1036 replies to this topic

[Mind]

Do you have any RCT studies to provide in regards to variable R-value and the usefulness of masks?

[Hip]

Do you have any RCT studies to provide in regards to variable R-value and the usefulness of masks?

 

How does that relate to my previous post? That post was to try to provide some understanding of how exponential systems work.

 

I see no evidence of understanding, or even curiosity about the subject, which means it is not possible to appreciate why either masking's success in curbing an pandemic outbreak (as we saw with delta) or its failure to do so (as we saw with omicron) is a direct measure of the viral stopping power of masks, as you were trying to imply it was.

 

This is what I am trying to explain: that your measures are wrong. You cannot measure masking efficacy via prevention of outbreaks, because exponential systems are highly non-linear. There is no proportionality.

 

 

 

If you want evidence for the efficacy of masks, just go to Google and search for studies (rather than using clickbait conspiracy theory websites). Enter a search phrase like: efficacy of masks covid systematic review.

Edited by Hip, 02 January 2023 - 01:55 AM.

[geo12the]

I was recently talking on the phone with my sister who is horribly sick with some super nasty upper respiratory virus which she also passed on to our elderly mother. They have been testing neg for COVID so it could be Flu or RSV or COVID (the store bought tests are not that reliable) but who knows. One thing she said to me was "I guess I shouldn't have stopped wearing a mask". What I told her was "Look wear a mask where it makes sense. If you go to Target wear a mask, If you go to the grocery store wear a mask. If you are at a friends house and they are not sick don't wear a mask. If you are outside don't wear a mask". At the end of the day it's common sense. The science shows masks work. Yes there are differences in efficacy depending on the kind of mask, so make sure to wear a good N95 or KN95 mask. It's not a burden to wear a mask at Target. Or the supermarket. At the risk of jinxing myself, I haven't gotten sick since the pandemic started. I do think my husband and I had COVID in January of 2020, about 3 months before COVID hit the news, which I posted about here. But since then we have not gotten sick once (watch I will get COVID now) because we mask up when it makes sense and got vaxed and boosted. My relatives who are unvaccinated and don't wear masks have all gotten COVID multiple times and all just had the flu. I personally HATE being sick. I am miserable even with a cold and come close to having panic attacks when my sinuses are completely congested. If wearing a mask at Target will save you from catching a miserable virus why not just wear a mask at Target? I don't get it.  

 

[pamojja]

My relatives who are unvaccinated and don't wear masks have all gotten COVID multiple times and all just had the flu.

 
I and my brother are the only in my familly, who have been unvaccinated and didn't get sick with anything at all. All other luckily with the only exception of my old father got Covid at least twice.
 
Same at my working-place (about 30 co-workers): All vaccinated got Covid at least twice too, only 1 other (as far as I know) and me not once. We all had to wear N95 face masks. The only co-worker who insultetd me for not risking the gene-therapy, ended up with long-covid. Sickness leaves are soaring in my co-workers. And almost all my co-workers already had sickness leave the day after having a shot.
 
All of our clients - homeless, all of them whenever allowed not wearing any mask - and outnumbering our co-workers multiple times, also never got covid. Nor die anyone I know personally end up in the hosipital or died of covid.
 
 

I personally HATE being sick. I am miserable even with a cold and come close to having panic attacks when my sinuses are completely congested. If wearing a mask at Target will save you from catching a miserable virus why not just wear a mask at Target? I don't get it.

Can't even remember my last real flu (55 now). My last sickness leave was 3 days in 2006 for a rather mild feverish cold. Interesstingly with all Covid-comorbities (prediabetes, COPD 1, CVD) on board.

 

I however don't weaken my imunity at all. And I do understand that with weak psychological resilience one is primed for each and every sickness through the nocebo effect allone. And additional immunity straining treatments, like mRNA and masks. I do get it.

Edited by pamojja, 05 January 2023 - 12:25 PM.

[Mind]

I was recently talking on the phone with my sister who is horribly sick with some super nasty upper respiratory virus which she also passed on to our elderly mother. They have been testing neg for COVID so it could be Flu or RSV or COVID (the store bought tests are not that reliable) but who knows. One thing she said to me was "I guess I shouldn't have stopped wearing a mask". What I told her was "Look wear a mask where it makes sense. If you go to Target wear a mask, If you go to the grocery store wear a mask. If you are at a friends house and they are not sick don't wear a mask. If you are outside don't wear a mask". At the end of the day it's common sense. The science shows masks work. Yes there are differences in efficacy depending on the kind of mask, so make sure to wear a good N95 or KN95 mask. It's not a burden to wear a mask at Target. Or the supermarket. At the risk of jinxing myself, I haven't gotten sick since the pandemic started. I do think my husband and I had COVID in January of 2020, about 3 months before COVID hit the news, which I posted about here. But since then we have not gotten sick once (watch I will get COVID now) because we mask up when it makes sense and got vaxed and boosted. My relatives who are unvaccinated and don't wear masks have all gotten COVID multiple times and all just had the flu. I personally HATE being sick. I am miserable even with a cold and come close to having panic attacks when my sinuses are completely congested. If wearing a mask at Target will save you from catching a miserable virus why not just wear a mask at Target? I don't get it.  

 

I get it. The masks spread a culture of fear. They impair human social interaction. These things are bad for immune function. I prefer finding treatments and cures for disease instead of forcing people to live in fear and not see other human faces.

 

The masks mandates were a total failure as a pandemic response.

 

That being said, if you want to live in constant fear, wear a mask.

[geo12the]

I get it. The masks spread a culture of fear. They impair human social interaction. These things are bad for immune function. I prefer finding treatments and cures for disease instead of forcing people to live in fear and not see other human faces.

 

The masks mandates were a total failure as a pandemic response.

 

That being said, if you want to live in constant fear, wear a mask.

 

You are the one always complaining about your side being shamed and belittled yet you are the first, well actually the second,  to shame me for admitting I wear a mask at Target. I don't live in fear at all. I go out to work and interact with tons of people. Went to a small New Years eve dinner last weekend and my husband and I did not wear masks nor did anyone at the dinner. I don't wear at mask most of the time I work. For me it's not about fear it's about staying healthy. Wearing a mask at the supermarket or Target is not at all cumbersome for me and if it prevents me from getting a miserable respiratory virus it's well worth the minimal effort. 

[pamojja]

You are the one always complaining about your side being shamed and belittled yet you are the first, well actually the second,  to shame me for admitting I wear a mask at Target.

 
Sorry, and you don't feel embarrased that here actually you started with this shaming. I only mirrored it back on your own, and Mind as a third.
 

..why not just wear a mask at Target? I don't get it.

 

Simply because if one doesn't weakens one's natural immunity 'on target', as you with masks, one in most cases isn't as much sick as you complained.

Edited by pamojja, 06 January 2023 - 02:39 PM.

[Daniel Cooper]

You are the one always complaining about your side being shamed and belittled yet you are the first, well actually the second,  to shame me for admitting I wear a mask at Target. I don't live in fear at all. I go out to work and interact with tons of people. Went to a small New Years eve dinner last weekend and my husband and I did not wear masks nor did anyone at the dinner. I don't wear at mask most of the time I work. For me it's not about fear it's about staying healthy. Wearing a mask at the supermarket or Target is not at all cumbersome for me and if it prevents me from getting a miserable respiratory virus it's well worth the minimal effort. 

 

Just out of curiosity, do you work on-site or at home?

 

I ask because I can't tell you the irritation of having people that don't work, are retired, or work from home lecture me that I should have no issues at all wearing a mask 8+ hours a day.  Staying at home with no mask and only wearing one when you venture out to the grocery store is quite a bit different than wearing one the majority of your waking hours 5 days a week.

 

 

 

 

[Mind]

Of course, most of the irritation is not with people wearing a mask because they live in fear of viruses. People have all kinds of fears, justified or not.

 

Most of it stems from the mask mandates. I am still shocked at the vitriol and contempt for people who resisted the masks mandates. It was NOT "you do you" or "live and let live". It was DO THIS or we are going to destroy your life. All the finger-pointing, all the screaming, all the attacks. It was a scary sight to see. When I see someone with a mask on, it reminds of this sordid chapter in human history and also reminds me there are still people in positions of influence trying to force people to wear masks "forever". I don't believe your libertarian postings here, sorry. I believe that the people who love wearing their masks, will instantly return to all of the vicious attacks, the minute some "health" bureaucrat starts demanding it.

 

Secondly, the masks did NOTHING to stop the spread of COVID and it is impossible to avoid respiratory illnesses without locking yourself in your home and constantly wearing a full hazmat suit. It disturbs me that people think they can avoid viruses. Viruses are constantly on us and in us. Viruses are in the air we breathe - every breath. Viruses are in nearly every piece of food we eat. Viruses are on everything we touch. Every bit of water on earth is loaded with viruses. Hundreds of millions of viral particles flow through a square meter of the atmosphere every day.

 

In China, they tried to avoid viruses for the last three years. It didn't work. They gave up. It was futile. Everyone in China is going to catch COVID, just like everyone else in the world. It is scary to think that the tyrannical and insane Chinese model of trying to avoid viruses forever, was fervently pushed in many parts of the world, including the U.S. Without the pushback from some citizens, we would all be tracked, tested, and forced to wear masks forever - as suggested in the article linked above.

 

The focus on tyrannical control measures (like masking everywhere forever) as the *best* method to fight disease, in particular, respiratory disease, has led to a lot of misery and division and it has taken focus and funding away from *curing* the disease - which is the win-win scenario everyone should be striving for.

 

 

 

 

Edited by Mind, 06 January 2023 - 06:18 PM.

[geo12the]

Just out of curiosity, do you work on-site or at home?

 

I ask because I can't tell you the irritation of having people that don't work, are retired, or work from home lecture me that I should have no issues at all wearing a mask 8+ hours a day.  Staying at home with no mask and only wearing one when you venture out to the grocery store is quite a bit different than wearing one the majority of your waking hours 5 days a week.

 

I work at home and at a couple of different research and greenhouse locations. The outside the home situations are ones where I don't encounter a  large # of people in a small space and for that reason I don't wear a mask. But at the beginning of the pandemic I worked at a site that required mask use on site. I didn't think it was that hard but can appreciate having to wear a mask 8 house at a time can be more challenging. 

[geo12the]

 I believe that the people who love wearing their masks, will instantly return to all of the vicious attacks, the minute some "health" bureaucrat starts demanding it.

 

 

 

You are afraid someone wearing a mask will attack you for not doing so, so you preemptively attack them? Makes perfect sense. LOL

[Daniel Cooper]

I work at home and at a couple of different research and greenhouse locations. The outside the home situations are ones where I don't encounter a  large # of people in a small space and for that reason I don't wear a mask. But at the beginning of the pandemic I worked at a site that required mask use on site. I didn't think it was that hard but can appreciate having to wear a mask 8 house at a time can be more challenging. 

 

I do hardware design and am required to work on-site (for security reasons) and in any case need access to a fully equipped lab.

 

In spite of the fact that our facility had very low population density (about 66% were allowed to work at home), we were required to wear masks at all times when on site - because reason and science quickly take a back seat to dogmatism in situations like this.

 

9+ hour days were not uncommon.  Let me tell you, rebreathing your own humid dank breath for that many hours a day is no joy. And it's probably not exactly healthy for you either.

[smithx]

Association between COVID-19 and consistent mask wearing during contact with others outside the household—A nested case–control analysis, November 2020–October 2021

https://onlinelibrar....1111/irv.13080
 

Results

COVID-19 was associated with not consistently wearing a mask (adjusted odds ratio [aOR] 1.49; 95% confidence interval [CI] [1.14, 1.95]). Compared with persons ≥14 days after mRNA vaccination who also reported always wearing a mask, COVID-19 was associated with being unvaccinated (aOR 5.94; 95% CI [3.04, 11.62]), not wearing a mask (aOR 1.62; 95% CI [1.07, 2.47]), or both unvaccinated and not wearing a mask (aOR 9.07; 95% CI [4.81, 17.09]).
Conclusions

Our findings indicate that consistent mask wearing can complement vaccination to reduce the risk of COVID-19.
 

 

[Mind]

You are afraid someone wearing a mask will attack you for not doing so, so you preemptively attack them? Makes perfect sense. LOL

 

Saying someone is "living in fear" (of viruses), might have a negative connotation, but it is not incorrect. However, I can see how some might take offense to the statement.

 

I have never attacked anyone for wearing masks - only pointing out the futility...along with RCT studies indicating the masks are not a good pandemic response.

 

I am fearful about attacks from people wearing masks - BECAUSE IT HAPPENED. The attacks were widespread, vitriolic, condescending, and physically violent at times over the last couple of years. You can say I am "fearful" of future attacks. It don't consider that statement an "attack". It is true. It is a justified fear, based upon recent history.

 

One other thing, obviously, if there was a more deadly disease spreading around the world, no one would need to be beaten and threatened into isolating or wearing hazmat suits with respirators. If they saw their neighbors dropping dead and society collapsing, they would take measures to protect themselves. No mandates needed.

[Mind]

Association between COVID-19 and consistent mask wearing during contact with others outside the household—A nested case–control analysis, November 2020–October 2021

https://onlinelibrar....1111/irv.13080
 

 

This is a much better designed study that previous ones with obvious flaws. I wonder what the results would have been if the study participants were followed for a longer period of time. No one can avoid viruses forever. In contrast to this study, everyone I know, whether or not consistently wearing masks, all got COVID. Recall the science writer who was fastidious about all of the methods to reduce exposure - still got COVID (after two years). She couldn't avoid people forever. She couldn't wear a mask forever in every situation. She couldn't avoid "the virus" forever.

[Mind]

For people just joining this discussion.

 

Specially designed masks/respirators and hazmat suits "work" to block various sizes of particles. It's physics.

 

The general masking of the population did not "work" during this media-created COVID panic. COVID spread everywhere. There are multiple reasons for the abject failure which have been discussed throughout this thread.

 

A lot of the "masks work", studies were poorly done (I have called some of them "junk"). This one looked at county level data in the U.S., but has now been withdrawn because there have been "increased SARS-CoV2 cases in areas we originally analyzed". This is a limitation in many of the "masks work" studies - short term data. Everyone eventually ended up getting COVID, no matter if they wore masks or not. Look at Japan, South Korea, Hong Kong, Taiwan, etc... where mask-compliance is extremely high...they are all getting COVID, same as everyone else.

 

I can't believe that at one point there were mask mandates for outdoor locations and that people were harassed, threatened, fined, and arrested for not wearing a mask outdoors. Many commentators said it looked more like an obsession with power and not anything like "public health". Considering the fact that the current administration in the U.S. is fighting tooth and nail to retain the power to mask people on airplanes, it looks more and more like a power play.

 

Recall that when the mask mandate for air travel ended - passengers were overjoyed - but public "health" officials in the U.S. said it would be a disaster and COVID would spread everywhere and everyone was in danger. The airplane masks mandate ended, and nothing happened. It was not a public health disaster.

 

 

[Mind]

Yet another meta review of mask usage - finding that masks are ineffective in controlling respiratory outbreaks - including COVID.

 

Meanwhile some of the studies showing that masks "work" as a pandemic response are being withdrawn.

Edited by Mind, 31 January 2023 - 11:13 PM.

[Hip]

Yet another meta review of mask usage - finding that masks are ineffective in controlling respiratory outbreaks - including COVID.

 

This is quality source you are quoting (the Cochrane Review), so it's conclusions carry some weight.

 

Though these studies on the efficacy of mask usage among the general public are likely more a measure of the lack of competence of the general public in knowing how to wear a mask, and when to wear it. Lots of people wear their mask under their nose, for example, which completely negates any protective benefit. Others are not clear when they should wear a mask (obviously if you are only happy to wear a mask for just a few hours a day, you would want to wear it at time of maximum risk, such as when travelling by public transport).

 

But if you are a vulnerable person, and you want to protect yourself from COVID, wearing a properly-fitting N95 mask to the supermarket and on public transport will help protect you. 

[pamojja]

But if you are a vulnerable person, and you want to protect yourself from COVID, wearing a properly-fitting N95 mask to the supermarket and on public transport will help protect you. 

 

Wishful thinking, to make an obviously opposite conclusion fit your preconceptions.

 

We had N95 mask mandates in shops and public transport for 2 years. At our working-place in councelling settings or meetings, N95 mask had to be weared at all timee. None under the nose, since all with with the understanding of academically trained. Almost all of our coworkers of about 30 got covid at least twice. Almost all had sicknessleave after each vaccination.

 

Our clients, about 10 as much and apt to wear the mask unter the nose when forced to wear, none got covid. Nether did I and only 1 coworker not vaccinated.

 

Sure, only a n=330, but a pritty pitch black swan.

 

 

[Daniel Cooper]

This is quality source you are quoting (the Cochrane Review), so it's conclusions carry some weight.

 

Though these studies on the efficacy of mask usage among the general public are likely more a measure of the lack of competence of the general public in knowing how to wear a mask, and when to wear it. Lots of people wear their mask under their nose, for example, which completely negates any protective benefit. Others are not clear when they should wear a mask (obviously if you are only happy to wear a mask for just a few hours a day, you would want to wear it at time of maximum risk, such as when travelling by public transport).

 

But if you are a vulnerable person, and you want to protect yourself from COVID, wearing a properly-fitting N95 mask to the supermarket and on public transport will help protect you. 

 

This is an "if only" argument. If only people had wore their mask more correctly, if only people had worn better masks, etc.  And if my mother had wheels she'd be a wagon.

 

Those things may or may not be true. We can only guess at what those results might have been (for what it's worth I suspect that better masks worn more correctly would have been somewhat more effective). But the only thing we can actually measure are the results of what happened when people worn the masks that they did as real people tend to wear masks. And in the real world it's the real world results that matter.

 

 

 

 

Edited by Daniel Cooper, 01 February 2023 - 07:09 PM.

[Hip]

But the only thing we can actually measure are the results of what happened when people worn the masks that they did as real people tend to wear masks. And in the real world it's the real world results that matter.

 

Well also in the real world, we know that doctors and nurses in COVID wards, where the air is heavily laden with coronavirus, do not get COVID, because they are wearing properly fitting N95 masks.

 

So the real world tells us that when worn properly, masks are highly effective at preventing you from getting COVID, even when the air is heavily laden with the virus.

 

 

I agree that in the general populace, masks don't work that well, because of the reasons I mentioned. But for vulnerable people who specifically need to avoid catching COVID, they should not pay any heed to the above Cochrane review, because if they are disciplined and wear their N95 mask properly, it provides excellent protection in COVID risk environments. 

Edited by Hip, 01 February 2023 - 08:17 PM.

[Daniel Cooper]

Well also in the real world, we know that doctors and nurses in COVID wards, where the air is heavily laden with coronavirus, do not get COVID, because they are wearing properly fitting N95 masks.

 

 

That seems a rather strong statement. I recall many doctors and nurses in my area getting covid. Some even passed away in that initial stage.

[pamojja]

That seems a rather strong statement. I recall many doctors and nurses in my area getting covid. Some even passed away in that initial stage.

 

Hip is still making things up to confirm his view. A big problem in our medical system has been the quarantine due to covid infections of alledgedly properly prodected medical staff, leaving most remaining close to burnout. Not that medical system wasn't understuffed already before.

[Mind]

Hip is still making things up to confirm his view. A big problem in our medical system has been the quarantine due to covid infections of alledgedly properly prodected medical staff, leaving most remaining close to burnout. Not that medical system wasn't understuffed already before.

 

That is what I see in my area. Nurses and doctors hate wearing the masks all the time and many are quitting - plus they disagree with the vax mandates.

[Hip]

It's being increasingly recognised that the efficacy of masks is critically dependent on the quality of the fit to the face. 

 

Even in hospital settings, where doctors and nurses have their masks examined for tightness of fit by a mask fit-checking team, sometimes the fit can still be less than 100% airtight, and so can let in virally-contaminated air.

 

If the fit of an N95 is poor, then it performs no better than a cloth covering. And what's more, minor leaks due to poor fit are almost impossible to detect by the wearer. Ref: here. 

 

This is why it is so hard for the general public to ensure they are wearing their N95 masks properly, as even with a professional mask fit-checking department that you find in hospitals, sometimes these masks still don't fit properly. 

 

Also, it's been discovered that the shape of Asian faces in particular seems to result in a poorer fit. Ref: here. 

 

This article describes a fit test method using a nebuliser to create aerosolised saccharin vapour. If the mask wearer can taste the sugary flavour of the saccharin, then the N95 mask is not fitting properly, and has air leaks. 

 

 

 

It seems to me that we need better quality masks. These should be developed in preparation for the next pandemic. We perhaps need masks that are custom-made for the shape of each face, so that the fit is perfect. Doctors and nurses could be given their own custom-made mask frame by the hospital's mask fit-check department. And then into that perfectly fitting frame, disposable N95 filter cartridges could be attached. 

 

I also think we need to develop electric fan breathing-assist masks. One of the unpleasant things about wearing a mask for some hours is that it makes your breathing constricted, because it requires extra lung pressure to breathe in and out through a mask. But if we have some sort of rechargeable battery electric fan assistance on the mask, that might make the breathing easier, and make wearing a mask for long hours feel less claustrophobic.

 

Edited by Hip, 02 February 2023 - 08:58 PM.

[Daniel Cooper]

It's being increasingly recognised that the efficacy of masks is critically dependent on the quality of the fit to the face. 

 

Even in hospital settings, where doctors and nurses have their masks examined for tightness of fit by a mask fit-checking team, sometimes the fit can still be less than 100% airtight, and so can let in virally-contaminated air.

 

If the fit of an N95 is poor, then it performs no better than a cloth covering. And what's more, minor leaks due to poor fit are almost impossible to detect by the wearer. Ref: here. 

 

This is why it is so hard for the general public to ensure they are wearing their N95 masks properly, as even with a professional mask fit-checking department that you find in hospitals, sometimes these masks still don't fit properly. 

 

Also, it's been discovered that the shape of Asian faces in particular seems to result in a poorer fit. Ref: here. 

 

This article describes a fit test method using a nebuliser to create aerosolised saccharin vapour. If the mask wearer can taste the sugary flavour of the saccharin, then the N95 mask is not fitting properly, and has air leaks. 

 

 

 

It seems to me that we need better quality masks. These should be developed in preparation for the next pandemic. We perhaps need masks that are custom-made for the shape of each face, so that the fit is perfect. Doctors and nurses could be given their own custom-made mask frame by the hospital's mask fit-check department. And then into that perfectly fitting frame, disposable N95 filter cartridges could be attached. 

 

I'm unclear. Are you proposing to custom fit masks to 7.9 billion people, or just healthcare workers?

 

 

[Dorian Grey]

Eureka!  I've Found it!  This explains everything.  

 

https://www.dailymai...y-suggests.html

 

Unattractive people are MORE likely to keep wearing face masks in post-Covid era, study suggests

 

• People who consider themselves attractive are less likely to wear face masks 
• Those who see themselves as less attractive likely believe masks improve looks

------------------------

 

You gotta' admit, some folks do look better with a mask.  

[Daniel Cooper]

Eureka!  I've Found it!  This explains everything.  

 

https://www.dailymai...y-suggests.html

 

Unattractive people are MORE likely to keep wearing face masks in post-Covid era, study suggests

 

• People who consider themselves attractive are less likely to wear face masks 
• Those who see themselves as less attractive likely believe masks improve looks

------------------------

 

You gotta' admit, some folks do look better with a mask.  

 

 

Well no wonder I don't want to wear a mask!

 

 

 

 

[Hip]

I'm unclear. Are you proposing to custom fit masks to 7.9 billion people, or just healthcare workers?

 

The articles I posted above about masks are about healthcare workers dealing with patients who have infectious diseases, so my thoughts are in the first instance directed at them. But if there is wider demand for a high quality mask, then these items should be available to the general public. 

 

 

During the pandemic it became clear to me that many FFP2 / N95 masks are poorly designed and poorly made. I bought various types of FFP2 / N95 masks during the pandemic, hoping to find one that was comfortable and worked effectively. But all the ones I bought leaked air around the edges to some degree. This leak is easy to spot if like me you wear glasses, as your spectacles steam up on the out breath. 

 

The nose area of a mask seems particularly hard to seal, and this is the area I found was leaking and causing condensation on my glasses with the various mask designs I tried. Masks usually have a metal nosepiece which you can bend to shape in order to fit your nose. But the metal is invariably thin and weak, so quickly bends back out of shape, causing an air leak around the nose area.

 

These days we have the manufacturing technology to incorporate an entire computer and screen into a smartphone, yet we cannot seem to manufacture a decent respirator mask. This is something that needs to be addressed, so that by the next pandemic, we will be better prepared. 

 

 

 

The only respirator mask I bought which did not leak was a professional thermoplastic elastomer face mask, costing about $30, and used to protect workers from dust, particulate matter as well as microbes. This mask was very comfortable, very easy to breathe through, and did not steam up my glasses at all, so appeared leakproof. But it made you look like Darth Vader. We need a more slimline mask, because if you want to encourage the general public to wear masks, you have to take aesthetics into consideration. 

Edited by Hip, 03 February 2023 - 01:41 AM.

[Mind]

Just as the implementation of mask mandates were tightly correlated with increases in COVID cases in almost every country in the world, so has the ending of mask mandates correlated with rapid decreases in COVID cases. Many will argue that the mask mandates just mirrored conditions on the ground, but some would also argue that there are reasons, some subtle and some obvious, why the masking increased COVID incidence.

 

South Korea finally ended their indoor mask requirements and COVID cases plummeted. There has been much consternation about the end of mask mandates. We have been lectured by (some would say clueless) health bureaucrats and talking head doctors on TV that ending mask mandates would be a disaster. This has not happened. COVID cases continue to decline as less and less people around the world wear masks.