12 replies to this topic

[inawe]

I came across ImmInst (and then joined) while looking for suppliers of resveratrol. I was taking small amount of resveratrol. Then I read about some research and Sinclair's 2006 Nature paper and decided to take more resveratrol. Actually the clincher was Auwerx development of Olympic mice.
Now I'm taking 1.5-2 gr/day. I saw improvement in my cholesterol profile but not on glucose. As far as exercise nothing even close to an Auwerx mouse. Should I increase the dosage? But then I thought: the relevant papers have been out for almost a year. How come athletes are not taking massive amounts of resveratrol? We can be sure that if Auwerx miracle could be reproduced in humans, athletes would be swallowing the stuff (but they don't). Could be that mouse and human physiology/metabolism are quite different. While mice can more easily increase the number of mitochondria, it is much harder for us.
So the moral of the story is: Resveratrol is very effective for mice. For humans it's not that clear.

[Shepard]

So the moral of the story is: Resveratrol is very effective for mice. For humans it's not that clear.

At least it has good company.

[maestro949]

How come athletes are not taking massive amounts of resveratrol?

From the Boston Herald...

When Sirtris Pharmaceuticals met with New York investors earlier this year and word got out that Red Sox owner John Henry had invested in the company, some of the deep-pocketed Yankees fans joked that the high-flying Sox at the time must be using resveratrol.

Maybe the fact that the Red Sox double digit lead has evaporated is due to the placebo affect wearing off. [lol]

Seriously though, I wouldn't be surprised if a few athletes were popping it on a trial basis but it's not something they'd shout from rooftops.

[dannov]

Res is still pretty cutting-edge, athletes usually are taken care of by nutritionists and sports physicians, both of which rely on "tried and true" rather than experimental (steroids anyone?!).

What sort of Res are you taking? If you're taking Resveratrol 50%, you're only taking .75g - 1g a day of trans-res. Also, perhaps the amount in mice to exhibit this "Olympic" quality was proportionally larger than 1.5-2g. Maybe it was 4g when compared to humans.

Also, are you ingesting at least your bodyweight in grams of protein per day, broken up over the day in a number of small, protein-rich meals? There are a lot of factors to consider.

[tintinet]

Resveratrol is a primary component of a new supplement sold by Ergopharm, an entity headed by Patrick Arnold, of BALCO fame.

Given the prevalence of resveratrol in several "body building" supplements, I'd be surprised if some individuals have not at least experimented with "massive" doses.

[maxwatt]

Bear in mind that professional athletes train a lot, which produces the same effect resveratrol does. Wouldn't be such an advantage then.

[stephen_b]

I could see advantages for the aging athlete. Roger Clemens?

Stephen

[inawe]

I based my speculation on the fact that we haven't seen reports of huge increases in human performance due to resveratrol (as in an Auwerx mouse). We can be sure that such increases would be advertised by whoever sells the stuff to athletes.
Dannov_ I take certified 99%+ resveratrol. So when I stated I take 1.5-2 gr/day I actually meant 1.485-1.98 gr/day. I weigh less than 60 Kg and take in a lot of protein. Not "in a number of small, protein-rich meals" because I have a life to live.

[dannov]

I based my speculation on the fact that we haven't seen reports of huge increases in human performance due to resveratrol (as in an Auwerx mouse). We can be sure that such increases would be advertised by whoever sells the stuff to athletes.
Dannov_ I take certified 99%+ resveratrol. So when I stated I take 1.5-2 gr/day I actually meant 1.485-1.98 gr/day. I weigh less than 60 Kg and take in a lot of protein. Not "in a number of small, protein-rich meals" because I have a life to live.

I live my life fine and manage to break up my meals; it's actually quite easy, especially with a structured full-time 8 to 5'er. It does take time to get used to however, have to make it into a habit that you don't think about.

I honestly don't think that many people have been mega-dosing with Resveratrol. Tin brought up Pat Arnold--I've spoken with Pat quite a few times at bb.com, and his product is what got me aware of Resveratrol to begin with. His reasoning for using Res in 6-OXO Extreme isn't to improve athletic performance per se, but moreso because the whole idea behind 6-OXO is to boost natural testosterone production. He read the study on the mice that had elevated test levels, and then did some in-house studies on a few guys, the majority by which exhibited noticeably raised test levels. He's arguably the best and obviously well-known chemist in the industry, very respectable and knowledgeable.

[inawe]

Bear in mind that professional athletes train a lot, which produces the same effect resveratrol does.  Wouldn't be such an advantage then.

This is a very good point. Seems that people who train or exercise a lot shouldn't expect much improvement in athletic performance from resveratrol. Auwerx mice were not athletes before the experiment.
If we list possible reasons for taking resveratrol:
1) Cancer protection
2) Neural protection
3) Antiviral effects
4) Life extension (protection from other problems)
5) Athletic performance

Only 5) was shown in the literature to require higher doses. Which would be redundant for people who already do a lot of exercise. For 1) to 4) lower doses seem to be enough. Thus, am I taking too much of this stuff?

[dannov]

I figured you'd ask--"Thus, am I taking too little of this stuff?"

Double your dosage, and see how it affects your athletic performance over the course of a month.

[maxwatt]

Bear in mind that professional athletes train a lot, which produces the same effect resveratrol does.  Wouldn't be such an advantage then.

This is a very good point. Seems that people who train or exercise a lot shouldn't expect much improvement in athletic performance from resveratrol. Auwerx mice were not athletes before the experiment.
If we list possible reasons for taking resveratrol:
1) Cancer protection
2) Neural protection
3) Antiviral effects
4) Life extension (protection from other problems)
5) Athletic performance

Only 5) was shown in the literature to require higher doses. Which would be redundant for people who already do a lot of exercise. For 1) to 4) lower doses seem to be enough. Thus, am I taking too much of this stuff?

6) Resveratrol reduces inflammation through down-regulation of F-kappa B; I've found large doses necessary to reverse some of the more severe symptoms of osteo-arthritis.

[inawe]

6) Resveratrol reduces inflammation through down-regulation of F-kappa B; I've found large doses necessary to reverse some of the more severe symptoms of osteo-arthritis.

Yes, inflammation reduction is very important not only for arthritis (it can screw up the cardiovascular system). Problem is that our only recourse is to do what Maxwatt is doing: increase doses until symptoms get better. All reported research are in vitro, in mouse (in yeast ...). There should be human clinical trials of resveratrol for inflammation.
NIH is sponsoring only 4 resveratrol trials, all for cancer. One of them is "Resveratrol in Preventing Cancer in Healthy Patients". Besides side effects, the purpose of phase I is to find "the best dose of resveratrol in preventing cancer in healthy participants". How long would that take?
Also, "Cohorts of 10 participants receive escalating doses of resveratrol until the maximum tolerated dose (MTD) is determined". What happens if they are given 1/4 Kg with no problem?
One useful thing is that they are going to "Determine the concentration of resveratrol and its metabolites in the plasma, urine and feces".