11 replies to this topic

[EmbraceUnity]

Considering that I take many different supplements, and have done my best to construct an ideal regimen for my age, I am wondering if there are any actual studies of people with a rigorous supplement regimen.

Are there any studies of people who take at least something like the LEF Mix or Ortho-Core, if not more rigorous?

Since there are so many variables, it is hard to know if any conflict badly. Most of the studies we see test individual supplements.

[Shepard]

That would almost certainly be a negatory.

[Karomesis]

I'd love to see one with some of the people here and other supplement nuts.

My guess is that all cause mortality would be significantly decreased over controls [glasses]

obviously lifespan studies are out of the question especially considering alot of the supps are only 5-10 years old.

[PWAIN]

How about a study like this using mice. It wouldn't be perfect but would give some idea.

[edward]

How about a study like this using mice. It wouldn't be perfect but would give some idea.

This is something that I would love to see and have wished for but I don't think will occur.

I'd love to see a mice or rat study using the average supplement user's dosages (adjusted to rodent dosages) of: alpha lipoic acid, t-resveratrol, acetyl l-carnitine, melatonin, Bentofiamine, l-carnosine, DMAE, grape seed, green tea, pomegrante..... etcetera etcetera all combined together compared to no supplementation, calorie restriction and maybe a few different combinations of multiple supplements.... But alas I don't think I will see this unless one of us gets some rats and does it.

[krillin]

Here's something close.

http://www.ebmonline.../full/228/7/800

Dosages for the mice were reformulated based on amounts commonly prescribed to humans. Firstly, values were adjusted for the smaller body size of the mice. Next, the dosages were increased by a factor of ten based on the higher gram-specific metabolic rate (and consequently faster utilization and turnover) of mice compared to humans

Vitamin B1 0.72 mg/day
Vitamin B3 0.72 mg/day
Vitamin B6 0.72 mg/day
Vitamin B12 0.72 mcg/day
Vitamin C 3.6 mg/day
Vitamin D 2.5 IU/day
Vitamin E 1.44 IU/day
Acetyl L-Carnitine 14.4 mg/day
Alpha-Lipoic Acid 0.72 mg/day
ASA 2.5 mg/day
Beta Carotene 50.0 IU/day
Bioflavinoids 4.32 mg/day
Chromium Picolinate 1.44 mcg/day
Cod Liver Oil 5.04 IU/day
CoEnzyme Q10 0.44 mg/day
DHEA 0.15 mg/day
Flax Seed oil 21.6 mg/day
Folic Acid 0.01 mg/day
Garlic 21.6 mcg/day
Ginger 7.2 mg/day
Gingko Biloba 1.44 mg/day
Ginseng (Canadian) 8.64 mg/day
Green Tea Extracts 7.2 mg/day
L-Glutathione 0.36 mg/day
Magnesium 0.72 mg/day
Melatonin 0.01 mg/day
N-Acetyl Cysteine 7.2 mg/day
Potassium 0.36 mg/day
Rutin 0.72 mg/day
Selenium 1.08 mcg/day
Zinc (chelated) 0.14 mg/day

[lucid]

Very interesting study. I wish they recorded the lifespans of the various groups.

I wish they had more data points for treated controls. Treated Transgenic do much better than untreated transgenic. Oddly, treated transgenic perform worse than untreated transgenic @ 4.5 logarithm days (I don't understand the scale labeling for log days but w/e). Very interesting study though, thanks krillin.

*edit*
Oh I see the log days they are on the top part of the x-axis (labeled 90, 245 and 665) This is very interesting where as you can see with the supplemented creatures that they continue to have improved cognitive functions through their entire life. Think of it for people, no senility

It is also worth pointing out that the supplement treated non-transgenic mice (even though there are only a couple of data points) perform significantly better than their non-treated controls. Further, they are on the line tangent to the begining of the non-treated non-transgenic control group (meaning that should there have been more data points, we could assume that the treated mice continue learning and improving through their lifetime at a constant rate instead of eventually regressing)
*edit*

Edited by lucid, 29 June 2007 - 06:45 PM.

[EmbraceUnity]

The Life Extension Foundation should do studies of this sort... they fund this kind of stuff all the time anyways.

[medievil]

what i really like to see is a study with a combo of deprenyl, resveratrol, benagene, metformin, calory restriction, dihn lanh,glisodin, ...
that would be very interesting...

[krillin]

The Life Extension Foundation should do studies of this sort... they fund this kind of stuff all the time anyways.

They did one with some smaller cocktails.

http://hiqnews.megaf..._Life_Spans.htm

[lucid]

And what they found:

The general conclusion that Dr. Splindler reaches is that supplements only shorten the average life spans of mice. (Can you imagine how this news was rceived by the Life Extension Foundation, which sponsored this study? The LEF derives its revenue primarily from the sale of supplements.) This is particularly true of coenzyme Q-10 (the blue curve in the right-hand chart and one constituent in the pink curve in the left-hand chart). But there are a couple of interesting points to be observed. The control group dies off by 42 months. This is phenomenally long for ordinarry fully-fed mice. In his 2000 book, "Beyond the 120-Year Diet", Dr. Roy Walford's challenge to life extension techniques other than caloric restriction is: "Show me the 45-month-old mice." (Most fully fed mice don't live longer than 38 months.) But in this study, the normally fed mice live a maximum of 42 months, and the supplemented mice live 45 months. In human terms, this would correspond to another 7.5 years of life. Clearly, alpha-lipoic acid, acetyl-l-carnitine, and NADH are potent life extenders. Co-enzyme Q-10 has a "dark side". A new synthetic analog is available that supposedly doesn't have this flip side.
    Of course, these supplements aren't as effective as caloric restriction, but one wonders what the right combination of alpha-lipoic acid, acetyl-l-carnitine, melatonin, NADH, and pregnenolene would do. Are there combinations that could push this to 48 months? That would represent another 15 years in human terms!
    Certainly, none of these supplements offer dramatic improvements in life span. Some of the tricks for avoiding cancer, heart disease, cardiovascular disease, hypertension, Parkinson's disease, Alzheimer's disease, etc., may help improve one's ability to dodge the degenerative disease that take many of us away earlier than others.

[baertacgraff]

We're our own best combo, lab mouse and scientist. After much study, I've concluded that at times of imbalances, mostly with my hormones, it is best to stop and and reevaluate how I feel, what I'm thinking about, what issues might be up for me at the time. Lots of times, after a day or so, the conditions I tend to supplement for begin to clear up by themselves. My state of health and wellbeing appears to improve.