43 replies to this topic

[stormheller]

Yes. Drink milk. I used to get toothaches and have those brown things on my teeth as well, but then I started drinking fewer sugary beverages and more skim milk and they went away.

[ajnast4r]

yea, under perfect conditions.

xylitol is key

[sdxl]

I don't think conditions need to perfect, just that the balance between remineralization and demineralization needs to be towards remineralization. So acid production from bacteria and intake of acidic foods need to be reduced and the right building blocks need to be there in sufficient amounts. Calcium and phosphate are key.

[paleo]

Dr. Weston Price claims (with proof of xrays) to have reversed cavities with high vitamin cod liver oil and butter oil:


Both of these producers offer the high-vitamin cod liver oil that the Cleveland dentist Weston Price used in the 1930s, in conjunction with a centrifuged butter oil, to reverse tooth decay. Dr. Price even showed photos of the x-rays to prove his patients' teeth were remineralizing.

[biggee]

yea, under perfect conditions.

xylitol is key

Exactly right on xylitol.

As paleo points out, westonaprice.org has some great answers on everything health related. This is a must see.

[paleo]

yea, under perfect conditions.

xylitol is key

Exactly right on xylitol.

As paleo points out, westonaprice.org has some great answers on everything health related. This is a must see.

I have been hearing alot about this xylitol. Is it truely harmless (and possibly healthy)?

[paleo]

paleo
search google, there are tons of info on it. It's not really heathy generally, but it seems to be healthly for teeth, otherwise it's more healthy than sucrose so it's good sugar substitue.

Better than stevia? I don't eat sugar, but if I did I think I would take sugar over artificial sweeteners. Same with over stevia, xylitol, xzzyxz, etc. All this stuff is too unproven and I know what the body does with sugar, so I can live with that.

I'll do some homework on it...thanks.

[biggee]

paleo
search google, there are tons of info on it. It's not really heathy generally, but it seems to be healthly for teeth, otherwise it's more healthy than sucrose so it's good sugar substitue.

Lots of info if you google it for sure. It is a great sugar replacement derived preferably from hardwoods, but a lesser form from fruits. Just replacing it for all the sugars out there is an enormous health benefit in its own right.

Conventional sugars are extremely addictive and ruinous to health, leading to a myriad of diseases.

[paleo]

paleo
search google, there are tons of info on it. It's not really heathy generally, but it seems to be healthly for teeth, otherwise it's more healthy than sucrose so it's good sugar substitue.

Lots of info if you google it for sure. It is a great sugar replacement derived preferably from hardwoods, but a lesser form from fruits. Just replacing it for all the sugars out there is an enormous health benefit in its own right.

Conventional sugars are extremely addictive and ruinous to health, leading to a myriad of diseases.

I agree with your last statement, but even if it's derived from fruits doesn't mean it's a good thing. What about fructose?

[paleo]

Fructose seems to be pretty bad on it's own, at least by looking at:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fructose

Also you should note that there are natural sugar substitutes and artificial sweeteners. I hate artificial sweeteners, but sugar substitues like sorbitol looks interesting.
Again sugar on it's own is bad, so i'm not sure what makes larger damage in the end, artificial sweeteners or sugar...

My money is on artificial sweeteners. Sugar is the something the body can deal with...and usually ends up stored as fat. With the former, who knows.

[Shepard]

I don't think it's nearly as cut and dry as sugar vs. artificial sweeteners, too many other things come into play on an individual basis.

[xanadu]

I used xylitol and found it affected my sense of taste. I used it all day in my drinking water which was probably excessive. I think I was overloaded on the taste of it and became unable to taste anything sweet for a while. Things still don't taste quite the same but it has come around almost to normal since I quit using xylitol. I think I may cap it up and take it that way. It is supposed to help a lot with teeth.

[Shepard]

What was the final verdict on xylitol? I certainly don't see it working as a capped supplement.

[Athanasios]

Xylitol at 6.44 g/day and 10.32 g/day reduces mutans streptococci in plaque at 5 wks, and in plaque and unstimulated saliva at 6 mos. A plateau effect is suggested between 6.44 g and 10.32 g xylitol/day.

PMID: 16434738 [PubMed - in process]

this is from a gum study

[xanadu]

That seems like a huge amount. How was it administered?

[Athanasios]

the full abstract:

Mutans streptococci dose response to xylitol chewing gum.

Milgrom P, Ly KA, Roberts MC, Rothen M, Mueller G, Yamaguchi DK.

Department of Dental Public Health Sciences, Northwest/Alaska Center to Reduce Oral Health Disparities, Box 357475, University of Washington, Seattle, WA 98195 USA;

Xylitol is promoted in caries-preventive strategies, yet its effective dose range is unclear. This study determined the dose-response of mutans streptococci in plaque and unstimulated saliva to xylitol gum. Participants (n = 132) were randomized: controls (G1) (sorbitol/maltitol), or combinations giving xylitol 3.44 g/day (G2), 6.88 g/day (G3), or 10.32 g/day (G4). Groups chewed 3 pellets/4 times/d. Samples were taken at baseline, 5 wks, and 6 mos, and were cultured on modified Mitis Salivarius agar for mutans streptococci and on blood agar for total culturable flora. At 5 wks, mutans streptococci levels in plaque were 10x lower than baseline in G3 and G4 (P = 0.007/0.003). There were no differences in saliva. At 6 mos, mutans streptococci in plaque for G3 and G4 remained 10x lower than baseline (P = 0.007/0.04). Saliva for G3 and G4 was lower than baseline by 8 to 9x (P = 0.011/0.038). Xylitol at 6.44 g/day and 10.32 g/day reduces mutans streptococci in plaque at 5 wks, and in plaque and unstimulated saliva at 6 mos. A plateau effect is suggested between 6.44 g and 10.32 g xylitol/day.

PMID: 16434738 [PubMed - in process]

Xylitol is something to look into if you want your tooth to rebuild itself. If you can get it with calcium lactate, that would be better:

In conclusion, chewing gum containing xylitol + calcium lactate could enhance remineralization of enamel surface compared to chewing gum containing only xylitol or no gum chewing. PMID: 16352880

Oh yeah, I also got the Oral-B Braun 3-D based on ScottL's rec. I am impressed with it.

Edited by cnorwood19, 24 June 2006 - 05:08 AM.

[scottl]

Oh yeah, I also got the Oral-B Braun 3-D based on ScottL's rec. I am impressed with it.

Just one note: it is a very good brush. Just be very careful not to press to hard or you can damage your enamel Just press against teeth lightly and hold in each spot for 5 secs and then move on.

[Athanasios]

Thanks scottl. I feel like I can get all the way around the tooth better with the oral b toothbrush than my normal "manual" brush. The single tooth sized tip really helps.

Also, Shepard, it seems like that xylitol must be present in the mouth. Check out this, on xylitol action:

The growth inhibition of mutans streptococci is one of the proposed mechanisms of action of xylitol, a caries-preventive natural carbohydrate sweetener. Xylitol is taken up and accumulated as non-metabolizable, toxic xylitol phosphate via a constitutive fructose PTS, and selects, during in vitro growth at the expense of glucose, for natural xylitol-resistant mutants that lack constitutive fructose PTS activity...The data partially explain the occurrence of xylitol-resistant mutans populations in long-term xylitol consumers and suggest a mechanism consistent with a selection process. Since various preliminary results suggest that xylitol-resistant natural mutants may be less virulent and less cariogenic than their parent strains, this selection process may alter, for the better, the mutans streptococci population of the plaque and play a role in the caries-preventive action of xylitol.
PMID: 9003237

[Ghostrider]

Oh yeah, I also got the Oral-B Braun 3-D based on ScottL's rec. I am impressed with it.

Wow, what are the odds. So as I am brushing my teeth, I am thinking that my old manual brush cannot be as good as the modern electric toothbrushes. I then decide to go onto the only health-related forum that I frequently visit and pose the question: "What's the best toothbrush money can buy?". I knew that the Food, Nutrition, and Exercise forum would be the closest match on imminst, but toothbrushes don't really fall under Food, Nutrition, or exercise. But I come in and what is the first thread I see? Well this thread. I scroll down to the bottom of the thread and we are talking about electric toothbrushes. What are the odds? Maybe there is order in the universe afterall.

Anyway, money is no object if it can prevent me from having to endure cavity filling. I go to the dentist the recommended 2x per year. Now what's the best toothbrush I can get to prevent me from having cavities. I have had one cavity so far in my life and I want that to be the last. The Sonicare Elite series looks good, but is there a "consumer reports" or dental organization which can give good advice? In the end, I think the electric toothbrushes are more alike than different though...

[Shepard]

Also, Shepard, it seems like that xylitol must be present in the mouth. Check out this, on xylitol action:

Yeah, that's the only way, from my understanding, that it would work. Which is why I never really understood xanadu's experiment.

[xanadu]

Shepard, my experiment was to put xylitol in my drinking water all day. After a few weeks I noticed it had changed drasticly my sense of taste. I was wondering if capping it up would do some good. The studies that used 5 to 10 gm a day of xylitol, did all that come in the form of gum? That seems like a huge amount to take that way. Much of it may have come in the form of pills.

[Athanasios]

Read the full abstract that I posted. It appears that the 5 to 10g level is where statistically significant changes occur. This was by using soley gum.

I use jason's healthy mouth toothpaste that has xylitol, a piece of xylitol gum after meals, and a xylitol/alcohol mouthwash. I am thinking of sweetening my green tea slightly with it as well. I have no doubt that this will be enough, and it won't affect my lifestyle.

[sdxl]

I knew that the Food, Nutrition, and Exercise forum would be the closest match on imminst, but toothbrushes don't really fall under Food, Nutrition, or exercise.

Without proper nutrition you probably wouldn't have enough building blocks to overcome the demineralization. And flossing and using a manual toothbrush is exercise.

[Ghostrider]

I got Oral B Triumph 9000 http://www.oralb.com.../power/triumph/ about 3 months ago. I got it for about $70 at ebay, it's money well spent. If you consider dental care costs (specially in US) $90 comes pretty cheap. In two weeks i got rid of all tartar that I planned to remove at dentist. It really works amazing. Also i always used soft brushes but sometimes had minor gum bleedings, since i use this one i never had a bleeding again.

I just purchased the Oral B Triumph 9400 Professional off of eBay. (I figured the higher the model number, the better :-)) I'll let you know what I think of it when it comes.

[scottl]

I think the electric toothbrushes are more alike than different though...

No.