14 replies to this topic

[supastring]

Well, I realize that Post Singularity is sort of a contradiction in terms, but I put a few thoughts up about the topic here:

roboslay.com

Please check out my ramblings and let me know what you think!

[JohnDoe1234]

Nice job! I liked it, however...

Now, the cloud mind could go even one step beyond that, deciding to shut down all desires, even those for happiness and its own survival. If those desires are turned off, the cloud mind will feel no objection to simply dispersing and fading from existence.

That would certainly be the least energy-consuming route.

If it terminated all desires... I don't think it would choose such an action on the basis of saving energy... it wouldn't care

btw: I liked your ending... I've thought about that same situation: If I or any of the countless AI researchers succeeded in creating something that radically changed our life... it would almost seem like one's worth would be determined by their pre-singularity achievements or actions, because after the singularity, anyone can have or do anything... (learning additional languages being a prime example)

[supastring]

btw: I liked your ending... I've thought about that same situation: If I or any of the countless AI researchers succeeded in creating something that radically changed our life... it would almost seem like one's worth would be determined by their pre-singularity achievements or actions, because after the singularity, anyone can have or do anything... (learning additional languages being a prime example)

Yes, it would be the ultimate equaliser. I guess we'd better start achieveing asap

Blah blah blah boring and obvious

it's called "wireheading", it's not new, and "post-Singularity" isn't a contradiction in terms

Hey! I didn't want to bore you...
I'm familiar with Wireheading, but my point is that in most of the talk I've heard about the Singularity, the conclusion of the story seems to go 'we expand out into space and harness all matter and energy', but really this seems very unlikely to me...I wanted to succinctly state what I thought the likely conclusion is.

[JohnDoe1234]

Yeah, I see your conclusion as a fairly reasonable one, however, this all assumes that we are still limited to 3D space despite the fact that we are super-intelligent... I very much hope that we are not ultimately confined to this space... it would be big let down...you know

[erin_devereux]

because after the singularity, anyone can have or do anything...[quote]

Wow this sounds incredibly boring, more like hell to me . Life isn't fun without some kind of effort or challenge to obtain what you want.

[basho]

because after the singularity, anyone can have or do anything...

Wow this sounds incredibly boring, more like hell to me . Life isn't fun without some kind of effort or challenge to obtain what you want.

You could always introduce some self-induced limitations and selective amnesia, and then arrange to be placed in a challenging environment, either real or simulated. Maybe you have done this already and are currently enjoying the challenges of life as a mortal in a simulated 21st century environment?

[JohnDoe1234]

because after the singularity, anyone can have or do anything...

Wow this sounds incredibly boring, more like hell to me . Life isn't fun without some kind of effort or challenge to obtain what you want.

Hmm, I think I mis-expressed myself here... I was using the word 'anything' as a way of describing what someone may want (not the literal sense), for instance... (and I've mentioned this before in the "living forever is boring" sort of threads)...

If a person is Not already an inquisitive, curious, or a creative person, they will almost certainly view the singularity as a hell after they have explored what they believe is "everything entertaining"... now, If they Are an inquisitive, curious, or creative person... a scientist, explorer, philosopher, etc, they will have a lot more fun, and it is less likely that their means of entertainment will be solved for them.

So, when I say something like that, I am meaning only people who do not seek challenges, like to explore, or create new things... I am speaking of people who just float along in life taking everything for granted, and don't spend time to try to understand things.

Personally, I am very excited in anticipation to the singularity... There are (I would like to say "Almost infinite", but that doesn't make sense) possibilities for creating things, in this universe, there is so much matter to tinker with, that once we begin to augment ourselves we will only bring ourselves to the next level of creativity and it will only make things even more exciting.

So yeah, I completely agree with you erin_devereux, I just didn't explain myself well enough

[erin_devereux]

because after the singularity, anyone can have or do anything...

Wow this sounds incredibly boring, more like hell to me . Life isn't fun without some kind of effort or challenge to obtain what you want.

You could always introduce some self-induced limitations and selective amnesia, and then arrange to be placed in a challenging environment, either real or simulated. Maybe you have done this already and are currently enjoying the challenges of life as a mortal in a simulated 21st century environment?

Self-induced limitations can be fun, they are when I play Guilty Gear XX. I can't think of a situation where selective amnesia would be fun. As for enjoying the challenges of life as a mortal in a simulated 21st century, not so much [sfty]. I enjoy hiking, running, math problems, but not things such disease or getting your credit card stolen even if they were just a simulation.

[apocalypse]

Even after the singularity, there will still be new worlds to explore, new births, humans, children. It will be our turn to guide them, as they've guided us, and taught us. We will be the ones to see it through for those who've yet to pass this point.

For we will have finally access to Omega, the final solution, the first and last answer, the eternal question and the eternal answer... All dimensions, all time, all that has been open to decide the future of all history and all that has come before. The eternal law, the final equations necessary, those needed to create an immortal celestial world.

Nice job! I liked it, however...

Now, the cloud mind could go even one step beyond that, deciding to shut down all desires, even those for happiness and its own survival. If those desires are turned off, the cloud mind will feel no objection to simply dispersing and fading from existence.

That would certainly be the least energy-consuming route.

If it terminated all desires... I don't think it would choose such an action on the basis of saving energy... it wouldn't care

btw: I liked your ending... I've thought about that same situation: If I or any of the countless AI researchers succeeded in creating something that radically changed our life... it would almost seem like one's worth would be determined by their pre-singularity achievements or actions, because after the singularity, anyone can have or do anything... (learning additional languages being a prime example)

Or we would understand that everyone had a little help, and those with the greatest handicap, those who were not even born... Maybe they had the greatest handicap of all. Everyone who gave their best, and keeps giving on their best in hopes of a better future for mankind... a battle without end, those willing to keep on fighting forever, even for those that have fallen, taking on their workload, perfect distribution of resources.

[AgentNyder]

Humanity has merged with its machines, its intelligence level has increased exponentially, and everyone can communicate with each other instantaneously - billions of minds have become the cells of one giant mind.

Do we know all humanity will become a hive mind? Maybe the hive mind will be searchable, like google, and intelligent entities will gather into communitarian type networks (as it is with the web now with forums and so on).

And, I get the impression that you are putting all sentients into one camp. The singularity, I think, will be about diversity. Everyone will have different customisations and capabilities to their own preferences. Some will shut out their desires, no doubt - others will use the 'pleasure button' and there will be those who simply just enhance their current biological chemistry (while still retaining the benefits of upgrading).

Besides upgraded humans, we will also most likely have ai agents continuously working on solving the problems you mention (again, diversity in all types of intelligence).

[apocalypse]

Do we know all humanity will become a hive mind?  Maybe the hive mind will be searchable, like google, and intelligent entities will gather into communitarian type networks (as it is with the web now with forums and so on).

And, I get the impression that you are putting all sentients into one camp.  The singularity, I think, will be about diversity.  Everyone will have different customisations and capabilities to their own preferences.  Some will shut out their desires, no doubt - others will use the 'pleasure button' and there will be those who simply just enhance their current biological chemistry (while still retaining the benefits of upgrading).

Besides upgraded humans, we will also most likely have ai agents continuously working on solving the problems you mention (again, diversity in all types of intelligence).

I like this view, and I'm also of the view that we're in postsingularity times, the tech is accelerating so fast that even I'm having trouble keeping up(and I'm into sci-tech news practically 24-7). Of course just because we've passed the point in the 'can't keep up' category doesn't mean squat, I too need physical proof. Those 300 thousand years of individual non repeating song ipods, with indefinitely lasting batteries, would be a nice start, especially with pocket high rez projectors and projected keyboards and separate wifi cubic mice.

[modelcadet]

'What are we going to do with our lives when farm machinery takes all our jobs?!?!?'
-Some past futurist

The idea of the "Singularity" is encouraging, but I do believe discussing the 'post singularity' is moot, as others have mentioned above.

We should attempt to redefine what we mean by this 'singularity.' Unless it is a 'hard take off' period, caused by some event such as AI, the Internet (which IS an AI), the printing press, or prefabricated rings of cream cheese, us frogs won't notice how hot our technological bathwater is getting.

I think we need to stop discussing the Singularity from a macro-futurist perspective.

[halcyondays]

I'll be surprised if after the singularity there isn't a major nuclear war because of the power a country would have with a super intelligent AI. Not to mention the religious folk and all the other conservatives who don't like drastic change in their lives. Hopefully in 40 or 50 years when the singularity happens (if it ever does) it will be with a generation of people who are open to the possibilities rather than close minded idiots that we have running society currently.

[JohnDoe1234]

I'll be surprised if after the singularity there isn't a major nuclear war because of the power a country would have with a super intelligent AI. Not to mention the religious folk and all the other conservatives who don't like drastic change in their lives. Hopefully in 40 or 50 years when the singularity happens (if it ever does) it will be with a generation of people who are open to the possibilities rather than close minded idiots that we have running society currently.

Well... I would imagine after a singularity that nuclear weapons might be seen as something similar to an M18A1 clayborn... if a singularity happens, the we will have weapons of Mass-Mass-Mass destruction... And the world will probably be monitored/run by whoever builds the darned AI first...

But I don't really buy into the claim that this technology will lead us to destruction...

[apocalypse]

'What are we going to do with our lives when farm machinery takes all our jobs?!?!?'
-Some past futurist

The idea of the "Singularity" is encouraging, but I do believe discussing the 'post singularity' is moot, as others have mentioned above. 

We should attempt to redefine what we mean by this 'singularity.'  Unless it is a 'hard take off' period, caused by some event such as AI, the Internet (which IS an AI), the printing press, or prefabricated rings of cream cheese, us frogs won't notice how hot our technological bathwater is getting. 

I think we need to stop discussing the Singularity from a macro-futurist perspective.

What I really want to know, because I'm already past the uhh ahh superintelligences helping us out. Is whether the most powerful hypothetical machine ever conceived by any man is possible to construct in finite time or not, especially in posthuman society. That is an indestructible machine capable of granting access to all possible states of existence, a reality/existence/law traversal/manipulation device. One that can instantaneously grant any wish, and make traveling anywhere through the multiverse a mere whim away.

The beautiful thing is if such a device is at all possible, it can grant any conceivable wish, including immortality eternal youth and unlimited amounts of resources for all individuals of said civilization and the ability to traverse alternate dimensions/worlds/reality instantaneously, one could actually travel to the worlds acted/interpreted in movies and books for real and transfer one's consciousness to any character ever conceived in any possible state of existence, eternal bliss in my book.

I believe that is the answer to the fermi paradox, not only vast computational power can be extracted from parallel universes, but enough power to manipulate the nature of reality itself. All other civilizations that have preceded us have simply built such a wonderful monument/device and are now instantaneously traversing to any point in any possibility that can conceivably existence. Why bother colonizing this particular universe, if you can attain immortality and unlimited resources in alternate universes, a way to get out of this reality and travel across all possible realities/worlds/universes.