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Dasatinib group buy from Nyles

dasatinib senolytic senescent scenescent cells sasp senolytics group buy

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#571 Longevitarian

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Posted Today, 12:45 AM

Just to add explanation to my previous posting: Vitamin D is neccessary for apoptosis

to be executed. No Vitamin D No Apoptosis of your senescent cells. This is why people

with low Vit D get more cancer.

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#572 jmorris

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Posted Today, 05:11 AM

I just found this human clinical trial using dasatinib and quercetin . I guess they think that quercetin is promising enough in humans to use it in a trial, which is reassuring.

The dosage is dasatinib 100 mg and quercetin 1000 mg for 3 consecutive days.



When I started graduate school almost twenty years ago one of the things I remember most was journal club. In journal club, us green Ph.D. students would sit with a wise professor for an hour and hear them dissect and lambaste paper after paper. This was a valuable process. It took years of this and many years further of running my own failed experiments for me to really understand what I now know was the central point of the process. Graduate school was not about learning how to run experiments. Nope. Nor was it to learn the names of 30 enzyme pathways or 5,000 proteins. Rather, it was about learning how to be skeptical. That is what truly separated us graduate students from the professors who were teaching us. "It is the illusion of knowledge that is the obstacle to discovery." Try saying that a few times. Let it sink in. Just because you want something to be true does not make it so. In fact, due to bias it makes it less likely. That's a concept that is exceedingly hard to grok for most people. And just because something is written in a paper, that does not mean it is true. You have to educate yourself and read very, very carefully. In fact, a large proportion of papers should never have been approved by reviewers in the first place. 


But how can you tell? You need to look at many things:


First and foremost, start with the assumption that everything you are going to read is wrong.


Next, In what journal is the paper published? (Some journals have good reviewers and some are rubber stamps. As much as I hate the idea of the journal "impact factor", it does help to separate the wheat from the chaff.)


Who wrote the paper? What is their background? Are they a Ph.D. or an M.D. or an M.D. PH.D? (I know this sounds ad hominem but MD's typically have a shallow understanding of the science behind things and are (perversely) good at getting funding. I think that's why "The Lancet" exists, to give them someplace to save face after being rejected from Nature, Science and Cell.)


What is the evidence they give? Here's a tip: If you are short on time, don't bother reading the results section, instead look first at the tables and figures. With practice, you can save yourself a lot of time in invalidating a paper. (I learned this trick from one of my old professors.)


If the paper still looks good, what are the specific methods? Are there any limitations to their techniques? (This is going to be hard for those of you who have never worked in a lab but it's really a worthwhile endeavor. Look up the methods in wikipedia.)


How do they statistically treat the data? There are many ways to "cook" data to make it look better, some more obvious than others.


But what we have here is not even a paper. An MD at Mayo Clinic has gotten funding from someplace to run a trial.


No data. No statistical methods. No evidence whatsoever.


So in this case the level of evidence is not even zero. They have not gotten to the evidence part yet. So while you may find it reassuring that this trial exists, in the immortal words of Wolfgang Pauli: "It's not even wrong." 


I hope you all understand that I don't get any prize from being right. Quite the contrary, arguing against a commonly held belief is going to do nothing but make people not like me. In 99% of situations, in spite of having knowledge that contradicts others I just keep my mouth shut. Because, who cares, right? If someone thinks that vitamin C is going to make them live forever, awesome. One more happy person on earth.


But as little as I know you all, I still feel a certain level of belonging here. We all share the same irrational, quixotic goal. I have the advantage of having spent my life in science but most of you (presumably) don't. It's my duty as a scientist to spread knowledge. Watching you all share what I believe is a false hope makes me sad. Hence, my decision to speak up. (It is also distracting you all from moving on to the next most promising thing, likely navitoclax or something like it.)


This will likely be the last I write or speak of this subject. If you all want to take quercetin orally, that's cool with me. I wish you the best. I can sleep soundly knowing I have done my best to quash this bit of well-meaning misinformation.


FWIW, I have contacted Dr. Hickson and inquired into her logic behind the dosing in this trial. If she tells me some information that invalidates this position, even just a bit or even just in kidneys I'll happily post it here immediately.

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Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: dasatinib, senolytic, senescent, scenescent cells, sasp, senolytics, group buy

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