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clean free energy source? we'll know tomorrow!


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59 replies to this topic

#31 dreamaurora

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Posted 06 July 2007 - 02:37 PM

From their website:

Further to Steorn’s announcement yesterday (5th July) regarding the technical difficulties experienced during the installation of its “Orbo” technology at the Kinentica Museum in London, Steorn has decided to postpone the demonstration until further notice.

Sean McCarthy CEO stated that “technical problems arose during the installation of the demonstration unit in the display case on Wednesday evening. These problems were primarily due to excessive heat from the lighting in the main display area. Attempts to replace those parts affected by the heat led to further failures and as a result we have to postpone the public demonstration until a future date.”

He continued that “we apologise for the inconvenience caused to all the people who had made arrangements to visit the demonstration or were planning on viewing the demonstration online.”

Over the next few weeks the company will explore alternative dates for the public demonstration.


Seems like they are just trying to catch the media's eye to boost revenue. How very disappointing and ordinary...

#32 Live Forever

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Posted 08 July 2007 - 08:13 PM

Seven reasons why Steorn's perpetual machine will never work:
http://tech.blorge.c...ill-never-work/

#33 maestro949

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Posted 09 July 2007 - 12:02 PM

Intelligent design folks believe in it.

It's hardly surprising that the dogmatic neo-darwinist nay-sayers are often the same people who deny that Steorn's perpetual motion machine is possible WITHOUT EVEN SEEING IT!



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#34 Live Forever

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Posted 09 July 2007 - 04:01 PM

Intelligent design folks believe in it.

Well of course they do. If you already don't believe in a major area of biology, it probably isn't that big of a stretch to say that major areas of physics are wrong as well.

#35 maestro949

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Posted 09 July 2007 - 04:10 PM

Our initial assessment indicates that this is probably due to the intense heat from the camera lighting.


It's like the double slit experiment. As soon as you go to measure it, the laws of nature change back to normal.

#36 Luna

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Posted 09 July 2007 - 06:03 PM

It's like the double slit experiment.  As soon as you go to measure it, the laws of nature change back to normal.


God is fooling us!!!

Well, to be serious, if they were really honest, they would let people to actually test it and not make some lame excuse like "the scientists are hiding their names".

#37 RighteousReason

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Posted 09 July 2007 - 11:07 PM

inthishouseweobeythelawsofthermodynamics

#38 Live Forever

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Posted 09 July 2007 - 11:16 PM

inthishouseweobeythelawsofthermodynamics


wemustprotectthishouse (ofthermodynamics)




#39 modelcadet

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Posted 09 July 2007 - 11:25 PM

The owner of Under Armour went to my high school. When I played football, we got free gear. I'm certain the marketing video is based off of some of our old-school war cries.

#40 Luna

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Posted 10 July 2007 - 08:00 AM

inthishouseweobeythelawsofthermodynamics


I hate thermodynamics.

#41 Luna

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Posted 10 July 2007 - 10:34 AM

There is something that troubles me..
Aren't Breeder reactor supposed to be a free energy source?
http://en.wikipedia....Breeder_reactor
http://en.wikipedia....breeder_reactor

I mean, by what I read, which correct me if it's worng, the only problem with the process is our methods and it potentionally can be unlimited energy?

I guess I must be worng here somehow as if I was correct, the law of physics would be written diffrently..

#42 Luna

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Posted 11 July 2007 - 12:15 AM

And more thing that confuse me, people claim anti matter can be source of unlimited energy, but it's still subject to e=mc2.
so if you want to repeat the process, you probably need the whole energy you just got? and more?

Maybe someone else can explain.

#43 Live Forever

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Posted 11 July 2007 - 12:17 AM

And more thing that confuse me, people claim anti matter can be source of unlimited energy, but it's still subject to e=mc2.
so if you want to repeat the process, you probably need the whole energy you just got? and more?

Maybe someone else can explain.

I don't think anyone claims that antimatter could be a source of unlimited energy, just a greatly more efficient source than anything we have today.

#44 JohnDoe1234

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Posted 11 July 2007 - 04:52 AM

I don't think anyone claims that antimatter could be a source of unlimited energy, just a greatly more efficient source than anything we have today.

Yup. Once we can produce that stuff in substantial quantities... We'll have some nice bombs and batteries!

#45 Luna

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Posted 11 July 2007 - 07:48 AM

And cold fusion? that I heard alot people claim to be free energy, but isn't it just converting small mass to energy which means, not free energy but you lose mass?

#46 Luna

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Posted 11 July 2007 - 03:05 PM

http://www.magneticp....com/index.html

Tsk tsk.. what do you think?

#47 Luna

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Posted 11 July 2007 - 04:00 PM

http://pesn.com/2006...nt_Application/

#48 JohnDoe1234

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Posted 13 July 2007 - 10:01 PM

And cold fusion? that I heard alot people claim to be free energy, but isn't it just converting small mass to energy which means, not free energy but you lose mass?

Correct, There will never be free energy, we may find a way to sap energy from somewhere we don't currently understand, but in this universe, there is no free energy.

Fusion relies on the principle that nucleons become less massive when held together under the strong nuclear force, the mass loss is directly proportional to the energy created, but we get a hell of a lot more energy back from the mass loss than we could ever get from those particular nucleons interacting in a classical way.

#49 Luna

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Posted 14 July 2007 - 07:04 AM

Ummm.. Vacuum Energy if it's true as NASA and Magnetic Power Inc says..?
I don't see how we can get out of vacuum.. cause it dosen't exactly exist..?

#50 Aegist

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Posted 14 July 2007 - 05:54 PM

Solar Panels provide free energy. If the sun runs out, then the lack of power will be the least of our concerns. Besides, there are ~infinite suns available anyway.

All you need is to find a method of scraping energy out of the universe, like solar panels do, and converting that *free* energy into useable energy.

I think this is important to keep in mind when discounting this all out of hand as impossible. Sure, I accept that creating energy from nothing is impossible, but maybe they simply don't understand their own technology, and it isn't coming from nothing at all, maybe it is coming from a very definite source which will be identified at a later date.

Physics has already had its fair share of revolutions. Eerie action at a distance and crazy non-determinancy and all sorts of strangeness.

But upon hearing the "technical difficulties" with the demonstration...I was very very disappointed.

#51 JohnDoe1234

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Posted 15 July 2007 - 01:24 AM

Ummm.. Vacuum Energy if it's true as NASA and Magnetic Power Inc says..?
I don't see how we can get out of vacuum.. cause it dosen't exactly exist..?

Ehh.... google Zero Point Energy, it's all theoretical.

Solar Panels provide free energy.

We have to be careful with that word "free"... but I see you clarified it a little further down.

Sure, I accept that creating energy from nothing is impossible, but maybe they simply don't understand their own technology, and it isn't coming from nothing at all, maybe it is coming from a very definite source which will be identified at a later date.

Yeah, exactly my thoughts, I don't think there is free energy at any level, just sources we can't really comprehend.

Here's my crazy free energy scheme (not really free, and not really worth it):

One thing I've thought about is how to extract energy from the natural rotation, orbits, and inner convection of the planets in the solar system, no doubt some energy would be produced, but most likely at too low of levels to even be worth the effort, but here it is:

Picture a typical dynamo, power is generated by moving the field of permanent magnets perpendicular to tightly wound coils of wire, when the field around a particular section of the wire collapses, this creates a flux, this in effect "drags" electrons through the wire and creates a current, now... if we were to build a large enough coil, and set it deep enough into the earth's crust, we might be able to pick up some of the flux from the molten iron and nickel swashing around inside, since that is where the planet's magnetic field is generated.

Similar could be done by placing such a coil between two orbiting (and still geologically active) celestial bodies... [but we have to account for the inverse square law, which would make this option too impractical to even mention in a post on a forum board]

Does someone know the approximate magnetic field strength of the sun? I'll google it, but still, some info from someone who knows more about it than me would be cool.

- Or -

Use rockets with a thin wire tether and shoot them into the atmosphere during lightning storms to trigger lightning, and use the energy in the wire to drive a giant electromagnetic armature to lift something really heavy into the air, and have a self locking mechanism to keep it there, then use the converted electrical energy as gravitational potential energy and slowly let the weight fall to the ground all the while driving an array of small dynamos which output electricity (but now at levels that won't detonate even our biggest capacitors)

But again... I expect solar technology to mature greatly in the coming decades, and even if they top out at 50% efficiency, they will still be more economical than any other source. Besides RTGs of course.

EDIT: Typo

Edited by Joseph, 16 July 2007 - 06:47 AM.


#52 Ghostrider

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Posted 17 July 2007 - 06:08 AM

Use rockets with a thin wire tether and shoot them into the atmosphere during lightning storms to trigger lightning, and use the energy in the wire to drive a giant electromagnetic armature to lift something really heavy into the air, and have a self locking mechanism to keep it there, then use the converted electrical energy as gravitational potential energy and slowly let the weight fall to the ground all the while driving an array of small dynamos which output electricity (but now at levels that won't detonate even our biggest capacitors


I heard something similar to that. The idea is to launch kites so high that they fly where it is really really windy. Then these kits have propellers attached that generate electricity. The kites are held in position by wires attached to the ground which also are conductors for transporting the current back to earth.

Best idea I have thought of and then discovered that there is actually some research being done on it is in the area of converting thermal energy directly into electricity using Thermal Electric Generators (google it). This is the same principle that is used in a thermal couple and in nuclear powered deep space satellites where heat from the nuclear reaction is converted into electricity to power the satellite. Basically, wherever there is a temperature differential, a p-n junction can generate a voltage due to the differential. Some experiment was done where a small black and white television was powered using a million or so TEGs and a hot tub of water. If this could ever be done efficiently, I think it could really take off. There are many sources of temperature differentials, just often not enough to be significant. One idea though would be to get a giant magnifying glass, put it out in the sun and focus it on one of the generators while the other end could be attached to a heatsink or run underground. It could also be a great replacement for the alternator used in an internal combustion engine.

#53 JohnDoe1234

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Posted 17 July 2007 - 03:56 PM

TEGs, yeah... Never heard 'em by that acronym, rather RTGs.

I was doing some searching on direct heat to electricity conversion about a week ago, and apparently some have had some pretty good success with them, I think those have just as much potential if not more than photovoltaics.

One idea though would be to get a giant magnifying glass, put it out in the sun and focus it on one of the generators while the other end could be attached to a heatsink or run underground. It could also be a great replacement for the alternator used in an internal combustion engine.

Yeah, I would like to have a nice layer of that TEG material under my black car's paint... that thing gets HOT! during the day...

Or heat could be absorbed from goethermal vents deep within the ocean (except, you need a lot of cable which might degrade the current upon its ascent)

Also, another good term to google is: Thermionics

#54 Live Forever

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Posted 17 July 2007 - 07:52 PM

Back to the original part of the thread, the Stoern (the company developing the "free energy" Orbo device) CEO gave an interview to Engadget about all the stuff going on with it. (since the botched demonstration event) It was published today, here is the link:

http://www.engadget....-ceo-of-steorn/

(believe what he says at your own risk I suppose; The Engadget interviewer seems pretty skeptical)


.....and here is an article from the other day in the Economist saying how it is pretty much nonsense to claim "free energy":
http://www.economist...tory_id=9494346

#55 Luna

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Posted 18 July 2007 - 07:14 AM

To be honest, if Steorn were true, they wouldn't screw up a demo like that.
The end.

#56 Luna

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Posted 23 July 2007 - 05:32 AM

http://www.t-g.com/story/1218203.html

#57 Aegist

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Posted 23 July 2007 - 07:37 AM

To be honest, if Steorn were true, they wouldn't screw up a demo like that.
The end.

And if there was a real technical glitch, then it would be easily rectified or else a new demonstration would be organised shortly after. Not 'Oops, it doesn't work, Bye'

#58 JohnDoe1234

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Posted 23 July 2007 - 08:20 AM

http://www.t-g.com/story/1218203.html

Hah, those guys probably live less then 25 miles from my house... Figures the world's energy crisis would be solved by two rednecks with an old Nissan and a little help from a reporter gullible enough to spend the time listening to them.

#59 JohnDoe1234

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Posted 23 July 2007 - 08:23 AM

If someone truly finds a source of free energy, we won't hear about them in art galleries, garages, or parking lots.... They will take over the world by making trillions off of their "secret" energy supply...

And if they can't manager to do that, they are fools.

#60 Luna

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Posted 23 July 2007 - 08:39 AM

Well,
http://www.magneticpowerinc.com/
They still catch my eye because of some known people along their lines.




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