http://news.gc.ca/cf...rticleid=213559
L
onge
C
ity
Advocacy & Research for Unlimited Lifespans
Posted 18 May 2006 - 08:18 PM
Posted 18 May 2006 - 08:20 PM
Posted 18 May 2006 - 08:30 PM
Posted 18 May 2006 - 09:00 PM
Posted 18 May 2006 - 09:16 PM
Opales you are quite hysterical and this is why often I don't care what people in ivory towers who are removed from treating people think.
Posted 18 May 2006 - 09:23 PM
"patients who have previously had a heart attack" and yet you titled this post:
"l-arginine CAUSING heart problems"
You seem to totally lack the understanding that results are only valid (if indeed the study is valid) for the patient population that was studied. This is a basic concept when evaluating studies.
Posted 18 May 2006 - 09:32 PM
I just posted a piece of news I thought people might find interesting (albeit admittedly perhaps with a bit alarmist title?
Some reasonable generalisations must be made every time research is interpreted.It's called external validity and I am very aware of it.
Posted 18 May 2006 - 09:35 PM
Posted 18 May 2006 - 09:35 PM
Ever thought recommending some proven and more researched blood pressure lowering treatment?
Posted 18 May 2006 - 11:20 PM
Posted 19 May 2006 - 01:13 AM
Posted 19 May 2006 - 01:39 AM
Actually, I think we need the Opales' of the world. They are a nice counter ballance to the wide eyed true believers. Of which I am sometimes one, though I try to maintain a healthy scepticism. Even when Opales is wrong, which he often is, he makes us examine our biases and thought processes. He makes us justify what we already believe. In the process, we often learn something new. Occasionally, we find that he was right and we were wrong. Even if he only was right one time in his whole career, he is doing a service. Keep up the work, Opales, and dig up that dirt to make us think again. The truth can never hurt us and lies will be exposed.
Not that I'm defending alarmist titles, just the general idea.
Posted 19 May 2006 - 01:46 AM
Posted 19 May 2006 - 10:38 AM
***albeit admittedly perhaps with a bit alarmist title***
You keep doing this, and you keep doing this to warn us how dangerous supps can be.
Despite the fact that you are well aware of it, you keep doing it all over the place...pregnant women, patient who start with advanced heart disease,...it goes on and on. Again all to advance your agenda of supps being potentially dangerous.
Actually, I think we need the Opales' of the world. They are a nice counter ballance to the wide eyed true believers. Of which I am sometimes one, though I try to maintain a healthy scepticism. Even when Opales is wrong, which he often is, he makes us examine our biases and thought processes. He makes us justify what we already believe. In the process, we often learn something new. Occasionally, we find that he was right and we were wrong. Even if he only was right one time in his whole career, he is doing a service. Keep up the work, Opales, and dig up that dirt to make us think again. The truth can never hurt us and lies will be exposed.
Not that I'm defending alarmist titles, just the general idea.
Posted 19 May 2006 - 01:16 PM
Posted 19 May 2006 - 01:34 PM
Opales
Listen, you’re an OK guy. But the alarmist stuff is getting on my nerves. I realize you mean well, and please do keep us on our toes and provide devil’s advocate, but perhaps you could do it in a less alarmist tone.
No Opales, nothing ever has to give. While I welcome your ideas (phrased….more gentilly if that is a word) I do not welcome you to force your ideas on me whether I like it or not. This is the specialty of a certain…flavor of political beliefs who like to force their way on everyone because they know best. I don’t like it there, and I don’t like it any better here. Whether you are right or not, no one appointed you deity and we do not ever have to believe as you do.
Posted 19 May 2006 - 10:38 PM
Posted 21 May 2006 - 02:48 PM
1. Your views stand on their own and AORsupport (who you will note ain’t alarmist and which is one of many reasons for his much greater credibility) and aspartame are irrelevant.
2. I’m not interested in arguments relating to extending lifespan as I’ve said before as that’s not why I take/recommend this stuff.
3. “As for seeking negative reports, my reasons for doing so is two-fold
a) few others are doing it.”
You must be kidding. Have you not noticed that you read weekly negative stuff about supps but when is the last time you’ve read anything in the major new sources that is positive about any supp?
4. “While I am not a medical scientist”
This is a problem. I find when I screw up and say something that ain’t true it is much more likely to be an area where I do not have personal clinical experience.
5. “There is a predominant view that "natural" supplements can do no harm.”
Again people die from drinking too much water (there was a big story on it relating to marathon runners. The overwhelming majority of supps taken in reasonable doses are unlikely to cause harm, and given that I’m 47 I think the risk to benefit ratio is more the justified.
NB: I don’t recommend aggressive supp regimens to e.g. healthy 20 year olds.
6/ Opales, you don’t get the homocysteine bit:
If homocysteine damages arteries, and we can lower it with supps, that does not mean that if we take people with arteries that are already damaged and lower their homocysteine the body can fix the arteries.
Posted 21 May 2006 - 07:56 PM
Edited by scottl, 21 May 2006 - 08:28 PM.
Posted 21 May 2006 - 10:42 PM
L-Arginine improves vascular function by overcoming deleterious effects of ADMA, a novel cardiovascular risk factor.
Boger RH, Ron ES.
Clinical Pharmacology Unit, Institute of Experimental and Clinical Pharmacology, Center of Experimental Medicine, University Hospital Hamburg-Eppendorf, Germany. boeger@uke.uni-hamburg.de.
There is abundant evidence that the endothelium plays a crucial role in the maintenance of vascular tone and structure. One of the major endothelium-derived vasoactive mediators is nitric oxide (NO), an endogenous messenger molecule formed in healthy vascular endothelium from the amino acid precursor L-arginine. Endothelial dysfunction is caused by various cardiovascular risk factors, metabolic diseases, and systemic or local inflammation. One mechanism that explains the occurrence of endothelial dysfunction is the presence of elevated blood levels of asymmetric dimethylarginine (ADMA)--an L-arginine analogue that inhibits NO formation and thereby can impair vascular function. Supplementation with L-arginine has been shown to restore vascular function and to improve the clinical symptoms of various diseases associated with vascular dysfunction.
Publication Types:
* Review
PMID: 15771559 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
Edited by zoolander, 22 May 2006 - 12:18 AM.
Posted 21 May 2006 - 11:59 PM
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