5 replies to this topic

[RichardAlan]

I'm confused between these two and that's partly because I'm really new to this and only just started looking into benefits.  Has anyone had experience with these (I believe the NAD+ might be new).  Would appreciate any suggestions that people might have.  Thanks

[able]

I can’t speak to the tablets, as I only tried the NMN ones a short while, and didn’t care for them much, and I personally find the powder much more effective.  I have used their NMN powder for 9 months.  I used the NAD+ powder by itself for about a month, but am using both now.

 

I have had great response in exercise performance with the NMN, and now keep up with the young guys in my cross-fit class.  That seems to fit with the latest research by Dr Sinclair showing doubled endurance in mice, due to new blood vessel growth in old mice.    

 

In one month, I didn’t notice any difference from using the NAD+ vs NMN, except that the NAD+ is much more stimulative. 

 

Closest thing I can compare it to is, back when epinephrine was still legal.  I find 500 mg in one serving is way too much - heart rate goes up about 10+ bpm.  The NMN doesn’t have that strong, immediate stimulus.

 

Whether the NAD+ has some of the other benefits as NMN may depend on how easily NAD+ crosses the cellular membrane, as is being discussed in other threads here.

 

Dr Brenner states unequivocally that NR is the largest molecule that can cross the cell membrane, and NMN or NAD must be broken down.  Dr Sinclair and others disagree.

 

 

Exogenous Nicotinamide Adenine Dinucleotide Regulates Energy Metabolism via Hypothalamic Connexin 43

 

Effects of Chronic NAD Supplementation on Energy Metabolism and Diurnal Rhythm in Obese Mice

 

 

These 2 studies show that NAD+ does in fact readily enter the hypothalamus to directly increase NAD+ levels and have a dramatic effect on energy metabolism, at a dose of only 1 mg/kg of bodyweight. 

 

“In mice, exogenous NAD may be transported to the hypothalamus via Cx43 at the blood-brain barrier thereby increasing hypothalamic NAD content and decreasing food intake and weight gain.”

 

 In fact, they state that NR an NMN cannot cross the blood brain barrier.

 

“Importantly, exogenous NMN or NR did not cross the blood-brain barrier and appeared to increase brain NAD contents by providing nicotinamide to the NAD salvage pathway.”

 

 

That may explain why NAD+ is used in clinics for neurological conditions for 50 years, according to this latest review of NAD+ by Dr Naidy Brady:

 

Quantitation of NAD+: Why do we need to measure it? (Brady, Nov2018)

 

“However, connexin 43 (Cx43) hexameric hemichannels have recently been shown to promote uptake of NAD+ across the plasma membrane using CD38 to convert NAD+ to the secondary messenger signaling molecule cyclic ADP-ribose (cADPR) “

 

“Recent studies have shown that oral administration of the NAD+ precursor nicotinamide riboside (NR) can increase whole blood NAD+ levels in humans [7-9]. However, using a direct intravenous (IV) infusion of NAD+ is likely to represent a more efficient way of increasing NAD+ levels than the indirect administration of oral supplements that act as precursors for NAD+ synthesis”

 

It will be years before we have human studies to see which supplement is best for what. 

 

My guess is, there is a reason Dr Sinclair has been able to demonstrate some of the best results for increased endurance and blood vessel growth with NMN, as that is where it really shines.  

 

NAD+ has been used for addiction and neurological treatment for decades.  I don’t believe they would get people spending $1,000s per day for such unless it had some effect for those conditions.

 

Which is why I am hedging my bets and taking both, for now. If/when Chromadex finally gets around to making a sublingual NR, I'll probably rotate that in.

 

Edited by able, 01 December 2018 - 08:05 PM.

[RichardAlan]

Can you tell me what dose you are taking at the moment?  I was considering something like this: 

 

Morning 250mg of NMN

Lunch 250mg of NAD+

Evening 250mg of NMN

 

 

 

 

 

 

[able]

I really like taking 250 mg NAD+ first thing in the morning - really wakes me up instantly.

 

I also take about 250 NAD+ before strenuous exercise 3 times a week.  I had great results from taking NMN before exercise, but the extra, instant boost from NAD+  helps more.  I reached 190 bpm on my heart rate monitor yesterday, which is only 6 bpm less than I used to see 30 years ago, and more than 10 bpm more than I was seeing last year.

 

I take NMN the rest of the time thru the day, for 1,000 to 1500 a day total, but don't take anything on weekends.

 

Edited by able, 03 December 2018 - 09:08 PM.

[Heisok]

Great information able. Did you happen to try smaller doses of NAD+ spread throughout the day?

 

I get some lift in mood with NMN in the morning. If you see more with NAD+, that will be interesting once I get around to trying it.

[PAMPAGUY]

I have been trying the following routine for about 3 weeks now and have a lot more energy.  Each squirt is about 125-150 NR.

 

LOW COST WAY TO GET NAD PRECUSSOR

NR is not stable, and taste bad with the addition of chloride. In order to get around these problems, I purchased Nicotinamide and Riboside powder. They are not NR until mixed together so no stability problem at this time. I mix 1 1/2 gm of each to make 3 gm of NR.
Mix NR in 15 ml water and add to dropper bottle. Refrigerate any remainder solution. Taste just fine because no Chloride. Taking drops sublingually for direct absorption into blood stream. Take 6-8 times a day. I have been getting very good results, increased energy. No problem taking as much as you want because cost is so low. Take a holiday on weekends.