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Huperzine A


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#1 dr_chaos

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Posted 16 February 2008 - 02:32 PM


I'm taking about 12.5 mcg huperzine(1/4 of a tablet) per day since 2 weeks. I'm feeling wide awake and everything is much more "clear" than normally. This effect is quite different from the one you get using stimulants. It feels as if somebody had upped the contrast on reality. Although I don't have trouble sleeping and I don't feel manic. It's not much of a problem, but strange nonetheless and since I don't know what this will lead to, I will stop using huperzine. Suggestions?

#2 Rags847

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Posted 16 February 2008 - 02:57 PM

I'm taking about 12.5 mcg huperzine(1/4 of a tablet) per day since 2 weeks. I'm feeling wide awake and everything is much more "clear" than normally. This effect is quite different from the one you get using stimulants. It feels as if somebody had upped the contrast on reality. Although I don't have trouble sleeping and I don't feel manic. It's not much of a problem, but strange nonetheless and since I don't know what this will lead to, I will stop using huperzine. Suggestions?


I tried a day recently of no nootropic but CDP-Choline and spaced out four 250 mg pills (1g total for the day) and experieced a similar super-clearness, bright-eyed sort of state as you are describing.
Interesting effect.
My concern with nootropics is down regulation if used daily and long-term.
Maybe I'll save them for special days.
Exam days, etc.

Edited by Rags847, 16 February 2008 - 02:58 PM.


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#3 mystery

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Posted 16 February 2008 - 05:07 PM

I'm taking about 12.5 mcg huperzine(1/4 of a tablet) per day since 2 weeks. I'm feeling wide awake and everything is much more "clear" than normally. This effect is quite different from the one you get using stimulants. It feels as if somebody had upped the contrast on reality. Although I don't have trouble sleeping and I don't feel manic. It's not much of a problem, but strange nonetheless and since I don't know what this will lead to, I will stop using huperzine. Suggestions?


If this is not specifically what you are looking for, than stop taking it. Maybe use it when you are need this effect, like for countering tiredness, or improving object recognition for various reasons.

I found that huperzine totally screwed up my sleep quality and schedule. Than I read somewhere that brain levels of acetylcholine actually go down during slow wave sleep.

Playing with brain chemistry is a tricky process. It's probably generally best done occasionally and/or subtly. And if doing so doesn't give you any desirable benefit, than it's much better to let it return to its natural balanced condition IMO.

#4 nightlight

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Posted 24 February 2008 - 03:25 PM

I'm taking about 12.5 mcg huperzine(1/4 of a tablet) per day since 2 weeks. I'm feeling wide awake and everything is much more "clear" than normally. This effect is quite different from the one you get using stimulants. It feels as if somebody had upped the contrast on reality.


What brand are you using? I have noticed the same thought sharpening effect (analogous to visual difference after cleaning gunked up eyeglasses), but using 50 mcg Huperzine, Swanson brand. My father in law, who is ~90 yo, needs about 400 mcg (also Swanson) to notice this effect.

#5 luminous

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Posted 24 February 2008 - 04:36 PM

I'm taking about 12.5 mcg huperzine(1/4 of a tablet) per day since 2 weeks. I'm feeling wide awake and everything is much more "clear" than normally. This effect is quite different from the one you get using stimulants. It feels as if somebody had upped the contrast on reality. Although I don't have trouble sleeping and I don't feel manic. It's not much of a problem, but strange nonetheless and since I don't know what this will lead to, I will stop using huperzine. Suggestions?

I have been taking Vitamin Shoppe's huperzine (50 mcg) plus ginkgo (50 mg) for about six months. I haven't noticed anything special. I WISH I experienced what you are experiencing. With everything seeming clearer, sharper reality, no trouble sleeping, no apparent problems...I don't really see the down side. Here's a pretty good description of what it does:

http://www.drugdiges.....ine+A,00.html

During the past few years, huperzine A, an alkaloid in Chinese club moss, has been studied extensively for its potential in treating dementias such as Alzheimer's disease. Dementia is an increasing deficiency in thought processes caused by brain damage, disease, or exposure to chemicals. Alkaloids are plant compounds that contain nitrogen. They usually taste bitter and many of them have medical properties. Like the prescription drugs currently available for individuals with Alzheimer's, huperzine A temporarily blocks an enzyme known as acetylcholinesterase, which is concentrated in the brain, spinal cord, and red blood cells. This enzyme, also called cholinesterase, breaks down one of the body's neurotransmitters, acetylcholine. Neurotransmitters are chemicals that carry messages from nerve cells to other cells. Acetylcholine plays a role in learning, remembering, and thinking; and decreased amounts of it are associated with conditions involving the loss of mental functioning. By reducing the activity of acetylcholinesterase, huperzine A may help to reduce the breakdown of acetylcholine, keeping more of it the blood. Frequently called a "cholinergic" effect, the increase in acetylcholine may help preserve or even restore memory. Several studies of memory-impaired animals and humans have shown that taking huperzine A may help to relieve dementia. Additionally, in a small study of teenagers, huperzine A appeared to enhance general mental functioning when it was taken consistently for as little as one month. However, more research is needed before huperzine A can be recommended for either dementia or general memory improvement.

Granted, there hasn't been a whole lot of research in humans (I know of at least one clinical trial going on right now), but the herb has been used for centuries in China. If I had the symptoms you described above, huperzine would be my HG supplement.

#6 edward

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Posted 24 February 2008 - 07:44 PM

dr. Chaos, how old are you? Just curious, I have some hup A and I have played around with it but haven't really gotten the type of effect you mentioned, I'm thinking I should try a smaller dose, 50 mcg seems to make me "tense" like too much acetylcholine, even without my usual low dose piracetam and choline precursors. I am 30 years old.

Another thing that turns me off to acetylcholinesterase inhibitors is the fact that they don't slow the progression of Alzheimer's, they are just temporary fixes, at least from all the studies I have seen as well as my experience with patients (I recently did a clinical rotation in a geriatric facility and almost everyone has been on Aricept (donepezil) or previously tacrine or some other acetylcholinesterase inhibitor for a long time and they all have gotten worse).

So aside from some short term cognitive boosting I don't see the benefit for a younger person taking such a drug long term? Maybe I am missing something? Comments?

#7 krillin

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Posted 24 February 2008 - 09:17 PM

So aside from some short term cognitive boosting I don't see the benefit for a younger person taking such a drug long term? Maybe I am missing something? Comments?


I don't touch it myself, but there could be a benefit.

Cell Mol Neurobiol. 2008 Feb;28(2):173-83.
Non-cholinergic Effects of Huperzine A: Beyond Inhibition of Acetylcholinesterase.
Zhang HY, Yan H, Tang XC.
State Key Laboratory of Drug Research, Shanghai Institute of Materia Medica, Chinese Academy of Sciences, 555 Zu Chong Zhi Rd, Shanghai, 201203, China.

The use of acetylcholinesterase inhibitors to decrease the breakdown of the neurotransmitter acetylcholine has been the main symptomatic therapy for mild to moderate Alzheimer's patients, though the etiology of Alzheimer's disease remains unclear and seems to involve multiple factors. Further evidence has indicated that some of these acetylcholinesterase inhibitors also have non-cholinergic functions on the pathogenesis of Alzheimer's disease including the formation and deposition of beta-amyloid. Huperzine A, a potent and reversible inhibitor of acetylcholinesterase that was initially isolated from a Chinese herb, has been found to improve cognitive deficits in a broad range of animal models and has been used for Alzheimer's disease treatment in China. The novel neuroprotective effects of huperzine A might yield beneficial effects in Alzheimer's disease therapy and provide a potential template for the design of new selective and powerful anti-Alzheimer's drugs. The present paper gives an overview on the neuroprotective effects of huperzine A beyond its acetylcholinesterase inhibition. These effects include regulating beta-amyloid precursor protein metabolism, protecting against beta-amyloid-mediated oxidative stress and apoptosis. The structure-function relationship of huperzine A is also discussed.

PMID: 17657601

#8 drmz

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Posted 24 February 2008 - 09:26 PM

Maybe drinking alot of green tea ?

Investigation of the Mechanism of Enhanced Effect of EGCG on Huperzine A's Inhibition of Acetylcholinesterase Activity in Rats by a Multispectroscopic Method.Xiao J, Chen X, Zhang L, Talbot SG, Li GC, Xu M.
qin_zhu1979@yahoo.com.

The mechanism of enhanced effect of (-)-epigallocatechin-3-gallate (EGCG) on huperzine A's (HUP) inhibition of acetylcholinesterase (AChE) activity in rats was investigated. The inhibitory effects of HUP at 10 and 5 microg/kg on AChE activity were quite weak in the whole phase. In contrast, upon addition of EGCG (100 mg/kg) to the HUP 10 and 5 microg/kg groups, remarkably enhanced inhibitory effects with maximum inhibitory percentages of 90.94 and 88.13% were observed under the same conditions. EGCG also can greatly prolong the inhibitory time. The mechanism of the enhanced effects of EGCG on HUP's inhibition of AChE activity was investigated by steady fluorescence spectroscopy, infrared spectroscopy, and ultraviolet spectroscopy. HUP hardly interacted with the main transport protein, whereas there was a very strong binding interaction between EGCG and bovine serum albumin. The enhanced transport of HUP is a possible cause of the enhanced effect of EGCG on HUP bioactivity.

#9 edward

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 04:37 AM

Maybe drinking alot of green tea ?

Investigation of the Mechanism of Enhanced Effect of EGCG on Huperzine A's Inhibition of Acetylcholinesterase Activity in Rats by a Multispectroscopic Method.Xiao J, Chen X, Zhang L, Talbot SG, Li GC, Xu M.
qin_zhu1979@yahoo.com.

The mechanism of enhanced effect of (-)-epigallocatechin-3-gallate (EGCG) on huperzine A's (HUP) inhibition of acetylcholinesterase (AChE) activity in rats was investigated. The inhibitory effects of HUP at 10 and 5 microg/kg on AChE activity were quite weak in the whole phase. In contrast, upon addition of EGCG (100 mg/kg) to the HUP 10 and 5 microg/kg groups, remarkably enhanced inhibitory effects with maximum inhibitory percentages of 90.94 and 88.13% were observed under the same conditions. EGCG also can greatly prolong the inhibitory time. The mechanism of the enhanced effects of EGCG on HUP's inhibition of AChE activity was investigated by steady fluorescence spectroscopy, infrared spectroscopy, and ultraviolet spectroscopy. HUP hardly interacted with the main transport protein, whereas there was a very strong binding interaction between EGCG and bovine serum albumin. The enhanced transport of HUP is a possible cause of the enhanced effect of EGCG on HUP bioactivity.


I take quite a bit of green tea (250 mg twice a day) so that may account for it.

edit: 90% catechins

Edited by edward, 25 February 2008 - 04:38 AM.


#10 edward

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 04:39 AM

So aside from some short term cognitive boosting I don't see the benefit for a younger person taking such a drug long term? Maybe I am missing something? Comments?


I don't touch it myself, but there could be a benefit.

Cell Mol Neurobiol. 2008 Feb;28(2):173-83.
Non-cholinergic Effects of Huperzine A: Beyond Inhibition of Acetylcholinesterase.
Zhang HY, Yan H, Tang XC.
State Key Laboratory of Drug Research, Shanghai Institute of Materia Medica, Chinese Academy of Sciences, 555 Zu Chong Zhi Rd, Shanghai, 201203, China.

The use of acetylcholinesterase inhibitors to decrease the breakdown of the neurotransmitter acetylcholine has been the main symptomatic therapy for mild to moderate Alzheimer's patients, though the etiology of Alzheimer's disease remains unclear and seems to involve multiple factors. Further evidence has indicated that some of these acetylcholinesterase inhibitors also have non-cholinergic functions on the pathogenesis of Alzheimer's disease including the formation and deposition of beta-amyloid. Huperzine A, a potent and reversible inhibitor of acetylcholinesterase that was initially isolated from a Chinese herb, has been found to improve cognitive deficits in a broad range of animal models and has been used for Alzheimer's disease treatment in China. The novel neuroprotective effects of huperzine A might yield beneficial effects in Alzheimer's disease therapy and provide a potential template for the design of new selective and powerful anti-Alzheimer's drugs. The present paper gives an overview on the neuroprotective effects of huperzine A beyond its acetylcholinesterase inhibition. These effects include regulating beta-amyloid precursor protein metabolism, protecting against beta-amyloid-mediated oxidative stress and apoptosis. The structure-function relationship of huperzine A is also discussed.

PMID: 17657601


Anyone have the full text of the above paper, it looks very interesting.

#11 edward

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 05:15 AM

Well here we are thanks to hedgehog.

Attached Files



#12 brotherx

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 10:26 AM

Hi Edward,

thanks for posting the complete study!

I found the following findings especially interesting:

"Huperzine A (HupA), a novel Lycopodium alkaloid isolated from Chinese folk
medicine Huperzia serrata (Qian Ceng Ta), is a potent, selective, and well-tolerated
inhibitor of AChE. A large number of studies have shown that HupA has mild-tono
side effects or toxicity in mice, rats, rabbits and dogs, without fasciculation or
other cholinergic hyperactivity symptoms, and shows no histopathological changes
after subacute administration (reviewed by (Wang et al. 2006a))."


"A large number of clinical studies have
shown that HupA administration can significantly improve the memory, cognitive
skills, and daily life abilities of AD patients while showing no severe side effects.
HupA can also markedly improve the memory impairment in vascular dementia
(VD) patients. In addition, HupA was reported to ameliorate the memory deficits in
schizophrenia patients and improve sleep in insomniacs."


"Recent data indicate that HupA has multiple neuroprotective effects aside from its
AChE inhibition, which include regulating b-amyloid precursor protein (APP)
metabolism and counteracting Ab-associated neurotoxicity. This may provide adequate
evidence for the clinical and experimental improvement gained from HupA
(reviewed by (Zhang and Tang 2006)). In the present paper, the classic AChE
inhibitory effect of HupA and its new neuroprotective targets on AD pathology will
be reviewed."


"HupA is a mixed-competitive and reversible AChE inhibitor, which shows higher
potency and selectivity of AChE inhibition both in vitro and in vivo as compared with
galanthamine, donepezil, tacrine, and rivastigmine (reviewed by (Wang et al. 2006a)).
Our recent study also showed that HupA has an 8- and 2-fold higher potency for
increasing cortical ACh level than donepezil and rivastigmine, respectively, with a
longer duration of action and fewer side effects (Liang and Tang 2004)."

"Neuroprotective Effects of HupA on APP Processing"

"Neuroprotective Effects of HupA on Ab-associated Neurotoxicity"

"HupA may not only
ameliorate the cholinergic deficits, but also be capable of slowing down the progression
of disease by protecting the neurons from toxic insults. This would be beneficial to the
therapy of neurodegenerative diseases such as AD. In addition, understanding the
mechanisms of HupA actions may also provide valuable clues to aid the development of
new therapeutic agents for AD."

Acknowledgement This work was supported by grants from the Ministry of Science and Technology of
China (G199805110, G1998051115, 2004CB518907) and the National Natural Science Foundation of
China (39170860, 39770846, 3001161954, 30123005, 30271494 and 30572169).
References
Alvarez A, Alarcon R, Opazo C, Campos EO, Munoz FJ, Calderon FH, Dajas F, Gentry MK, Doctor,
BP, De Mello FG, Inestrosa NC (1998) Stable complexes involving acetylcholinesterase and
amyloid-beta peptide change the biochemical properties of the enzyme and increase the
neurotoxicity of Alzheimer’s fibrils. J Neurosci 18:3213–3223
Alvarez A, Opazo C, Alarcon R, Garrido J, Inestrosa NC (1997) Acetylcholinesterase promotes the
aggregation of amyloid-beta-peptide fragments by forming a complex with the growing fibrils. J Mol
Biol 272:348–361

Well here we are thanks to hedgehog.



#13 brotherx

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 10:31 AM

Hi Edward,

I wouldn't consider taking Huperzine A for a long term - but I will try it out for special circumstances (I am studying & working - so for the final exam phase it might be worth it.).

Cheers

Alex

dr. Chaos, how old are you? Just curious, I have some hup A and I have played around with it but haven't really gotten the type of effect you mentioned, I'm thinking I should try a smaller dose, 50 mcg seems to make me "tense" like too much acetylcholine, even without my usual low dose piracetam and choline precursors. I am 30 years old.

Another thing that turns me off to acetylcholinesterase inhibitors is the fact that they don't slow the progression of Alzheimer's, they are just temporary fixes, at least from all the studies I have seen as well as my experience with patients (I recently did a clinical rotation in a geriatric facility and almost everyone has been on Aricept (donepezil) or previously tacrine or some other acetylcholinesterase inhibitor for a long time and they all have gotten worse).

So aside from some short term cognitive boosting I don't see the benefit for a younger person taking such a drug long term? Maybe I am missing something? Comments?



#14 brotherx

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 10:35 AM

Hi Dr. Chaos,

what exactly makes your experience strange?
Why do you think it could lead to something 'bad' - so that you stop using it?

Cheers

Alex

I'm taking about 12.5 mcg huperzine(1/4 of a tablet) per day since 2 weeks. I'm feeling wide awake and everything is much more "clear" than normally. This effect is quite different from the one you get using stimulants. It feels as if somebody had upped the contrast on reality. Although I don't have trouble sleeping and I don't feel manic. It's not much of a problem, but strange nonetheless and since I don't know what this will lead to, I will stop using huperzine. Suggestions?



#15 edward

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 05:16 PM

I agree, if I had the below experience I would want to hold on to it, find ways to tweak it, find maybe a way to cycle the compound so the effects wouldn't diminish etc etc. I definitely wouldn't want to stop it.

So what negatives do you see to your experience dr. chaos?

Hi Dr. Chaos,

what exactly makes your experience strange?
Why do you think it could lead to something 'bad' - so that you stop using it?

Cheers

Alex

I'm taking about 12.5 mcg huperzine(1/4 of a tablet) per day since 2 weeks. I'm feeling wide awake and everything is much more "clear" than normally. This effect is quite different from the one you get using stimulants. It feels as if somebody had upped the contrast on reality. Although I don't have trouble sleeping and I don't feel manic. It's not much of a problem, but strange nonetheless and since I don't know what this will lead to, I will stop using huperzine. Suggestions?



#16 dr_chaos

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Posted 29 February 2008 - 12:15 PM

Maybe drinking alot of green tea ?

No tea. Sorry. :p

So what negatives do you see to your experience dr. chaos?

I don't know. It's just that I'm pretty comfortable with the way my perceptions are normally and that this change could be a hint for something bad. Apart from that, I don't like it if the world is sort of trippy( I can get stoned for that). Furthermore Huperzine didn't have any positive effect on me. I took Donepezil before for 4 months(2.5 mg per day) and it helped me in terms of focus and memory, which is very important to me. I wanted to change to Huperzine because of its price and for curiosities sake. I took Rx-Brain Huperzine, which is the only brand we can get in Austria. I shy away from it now, because Donepezil is much better studied and I don't know what side effects are yet to come with Huperzine. Furthermore I never had problems with Donepezil. Of course, Donepezil is dangerous. But I know what expects me and I believe I have taken it long enough, so that I can be relatively sure, that I will not suffer from most of its side effects. I rather play safe.

So aside from some short term cognitive boosting I don't see the benefit for a younger person taking such a drug long term? Maybe I am missing something? Comments?

I'm 22 and took it for improvement. By the way, I think that cholinesterase inhibitors normally don't work short term. You have to take them for at least a month or so, if you interpolate from their effects in demented people. This makes sense in my opinion, because I think the brain will try to maintain homeostasis and counteract the increase in levels of acetylcholine in the short run. Furthermore changes in the way the brain works often take longer in my experience.

#17 tomnook

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Posted 29 February 2008 - 07:05 PM

In his recently published book, "The Brain Trust Program", Larry McCleary MD recommends Huperzine A as one of THE supplements to take since it limits the flow of calcium ions into brain cells and "promotes cell survival and protects against over stimulation and excitotoxicity" The leading neurosurgeon continues by stating "huperzine A acts in much the same way as Nameda, one of the newest pharmaceutical weapons in the fight to treat Alzheimer's disease, and does so with far less potential for unpleasant or dangerous side effects.

Dr McCleary recommends a dosage of 75-100 mcg twice a day for adults, 50mcg twice a day for adolescents, only under medical supervision for younger children.

I just took delivery of LEF's 50mcg with Vitamin E - I reckon I'll be pleased if they have the same effect on me as Dr. Chaos.
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#18 brotherx

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Posted 29 February 2008 - 08:39 PM

Hi Tomnook,

thanks for your useful hint!
Huperzine A is on my "next to try" list.

Please give us your update on your Huperzine A experiences!

By the way - do you think Larry McCleary could be biased in his recommendations because he also sells a product called 'Lucidal'?

Cheers

Alex

In his recently published book, "The Brain Trust Program", Larry McCleary MD recommends Huperzine A as one of THE supplements to take since it limits the flow of calcium ions into brain cells and "promotes cell survival and protects against over stimulation and excitotoxicity" The leading neurosurgeon continues by stating "huperzine A acts in much the same way as Nameda, one of the newest pharmaceutical weapons in the fight to treat Alzheimer's disease, and does so with far less potential for unpleasant or dangerous side effects.

Dr McCleary recommends a dosage of 75-100 mcg twice a day for adults, 50mcg twice a day for adolescents, only under medical supervision for younger children.

I just took delivery of LEF's 50mcg with Vitamin E - I reckon I'll be pleased if they have the same effect on me as Dr. Chaos.



#19 brotherx

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Posted 29 February 2008 - 08:44 PM

On the other hand Larry McCleary has a strong background as the Chief of Pediatric Neurosurgery at Denver Children's Hospital

Hi Tomnook,

thanks for your useful hint!
Huperzine A is on my "next to try" list.

Please give us your update on your Huperzine A experiences!

By the way - do you think Larry McCleary could be biased in his recommendations because he also sells a product called 'Lucidal'?

Cheers

Alex

In his recently published book, "The Brain Trust Program", Larry McCleary MD recommends Huperzine A as one of THE supplements to take since it limits the flow of calcium ions into brain cells and "promotes cell survival and protects against over stimulation and excitotoxicity" The leading neurosurgeon continues by stating "huperzine A acts in much the same way as Nameda, one of the newest pharmaceutical weapons in the fight to treat Alzheimer's disease, and does so with far less potential for unpleasant or dangerous side effects.

Dr McCleary recommends a dosage of 75-100 mcg twice a day for adults, 50mcg twice a day for adolescents, only under medical supervision for younger children.

I just took delivery of LEF's 50mcg with Vitamin E - I reckon I'll be pleased if they have the same effect on me as Dr. Chaos.



#20 tomnook

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Posted 01 March 2008 - 02:14 PM

On the other hand Larry McCleary has a strong background as the Chief of Pediatric Neurosurgery at Denver Children's Hospital

Hi Tomnook,

By the way - do you think Larry McCleary could be biased in his recommendations because he also sells a product called 'Lucidal'?


Hi Alex

I took the recommended dose this morning ... nothing to report so far!

Larry McCleary's recommendations in his book are certainly the ones which feature in his Lucidal formula but then I guess they would be wouldn't they? In his book he mentions Lucidal just once along with a link to the website and simply mentions it as being a possibility for the reader to investigate further. With all the supplements suggested in the book as potentially enhancing brain health he gives not only his personal opinion as to suggested dosage but also his recommended form of the supplement i.e. for B vitamins "use the niacinamide or nicotinamide form .. if possible, these forms cross into the brain four times better than any other form". His recommendations all read well to me - Krill Oil, B Vits, Magnesium,Taurine, Acetyl L-Carnitine, Alpha Lipoic Acid, Coq-10, Vitamin D, Hup A, Vinpocetine.

I found the book really easy to read and informative encouraging the reader to exercise the brain in many different ways and effectively "cross training" it. I've only just started his "mental gymnastics" program but am certainly enjoying the challenge so far and will be interested to see if there are any improvements by time I end on day 28. (maybe there will be spectacular improvements thanks to the Huperzine A and Vinpocetine!!

#21 brotherx

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Posted 01 March 2008 - 03:06 PM

Hi Dr. Chaos,

then I've misinterpreted your last post! My perception was that you were talking of some good experiences with Huperzine A!

("I'm feeling wide awake and everything is much more "clear" than normally. This effect is quite different from the one you get using stimulants. It feels as if somebody had upped the contrast on reality. Although I don't have trouble sleeping and I don't feel manic.

Cheers

Alex

Maybe drinking alot of green tea ?

No tea. Sorry. :p

So what negatives do you see to your experience dr. chaos?

I don't know. It's just that I'm pretty comfortable with the way my perceptions are normally and that this change could be a hint for something bad. Apart from that, I don't like it if the world is sort of trippy( I can get stoned for that). Furthermore Huperzine didn't have any positive effect on me. I took Donepezil before for 4 months(2.5 mg per day) and it helped me in terms of focus and memory, which is very important to me. I wanted to change to Huperzine because of its price and for curiosities sake. I took Rx-Brain Huperzine, which is the only brand we can get in Austria. I shy away from it now, because Donepezil is much better studied and I don't know what side effects are yet to come with Huperzine. Furthermore I never had problems with Donepezil. Of course, Donepezil is dangerous. But I know what expects me and I believe I have taken it long enough, so that I can be relatively sure, that I will not suffer from most of its side effects. I rather play safe.

So aside from some short term cognitive boosting I don't see the benefit for a younger person taking such a drug long term? Maybe I am missing something? Comments?

I'm 22 and took it for improvement. By the way, I think that cholinesterase inhibitors normally don't work short term. You have to take them for at least a month or so, if you interpolate from their effects in demented people. This makes sense in my opinion, because I think the brain will try to maintain homeostasis and counteract the increase in levels of acetylcholine in the short run. Furthermore changes in the way the brain works often take longer in my experience.



#22 brotherx

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Posted 01 March 2008 - 03:11 PM

Hi Tomnook,

that sounds like the book is a good and useful read! I put it on my "books to read" list!
I've taken approx. 75mcg Huperzine A this morning as well (but can't tell too much about its effects because my night was unusually short).

Keep us posted about your experiences!

Cheers

Alex

On the other hand Larry McCleary has a strong background as the Chief of Pediatric Neurosurgery at Denver Children's Hospital

Hi Tomnook,

By the way - do you think Larry McCleary could be biased in his recommendations because he also sells a product called 'Lucidal'?


Hi Alex

I took the recommended dose this morning ... nothing to report so far!

Larry McCleary's recommendations in his book are certainly the ones which feature in his Lucidal formula but then I guess they would be wouldn't they? In his book he mentions Lucidal just once along with a link to the website and simply mentions it as being a possibility for the reader to investigate further. With all the supplements suggested in the book as potentially enhancing brain health he gives not only his personal opinion as to suggested dosage but also his recommended form of the supplement i.e. for B vitamins "use the niacinamide or nicotinamide form .. if possible, these forms cross into the brain four times better than any other form". His recommendations all read well to me - Krill Oil, B Vits, Magnesium,Taurine, Acetyl L-Carnitine, Alpha Lipoic Acid, Coq-10, Vitamin D, Hup A, Vinpocetine.

I found the book really easy to read and informative encouraging the reader to exercise the brain in many different ways and effectively "cross training" it. I've only just started his "mental gymnastics" program but am certainly enjoying the challenge so far and will be interested to see if there are any improvements by time I end on day 28. (maybe there will be spectacular improvements thanks to the Huperzine A and Vinpocetine!!



#23 brotherx

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Posted 01 March 2008 - 07:56 PM

I've found another interesting article about HupA


Effects of huperzine A on secretion of nerve growth factor in cultured rat cortical astrocytes and neurite outgrowth in rat PC12 cells1

Aim: To study the effects of huperzine A (HupA) on neuritogenic activity and the expression of nerve growth factor (NGF).

Methods: After being treated with 10 μmol/L HupA, neurite outgrowth of PC12 cells was observed and counted under phase-contrast microscopy. Mitogenic activity was assayed by [3H]thymidine incorporation. Cell cytotoxicity was evaluated by lactate dehydrogenase (LDH) release. AChE activity, mRNA and protein expression were measured by the Ellman's method, RT-PCR, and Western blot, respectively. NGF mRNA and protein levels were determined by RT-PCR and ELISA assays.

Results: Treatment of PC12 cells with 10 μmol/L HupA for 48 h markedly increased the number of neurite-bearing cells, but caused no significant alteration in cell viability or other signs of cytotoxicity. In addition to inhibiting AChE activity, 10 μmol/ L HupA also increased the mRNA and protein levels of this enzyme. In addition, following 2 h exposure of the astrocytes to 10 μmol/L HupA, there was a significant up-regulation of mRNA for NGF and P75 low-affinity NGF receptor. The protein level of NGF was also increased after 24 h treatment with HupA.

Conclusion: Our findings demonstrate for the first time that HupA has a direct or indirect neurotrophic activity, which might be beneficial in treatment of neurodegenerative disorders such as Alzheimer disease.



Hi Tomnook,

that sounds like the book is a good and useful read! I put it on my "books to read" list!
I've taken approx. 75mcg Huperzine A this morning as well (but can't tell too much about its effects because my night was unusually short).

Keep us posted about your experiences!


Edited by chrono, 18 October 2010 - 08:24 AM.
trimmed quote/abstract


#24 dr_chaos

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Posted 02 March 2008 - 10:40 AM

Another thing that came to my mind is the question, whether you can use Huperzine as well as other NMDA antagonists to prevent formation of tolerance to some drugs, since it is an NMDA antagonist, too? Is it strong enough? I think it's cholinergic effects should compensate for NMDA induced memory impairment so it would be superior to dxm or memantine.

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#25 Monostereo

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 02:22 PM

I found that huperzine totally screwed up my sleep quality and schedule. Than I read somewhere that brain levels of acetylcholine actually go down during slow wave sleep.

By the way, I think that cholinesterase inhibitors normally don't work short term. You have to take them for at least a month or so, if you interpolate from their effects in demented people. This makes sense in my opinion, because I think the brain will try to maintain homeostasis and counteract the increase in levels of acetylcholine in the short run. Furthermore changes in the way the brain works often take longer in my experience.


I've been trying out Huperzine for the last 5 days. The positives are that clear feeling that others have mentioned and an increase in focus. At higher doses (50mcg) the effect is enhanced and I start getting that positive manic mental energy that allows me to do things like clean the house. However, at 50mcg I also experience stomach upset so I lowered the dose to 25mcg. This keeps some of the clear feeling and focus but I lose the stomach turmoil and manic mental energy.

Here's the problem: Though I seem to be getting enough sleep and also of good quality (I track sleep with a Zeo), I am becoming much more tired during the day. I want to know if this is an unsurmountable side effect, or if I should keep at the current dosage and wait for the "homeostasis" effect to go away.

(Aside from the hup, I take 600mg choline, 2000mg of fish oil, and various vitamins every day.)




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