. They helped me sleep a bit longer, but it's still not enough. The one containing melatonin even made me groggy the day after.

I've tried adding L-Glutamine, and it seems to make the effects of racetam stronger, but it made me more anxious and irritated.

Finally I found what make my sleep normal again : DMAE and Alpha-Gpc. After adding DMAE, I could slept for 6-7 hours. Then I added Alpha-GPC together with DMAE, and I could slept for 7-8 hours. I took 250mg DMAE and 300mg GPC in the morning. They also seems to make me calmer and improve my mood. Taking the second pill of dmae or gpc later in the day made me depressed.

Since dmae and gpc are choline source, I don't know if the sleep deprivation is caused by not taking choline. People usually mentioned headache as side-effects of not taking choline with racetam, but I don't get any headache.

It doesn't matter what time I took the racetams. I could take in the evening and I'm still fine.

Exercise also helped.

[Deep Thought]

Deprenyl, l-tyrosine and dlpa taken in the afternoon improves the quality of my sleep. For what it's worth.

Melatonin gives me vivid dreams - as in there's a movie running through my head all night long. Several lucid dreams each night involving splits and kung-fu fighting, double jumping in midair and all kinds of crazy. Only happens in doses larger than 5 mg.

[lehm]

Interesting.
When I supplemented with Higher Nature - Advance Brain Nutrient, which includes 260mg Choline (bitartrate) per dosage then week or so later I found myself to sleep 5-6hours as well, rather than usual 9h.

edit: when I dosed 2g aniracetam just for two days, I had rather long headache which I usually do not have. but I might caught a flu so I test it later again and if I still get it, then I'll add Choline.

Edited by lehm, 10 December 2013 - 11:28 AM.

[Ark]

Try tapering down your dosage of Piracetam, consider magnesium and 5 Htp.

[Deep Thought]

Deprenyl, l-tyrosine and dlpa taken in the afternoon improves the quality of my sleep. For what it's worth.

Melatonin gives me vivid dreams - as in there's a movie running through my head all night long. Several lucid dreams each night involving splits and kung-fu fighting, double jumping in midair and all kinds of crazy. Only happens in doses larger than 5 mg.

I should probably write something that has relevance to the OP in future posts...

5-HTP, zinc, magnesium, and exercise will prolong and positively influence your sleep quality. A good diet with plenty of potassium is also very helpful in this regard.

Do you want to sleep longer or better OP, or both?

[calm--]

Deprenyl, l-tyrosine and dlpa taken in the afternoon improves the quality of my sleep. For what it's worth.

Melatonin gives me vivid dreams - as in there's a movie running through my head all night long. Several lucid dreams each night involving splits and kung-fu fighting, double jumping in midair and all kinds of crazy. Only happens in doses larger than 5 mg.

I should probably write something that has relevance to the OP in future posts...

5-HTP, zinc, magnesium, and exercise will prolong and positively influence your sleep quality. A good diet with plenty of potassium is also very helpful in this regard.

Do you want to sleep longer or better OP, or both?

Actually my sleep problem with racetams has go away, but thanks . The ones that brought my sleep back to normal are DMAE and Alpha-GPC.

[calm--]

After a couple months of continuous use of these racetams, the side-effects started creeping up again. Only able to sleep 5 hours, anxiety, irritability. I increased Alpha-gpc from 1 capsule of 300mg to 2 capsules, but it's not helping. I added 50 mcg Huperzine A and it didn't help either. They might help reduce brainfog, but they didn't get rid of the side-effects.

So I stop these racetams today, and I feel calmer. I miss the good effects of these racetams though. Anyone know what is causing these side-effects or how to counteract them would be great.

I have always take 400 mg magnesium citrate every night (now's brand). 5-htp seems to make me irritable the next day so I stop using it after a couple days.