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Mitochondrial dysfunction / energy metabolism

mitochondria metabolism atp dysfunction

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#1 longcity90

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Posted 19 November 2019 - 01:59 PM

Goodmorning everyone! I hope to get help writing in this thread.
I contacted "Turnbuckle" privately but I wouldn't want to bother him too much ... so if anyone feels able to help me I would be really grateful.
I am 29 years old and I live in Italy ... country that unfortunately in front of mitochondrial pathologies and energy metabolism is not helping me as I thought.
Since childhood I developed neurological and physical disorders to which no doctor could give me an answer.
I have continuous drops and unexplained weight gains (in the last period I am only gaining weight) regardless of how much food I introduce and what is done, energy "crashes", language compromised speech difficulties, sudden and inexplicable changes of personality / mood, every day is different and I accuse strong mental fogginess accompanied by large drops in physical energy, ability to work and logic compromises, loss of motivation, loss of empathy and emotions, edema and loss of muscle tone, reduced field of vision, increase in eye pressure. ... I lose the sense of reality and enter a psychotic state.
My blood tests are apparently all regular and in the range of the laboratory ... even the hormones (Testosterone, Estrogens, Vitamin D, Cortisol, Insulin, Thyroid) but B12 and folates are high. Homocysteine 11.7.
Only a year ago thanks to the internet I discovered the possibility of having something at the level of the energy transport chain in mitochondria.
Someone could tell me: did you make a diagnosis yourself without tests that confirm your theory? it's true, I don't have a diagnosis but the experience of 20 years of symptoms is enough.
In the last 5 years I have had a great cognitive and neuromuscular decline.
In the last 3 months I am benefiting from Vitamin E, Melatonin, ALCAR, Retinol, Ubiquinol and Bitter Cocoa (probably for Stearic Acid and Antioxidant?), B1 Thiamine HCL, B3 Niacin but only in the first month.
Is it possible to know which substances stimulate the various respiratory complexes? I maintain that there may be some flaws in the first and second complexes.
What would you do in my case? I really feel with little hope.
Thanks, see you soon!

#2 dlewis1453

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Posted 20 November 2019 - 04:03 PM

Hi Longcity90, 


I am sorry to hear about your health problems. I'll try to give you some advice on Turnbuckle's mitochondria protocol and on your health generally, but please remember that I am not a doctor, just a biohacker, so none of what I write is official medical advice. 


Thyroid: It sounds like you have already done some considerable investigations into your health with various lab tests. What specifically did you measure when you measured your thyroid? The common thyroid labs are TSH, thyroid antibodies, T4, T3, and Reverse T3. However, many doctors often just order TSH or T4 and neglect to order the other tests. I ask because your symptoms could indicate some form of hypothyroidism.  There are types of hypothyroidism that are rarer and not easily detected by simple lab tests. For example, some people, either because of a genetic defect or some inflammatory condition, have problems efficiently converting t4 to t3 within their cells. T3 is the active form of thyroid hormone. These people will appear to be normal on lab tests, but will have the symptoms of hypothyroidism. T3 is also important for the body's mitochondrial quality control process, so people who remain hypothyroid for a long time will also tend to build up defective mitochondria. One way to indirectly test whether your are hypothyroid is to take your temperature several times throughout the day. If your temperate is consistently lower than 98 degrees Fahrenheit, then you may have some form of hypothyroidism. Doctors in the past would  determine hypothyroidism through careful examination of a patient's symptoms along with their temperature. However, in the past few decades most doctors have become completely reliant on lab tests, which are only effective for measuring thyroid hormone levels in the blood, and not in the cells (which is where T3 has its effect). This approach to diagnosis does not adequately treat people who have T4 to T3 conversion issues within their cells.  Many people who have raised their T3 to normal levels experience normal energy and properly mitochondria. T3 is important for mitochondria quality control and the energy generation process within mitochondria. 



Genetic Testing: Another possibility is that you have some gene or genes that are interfering with your methylation cycle. This could be why you have high b12 and high homocysteine. Normally homocysteine is high when b12 is low, and vice versa. You could take a 23andme genetic test. Either health or ancestry version will work just fine. Download your raw genetic data from your 23andme profile and upload it into a detailed methylation program. There are several such programs. Selfhacked is a good one. Show these results to a doctor with experience in treating methylation disorders. Many methylation disorders can be fixed with supplementation. 


Regarding Turnbuckle's protocol: To put it simply, Turnbuckle's protocol takes our body's normal process of mitochondrial quality control and amplifies it greatly. The protocol does this by forcing the mitochondria into alternating states of fission and fusion. Normally in our bodies our mitochondria are alternating between fission and fusion at different times. Turnbuckle's protocol forces large numbers of mitochondria into extreme fission and extreme fusion all at once. If you have defective mitochondria, give turnbuckle's protocol a try, but start carefully. You will likely feel very tired during the fission stage of the protocol. If you feel tired, that is a sign that your have some defective mitochondria. You can progress through multiple cycles of the protocol until you dont feel much from the fission part. When that happens, you will know that most of your defective mitochondria have been replaced with new mitochondria. Hopefully you will feel better at this point. However, if you have some other health issue that remains unfixed, such as hypothyroidism or a methylation defect, you may continue to feel some symptoms and you may gradually build up defective mitochondria over time. You can always take turnbuckle's mitochondria protocol again throughout your life to clear out defective mitochondria. 




Edited by dlewis1453, 20 November 2019 - 04:08 PM.

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#3 longcity90

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Posted 20 November 2019 - 05:03 PM

Ciao Longcity90, 


Mi dispiace per i tuoi problemi di salute. Cercherò di darti alcuni consigli sul protocollo mitocondri di Turnbuckle e sulla tua salute in generale, ma ricorda che non sono un dottore, solo un biohacker, quindi nulla di ciò che scrivo è un consiglio medico ufficiale. 


Tiroide: sembra che tu abbia già svolto alcune importanti ricerche sulla tua salute con vari test di laboratorio. Cosa hai misurato specificamente quando hai misurato la tiroide?I comuni laboratori tiroidei sono TSH, anticorpi tiroidei, T4, T3 e Reverse T3. Tuttavia, molti medici spesso ordinano solo TSH o T4 e trascurano di ordinare gli altri test. Chiedo perché i tuoi sintomi potrebbero indicare una qualche forma di ipotiroidismo. Esistono tipi di ipotiroidismo che sono più rari e non facilmente rilevabili con semplici test di laboratorio. Ad esempio, alcune persone, a causa di un difetto genetico o di una condizione infiammatoria, hanno problemi a convertire efficacemente t4 in t3 all'interno delle loro cellule. T3 è la forma attiva dell'ormone tiroideo. Queste persone sembreranno normali nei test di laboratorio, ma avranno i sintomi dell'ipotiroidismo. La T3 è anche importante per il processo di controllo della qualità mitocondriale del corpo, quindi anche le persone che rimangono a lungo ipotiroidee tenderanno a sviluppare mitocondri difettosi.Un modo per testare indirettamente se si è ipotiroidei è quello di misurare la temperatura più volte durante il giorno. Se il tuo temperato è costantemente inferiore a 98 gradi Fahrenheit, potresti avere una qualche forma di ipotiroidismo.I medici in passato avrebbero determinato l'ipotiroidismo attraverso un attento esame dei sintomi di un paziente insieme alla loro temperatura. Tuttavia, negli ultimi decenni la maggior parte dei medici ha fatto completamente affidamento su test di laboratorio, che sono efficaci solo per misurare i livelli di ormone tiroideo nel sangue e non nelle cellule (che è dove T3 ha il suo effetto). Questo approccio alla diagnosi non tratta adeguatamente le persone che hanno problemi di conversione da T4 a T3 all'interno delle loro cellule. Molte persone che hanno aumentato il loro T3 a livelli normali sperimentano energia normale e mitocondri adeguati. T3 è importante per il controllo di qualità dei mitocondri e il processo di generazione di energia all'interno dei mitocondri. 



Test genetici: un'altra possibilità è che tu abbia alcuni geni che interferiscono con il tuo ciclo di metilazione. Questo potrebbe essere il motivo per cui hai un'alta b12 e un'alta omocisteina. Normalmente l'omocisteina è alta quando la b12 è bassa e viceversa. Potresti fare un test genetico 23andme. O la versione di salute o antenata funzionerà bene. Scarica i tuoi dati genetici grezzi dal tuo profilo 23andme e caricali in un programma di metilazione dettagliato. Esistono diversi programmi di questo tipo. Selfhacked è una buona scelta. Mostra questi risultati a un medico con esperienza nel trattamento dei disturbi della metilazione. Molti disturbi della metilazione possono essere risolti con l'integrazione. 


Per quanto riguarda il protocollo di Turnbuckle:Per dirla semplicemente, il protocollo Turnbuckle prende il normale processo di controllo della qualità mitocondriale del nostro corpo e lo amplifica notevolmente. Il protocollo fa questo forzando i mitocondri a alternare stati di fissione e fusione. Normalmente nei nostri corpi i nostri mitocondri si alternano tra fissione e fusione in momenti diversi. Il protocollo di Turnbuckle impone un gran numero di mitocondri in fissione estrema e fusione estrema allo stesso tempo. Se hai mitocondri difettosi, prova il protocollo del tenditore, ma inizia con attenzione. Probabilmente ti sentirai molto stanco durante la fase di fissione del protocollo. Se ti senti stanco, questo è un segno che hai alcuni mitocondri difettosi. Puoi progredire attraverso più cicli del protocollo fino a quando non ti senti molto dalla parte della fissione. Quando ciò accade, saprai che la maggior parte dei tuoi mitocondri difettosi sono stati sostituiti con nuovi mitocondri. Spero che ti sentirai meglio a questo punto. Tuttavia, se hai altri problemi di salute che non vengono risolti, come l'ipotiroidismo o un difetto di metilazione, potresti continuare a sentire alcuni sintomi e nel tempo potresti sviluppare gradualmente mitocondri difettosi. Puoi sempre riprendere il protocollo mitocondri del tenditore per tutta la vita per eliminare i mitocondri difettosi. 


Hi, thank you very much for answering me!
So with regard to the Thyroid the first attempts were performed about 6 years ago despite the examinations (TSH, FT3, FT4 and antibodies were regular and in the range).
At the beginning I only took T3 then I took both T4 and T3 together but after months the symptoms didn't change ... practically I didn't improve.
The temperature in the morning has always been high and never low ... even during the day.
As a result we stopped this path with the doctor because he believed that my thyroid is healthy.
With regard to methylation it is very likely that there are one or more defects but I strongly feel that a lot starts from the mitochondria due to the benefits from the supplements I listed to you ... (NEVER AVUTI PRIMA) because they are involved in the mitochondria energy transport chain. ..I'm really sure of this because after 20 years I'm seeing a little light at the end of the tunnel ... at least I know a part of the truth.
The B12 in all the forms (MetilB12, Hydroxy ...) has always caused me "blocks" crash "really heavy from the neurological point of view ... (symptoms autistic spectrum but I have never had a diagnosis of Autism).
The protocol is really interesting but I have a bit of fear sincerely ... and from what I understand it doesn't work by solving any problems in the respiratory chain.
Is it correct what I wrote? help me check which other substances stimulate the various complexes?
Ribose doesn't help much in my case but Piracetam is really phenomenal to create ATP ... another signal that shows my difficulty in producing ATP.

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#4 longcity90

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Posted 05 December 2019 - 04:26 PM

How can I facilitate the conversion of pyruvate to acetyl coenzyme A?

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