13 replies to this topic

[eon fathom]

I think if there is an AI and brain-computer section, there should really be a mind uploading section.

It's also a fairly well recognized method of easily making backups, upgrading intelligence, and generally ensuring immortality. Many people think it could happen before AGI, or even nanotech. Many AI researchers also assume that one of the first tasks for an AGI would be to upload humans, because of the many benefits.

Do others agree that there should be a separate section? Or should there be more discussion on uploading before creating it? (although there seems to be very little discussion on it now, though maybe a section would help?)

also, while I'm at it, be sure to check out http://en.wikipedia..../Mind_uploading if you don't know what I'm talking about.

[caston]

A mind upload would have to simulate your mitochondria in order to have any chance of being you.

[Spiral Architect]

A mind upload would have to simulate your mitochondria in order to have any chance of being you.

Why?

[caston]

Because the Mitchondria is the engine of each and every cell. They produce the energy in your body. Women have babies so they can pass down their mitchondrial linage. Some men become gay so they can share their mitchondrial genes with other men.

The patterns formed by mitchondria make the personality.

Edited by caston, 07 January 2008 - 02:25 PM.

[Spiral Architect]

Because the Mitchondria is the engine of each and every cell. They produce the energy in your body. Women have babies so they can pass down their mitchondrial linage. Some men become gay so they can share their mitchondrial genes with other men.

The patterns formed by mitchondria make the personality.

Right ...

[caston]

Kane: Check out sex, power suicide: mitochondria and the meaning of life by Nick Lane:

http://www.nick-lane.net/

Edited by caston, 07 January 2008 - 05:05 PM.

[Spiral Architect]

Will it explain how men become gay to share their genes with other men?

[caston]

I don't think that he says those exact words but the chapters on gender are *very* interesting.

[eon fathom]

A mind upload would have to simulate your mitochondria in order to have any chance of being you.

I think a realistic upload, (which is, after all, what we want right?) would definitely have to take into account mitochondria, dna, etc. but could have simplified rules to not need to simulate a separate copy for each cell.

The point of this post however, is that there should probably be a separate section to discuss these things.

[Reno]

Women have babies so they can pass down their mitchondrial linage. Some men become gay so they can share their mitchondrial genes with other men.

The patterns formed by mitchondria make the personality.

I don't think being gay is that simple. Every time people try and simply their world they get slapped in the face by complications.

Edited by bobscrachy, 10 January 2008 - 06:11 PM.

[Richard Leis]

Eon, I seconded your request in the Suggestions section:

http://www.imminst.o...showtopic=19833

[Lazarus Long]

Also I want to emphasize that in that thread we will exclusively examine the aspects of the specific proposal and little of what has been discussed in this thread so far will be particularly helpful. I do think the subject is important however and I would like to split the thread as it has evolved into to an analysis of mitochondrial aspects of personality, and what needs to be *quantified* and how it can be *quantified* in order to be converted into translatable information capable of being transcribed off a brain, onto a synthetic substrate and then back into (as desired) a biological substrate.

I should add that my personal opinion is that there is nothing wrong with the subject remaining under BCI but I am willing to be persuaded and let's pursue that discussion under the appropriate thread that Richard began.

[nanostuff]

A mind upload would have to simulate your mitochondria in order to have any chance of being you.

I think a realistic upload, (which is, after all, what we want right?) would definitely have to take into account mitochondria, dna, etc. but could have simplified rules to not need to simulate a separate copy for each cell.

The point of this post however, is that there should probably be a separate section to discuss these things.

People are a bit too uptight about the 'exactness' of the simulation. If you insist on absolute perfection, you might as well die now, it's never going to happen. What you may not be taking into account is that the biological system itself is far from perfect, the simulation doesn't have to replicate it's flaws... shouldn't replicate it's flaws. What is necessary is to obtain the structural data of the brain network (fairly easy), and synaptic potential between neurons (somewhat harder, very conceivable). The biological underlyings of what makes the neurons tick is completely irrelevant as long as they tick as they did.

[basho]

People are a bit too uptight about the 'exactness' of the simulation.

Exactly. For example, no one these days argues that an aircraft isn't really flying just because it doesn't have blood flowing though veins to power wing muscles. Once we have true, substrate-independent intelligence, no one will argue that you are not really conscious because you are implemented on hardware running a higher-level model that reproduces the effects of a biological brain without modeling the entire biological substrate.