5 replies to this topic

[adamh]

We see this topic popping up all over the world. When things are tough, lets rob the rich then we will all be rich. Except it only leads to everyone being poor. Communism is a prime example of this. The overlords have access to the best things and the citizen is left in poverty. But, they then always say "it wasn't real communism" and if only they had done it right it would have worked. Except it never does

 

We see in the us many proposals for some sort of wealth tax. Some states have already implemented this, some are considering it. What always happens is that the vast majority of the rich simply pick up and move to where they are not being robbed. This has happened throughout history, whole countries have been left impoverished when they tried to rob the wealthy and they took off

 

The next step of course is to pursue those wealthy individuals and companies and try to claw back something after they have fled or to forbid them to leave altogether. Would you want to live in a country or state that pulled that sort of crap on you? Most people have hopes of becoming wealthy or at least comfortable. If they see it will be taken away, why go there?

 

California is already trying to do this. They have the highest taxes of anyplace and they have been considering a law that if you leave the state, the state can collect income taxes on you for 10 more years after you have left. Their lawyers have so far persuaded them not to do it because its unconstitutional but liberals don't let little things like that stand in their way. If you were looking for a place to move or expand your multimillion dollar business, would you even consider california now? 

 

I see constant lies and propaganda in the media. One popular lie is to say millionaires pay only about 7% or 8% of their income in taxes. Do you believe that fairy story? The fact is that the alternate minimum tax (amt) kicks in on all income over about $190k and is 26%. If you make over about $550k it goes to 28% and there is an additional 3.8% investment tax if most of your income is from investments and capital gains

 

The amt hits everyone no matter the source of income. Tax free municipal bonds, long term capital gains, it doesn't matter, the amt hits everyone. So explain to me again how people making millions and billions are paying only a few percent? Its a lie to make you support tax theft

[william7]

You should checkout the YouTube video “AI: The Promise and Peril” where Professor Geoffrey Hinton (called “the godfather of AI”) and Senator Bernie Sanders warned students at the Georgetown University Institute of Politics and Public Service that billionaires are going to program and develop AI and robots with the intent of them becoming richer and more powerful because our political and economic system are geared in this way. This link will take you right to where the video actually starts at 30:10. https://www.youtube....1BmrxtZ3&t=1810. 

     Senator Sanders says we currently have more income inequality than we have ever had in history. He singles out Elon Musk for owning more wealth than the bottom 52% of households. He further states that these big tech billionaires are only in it for the money and the power they gain. Professor Hinton points out that the rich can just buy the politicians to get what they want. He also describes taxation as a good thing. The greater the taxes the better. It’s the taxes that funded all the advanced technology research to begin with. This starts at 1:01:16 and ends at 1:05:10. This link will take you right to where the argument starts. https://www.youtube.com/live/oz3gvM7Oj3g?si=4FUhIV_itE8Ccz0n&t=3676. 

[adamh]

This is more anti-rich propaganda. Sanders is a socialist and basically a communist. He used to rail against millionaires and billionaires until it became known he was a millionaire too. Now he just rants against billionaires. The man made his money by being a politician and collecting graft, he never had a real job in his life. Nancy pelosi has some $200 million all made while in politics

 

Its true there is a lot of wealth inequality. People like musk worked and innovated to get rich, people like bernie sanders, pelosi and others are little more than thieves. The thieves and moochers point a finger at people who actually worked to get ahead. I want to see computers running the country. The programming will be open source and can be checked by anyone. This is the best way to stop politicians from robbing us blind. 

 

Musk says in the future work will be optional and money will not be needed. This is due mostly to ai. Present society is very primitive in some of its systems but that will change a lot in the next 100 years. People will no longer be wage slaves. VR will mean people spend more time in fantasy worlds where they might be the king of the world or become a bird and fly, and so on

[Daniel Cooper]

The simple fact is that the rich will not stand idly by and be soaked. The very wealthy are also the most mobile people on the planet. Once you start talking about confiscatory tax rates, they will simply get up and move. To another state or another country. Whatever is required.

 

This is currently in progress in the US in the state of California which is considering a "one time" wealth tax (honest, they will only take 5% of your wealth this one time). The very wealthy are currently in the process of leaving in droves. They simply aren't going to stand around and allow you to take millions or billions of dollars away from them. 

 

California is going to rue the day that they ever floated this idea. 

[Daniel Cooper]

You should checkout the YouTube video “AI: The Promise and Peril” where Professor Geoffrey Hinton (called “the godfather of AI”) and Senator Bernie Sanders warned students at the Georgetown University Institute of Politics and Public Service that billionaires are going to program and develop AI and robots with the intent of them becoming richer and more powerful because our political and economic system are geared in this way. This link will take you right to where the video actually starts at 30:10. https://www.youtube....1BmrxtZ3&t=1810. 

     Senator Sanders says we currently have more income inequality than we have ever had in history. He singles out Elon Musk for owning more wealth than the bottom 52% of households. He further states that these big tech billionaires are only in it for the money and the power they gain. Professor Hinton points out that the rich can just buy the politicians to get what they want. He also describes taxation as a good thing. The greater the taxes the better. It’s the taxes that funded all the advanced technology research to begin with. This starts at 1:01:16 and ends at 1:05:10. This link will take you right to where the argument starts. https://www.youtube.com/live/oz3gvM7Oj3g?si=4FUhIV_itE8Ccz0n&t=3676. 

 

Well a good start would be for the government to stop rigging the system in favor of the wealthy rather than these ill conceived ideas of confiscating their wealth. But of course, the former would result in a smaller less powerful government and the latter the reverse. So guess which side Sanders favors.

 

As they say, there's no fool like and old fool and when you look up "Old Fool" in the dictionary you find a picture of Senator Bernie Sanders. What he proposes are by no means cutting edge ideas. His ideas are in fact very old ideas that have been tried and failed everywhere they were attempted. From his beloved Soviet Union to Venezuela these socialist ideas have left nothing but poverty and dead bodies. And there is certainly no reason to think that "this time they will get it right" and succeed.

[adamh]

Very well said, Daniel. I can see you are not one of the people always looking for a hand out or for government to save you. The far left has degenerated to the point that stealing is the only idea they have left. They think its legal because govt is doing it but legal and moral or right are completely different. A flat tax of perhaps 10% would be the most democratic

 

there's no fool like and old fool and when you look up "Old Fool" in the dictionary you find a picture of Senator Bernie Sanders.

 

I laughed. Sanders is in the awkward position of his grift being mostly attacking the rich while he is also rich and does not want to discuss that fact. He was widely reported to have been thrown out of a hippie commune in his younger days because he refused to do any work and only wanted to discuss politics and strategy. Those qualities have made him a successful politician and fairly wealthy, having several homes including waterfront properties. All that while at the same time doing no work, in other words not helping the citizens who fell for his gaff. He has literally never had a real job or worked for a paycheck his entire life. He is part of the parasite class which has enriched itself by seeking election

 

Republicans are in on the graft too, don't let them fool you either along with a number of so called conservatives. Just enough go to the other side on key issues to keep the corruption going. The dems are just more blatant with the theft and stupid policies. Both sides like higher taxes because that means more to steal. They do it by giving breaks to big donors. A large smoke stack industry wants epa rules weakened. Or a drug company wants to sell an unproven new compound and wants immunity against lawsuits when the truth comes out, they get it. Just by coincidence, they give large donation to key lawmakers who just happen to change their position and support it

 

Big companies get millions or billions of extra income and sanders, warren, etc etc get hundreds of thousands or millions to support reelection. The public gets soaked and pays for it all. The citizens not only pay more but get faulty products, dangerous chems in food, and lots of pollution to deal with. Then they raise taxes to pay to clean it up and the cycle begins again with more corruption

 

I believe this is the main reason for such wealth inequality that we see today. Government in theory helps us while in practice its like a vampire stealing our blood. This will not change as long as legal bribery is allowed. Every time someone tries to rein in the legalized bribes, sanders and his ilk rush forward to kill it.

 

This is why I'm in favor of computers with ai running things. Everything they do will have to be open and visible to anyone with a browser. The logic behind each decision would be seen step by step. If the computer voted for a bad law, for example, the reason for the mistake would be seen and corrected. Machines by their nature are logical while humans are motivated to get all the loot they can. A machine's motivations are programmed in. If the public decides polluting industries are getting too many breaks, they vote to clamp down on it. That is real democracy, what we have now is more of an oligarchy. 

 

I predict major changes in the world this year. We shall see if it is for the better or for the worse, but things are coming to a boiling point