Edited by pycnogenol, 23 March 2009 - 04:37 PM.
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Posted 23 March 2009 - 04:35 PM
Edited by pycnogenol, 23 March 2009 - 04:37 PM.
Posted 23 March 2009 - 04:40 PM
Besides my questions (see post #59) that I need answers to could someone please post a serrapeptase monograph?
Posted 23 March 2009 - 04:43 PM
So does taking serrapeptase initially increase pain? If it does indeed do this, what is the typical duration length of additional pain discomfort? Does it also mean the body is trying to heal itself?
Posted 23 March 2009 - 05:06 PM
I am not aware of serrapeptase commonly causing increased pain. It should reduce pain in most situations.
Posted 23 March 2009 - 05:14 PM
I agree completely. Unless you're on a host of anabolic steroids, 6 days per week is at least 2 days too many for recovery and growth to take place.
Posted 23 March 2009 - 05:36 PM
Besides my questions (see post #59) that I need answers to could someone please post a serrapeptase monograph?
Pycnogenol,
What are you thinking of using serrapeptase for? To increase the efficacy of antibiotics or ... ?
Edited by pycnogenol, 23 March 2009 - 05:56 PM.
Posted 23 March 2009 - 05:46 PM
So does taking serrapeptase initially increase pain? If it does indeed do this, what is the typical duration length of additional pain discomfort?
Does it also mean the body is trying to heal itself?
I am not aware of serrapeptase commonly causing increased pain. It should reduce pain in most situations.
Someone said something about a herxheimer effect before -- serrapeptase alone should not cause any herxheimer effect.
Edited by pycnogenol, 23 March 2009 - 05:55 PM.
Posted 23 March 2009 - 05:50 PM
Edited by FunkOdyssey, 23 March 2009 - 05:51 PM.
Posted 23 March 2009 - 06:00 PM
That guy seems a little nuts, considering the highest dose that has been studied in clinical trials is 20,000iu 3x daily and he is recommending 240,000iu 3x daily. Even at 20,000iu 3x daily some people develop respiratory infections because it has such potent mucolytic action.
Edited by pycnogenol, 23 March 2009 - 06:02 PM.
Posted 23 March 2009 - 06:05 PM
Bromelain
This may be harmful as a treatment for Bird Flu. Boosts TNF-a so this may contribute to cytokine production. Overproduction of cytokines can contribute to pneumonia or ARDS which is a common cause of death in Bird Flu patients. Also has blood thinning properties which may contribute to problems associated with hemorrhagic symptoms. May help seasonal colds and flu.
http://content.nhion...m...s&mtyp=11–2 tablets (250–500mg), 3 times a day taken 30 minutes before meals. For anti-inflammatory benefits, use between meals, 1–3 tablets (250–500mg) up to 4 times a day.
Bromelain is used as an anti-inflammatory and analgesic agent in treating the symptoms of arthritis.
Bromelain can reportedly induce cytokine production in human peripheral blood mononuclear cells. Use has been reported to lead to the production of tumor necrosis factor-alpha, interleukin-1-beta, and interleukin-6 in a time- and dose-dependent manner.(27, 28) Bromelain has also been reported to remove T-cell CD4 molecules from lymphocytes and to affect T-cell activation(29) and to enhance macrophage production of INF-gamma-mediated nitric oxide and TNF-alpha.(30) In splenocyte cultures, T-cell receptor and anti-CD28 mediated T-cell proliferation was enhanced by bromelain, while IL-2 production was decreased. IL-2 production was also inhibited in highly purified CD4+ T-cells.(31)
Edited by FunkOdyssey, 23 March 2009 - 06:08 PM.
Posted 23 March 2009 - 06:14 PM
Edited by pycnogenol, 23 March 2009 - 06:18 PM.
Posted 23 March 2009 - 06:21 PM
Systemic enzymes have a unique feature. Side effects do not occur with systemic enzymes. This means that raising the dosage to massive levels does not cause any problems unlike pharmaceutical drugs.
Posted 23 March 2009 - 06:24 PM
From that link:
Systemic enzymes have a unique feature. Side effects do not occur with systemic enzymes. This means that raising the dosage to massive levels does not cause any problems unlike pharmaceutical drugs.
This is a dangerous lie. You will find plenty of side effects noted in clinical trials and massive doses could cause hemmoraging. I can't believe that was written by an M.D.
Posted 23 March 2009 - 06:30 PM
From that link:
Systemic enzymes have a unique feature. Side effects do not occur with systemic enzymes. This means that raising the dosage to massive levels does not cause any problems unlike pharmaceutical drugs.
This is a dangerous lie. You will find plenty of side effects noted in clinical trials and massive doses could cause hemmoraging. I can't believe that was written by an M.D.
Edited by pycnogenol, 23 March 2009 - 06:33 PM.
Posted 25 March 2009 - 01:30 PM
From that link:
Systemic enzymes have a unique feature. Side effects do not occur with systemic enzymes. This means that raising the dosage to massive levels does not cause any problems unlike pharmaceutical drugs.
This is a dangerous lie. You will find plenty of side effects noted in clinical trials and massive doses could cause hemmoraging. I can't believe that was written by an M.D.
I can't find his "M.D." credentials on DocBoard.org
Posted 25 March 2009 - 02:20 PM
Posted 25 March 2009 - 03:12 PM
From that link:
Systemic enzymes have a unique feature. Side effects do not occur with systemic enzymes. This means that raising the dosage to massive levels does not cause any problems unlike pharmaceutical drugs.
This is a dangerous lie. You will find plenty of side effects noted in clinical trials and massive doses could cause hemmoraging. I can't believe that was written by an M.D.
I can't find his "M.D." credentials on DocBoard.org
You guys are giving me concern about using Serrapeptase even in the short term here.
Doctor's best brand is 40,000 units and it says 1-3 per day. I also take plenty of fish oil
and vitamin E. I have been taking 1 capsule 3 times a day, but maybe I will just take one
first thing in the morning. I want to avoid any clotting issues with this calf injury getting
on the airplane but I don't want to stroke out either? (That would be a bummer man).
Edited by pycnogenol, 25 March 2009 - 03:32 PM.
Posted 25 March 2009 - 03:36 PM
From that link:
Systemic enzymes have a unique feature. Side effects do not occur with systemic enzymes. This means that raising the dosage to massive levels does not cause any problems unlike pharmaceutical drugs.
This is a dangerous lie. You will find plenty of side effects noted in clinical trials and massive doses could cause hemmoraging. I can't believe that was written by an M.D.
I can't find his "M.D." credentials on DocBoard.org
You guys are giving me concern about using Serrapeptase even in the short term here.
Doctor's best brand is 40,000 units and it says 1-3 per day. I also take plenty of fish oil
and vitamin E. I have been taking 1 capsule 3 times a day, but maybe I will just take one
first thing in the morning. I want to avoid any clotting issues with this calf injury getting
on the airplane but I don't want to stroke out either? (That would be a bummer man).
As do I (vitamin E, DHA/EPA).
I was taking 3 capsules per day of the Doctor's Best brand for a very short period of time until I woke up with a nose bleed.
Now I'm taking only one capsule every other day at bedtime instead of the 3 caps daily. I'm taking it to see if it will dissolve a small
cyst that came up on an recent ultrasound. I got the OK to try it from my doctor. They're going to re-do the ultrasound in 9 months
to see if the serrapeptase helped at all. All I know is that taking 3 caps of serrapeptase really made my chronic pain much, much worse
so I backed off. Serrapeptase seems to help lower my blood glucose though.
Posted 25 March 2009 - 03:41 PM
You guys are giving me concern about using Serrapeptase even in the short term here.
Doctor's best brand is 40,000 units and it says 1-3 per day. I also take plenty of fish oil
and vitamin E. I have been taking 1 capsule 3 times a day, but maybe I will just take one
first thing in the morning. I want to avoid any clotting issues with this calf injury getting
on the airplane but I don't want to stroke out either? (That would be a bummer man).
Posted 25 March 2009 - 03:49 PM
You guys are giving me concern about using Serrapeptase even in the short term here.
Doctor's best brand is 40,000 units and it says 1-3 per day. I also take plenty of fish oil
and vitamin E. I have been taking 1 capsule 3 times a day, but maybe I will just take one
first thing in the morning. I want to avoid any clotting issues with this calf injury getting
on the airplane but I don't want to stroke out either? (That would be a bummer man).
I bought the same Doctor's Best product initially and I switched to a lower dosed 20,000iu per tablet product by MRM after researching it more thoroughly. The largest dose studied in humans is 20,000iu 3x daily. Some people develop respiratory infections at this dose as a result of excess mucolysis. I don't know where the idea that more is safe comes from because it is not supported by the literature.
For prevention of thrombosis, the best studied of the systemic enzymes is nattokinase, especially for that specific purpose of clot prevention on long-haul flights. I would use that instead.
Edited by pycnogenol, 25 March 2009 - 03:49 PM.
Posted 25 March 2009 - 04:16 PM
Posted 25 March 2009 - 04:20 PM
Yes that's the one.
Edited by pycnogenol, 25 March 2009 - 04:38 PM.
Posted 28 March 2009 - 05:43 PM
You guys are giving me concern about using Serrapeptase even in the short term here.
Doctor's best brand is 40,000 units and it says 1-3 per day. I also take plenty of fish oil
and vitamin E. I have been taking 1 capsule 3 times a day, but maybe I will just take one
first thing in the morning. I want to avoid any clotting issues with this calf injury getting
on the airplane but I don't want to stroke out either? (That would be a bummer man).
I bought the same Doctor's Best product initially and I switched to a lower dosed 20,000iu per tablet product by MRM after researching it more thoroughly. The largest dose studied in humans is 20,000iu 3x daily. Some people develop respiratory infections at this dose as a result of excess mucolysis. I don't know where the idea that more is safe comes from because it is not supported by the literature.
For prevention of thrombosis, the best studied of the systemic enzymes is nattokinase, especially for that specific purpose of clot prevention on long-haul flights. I would use that instead.
Posted 31 July 2013 - 03:44 AM
Posted 31 July 2013 - 04:56 AM
Posted 31 July 2013 - 05:55 AM
I know a lot about pancreatin. You take it on an empty stomach for inflammation. Nature's Plus is the most effective. Watch your dosages. Too much is bad.
I know a lot of about enzymes and inflammation. Yes, they go beyond your stomach, but you should generally take them on an empty stomach if that's what you want.
Searching for my posts on prancreatin and bromelain would be a good ide if you want to know more. If the search engine here doesn't work, try google.
Posted 31 July 2013 - 07:11 PM
I took Pancreatin for about 4 years non-stop and I'm afraid if I developed dependency that my body no longer produces pancreatic enzymes. The symptoms I have started the same time I stopped taking pancreatin, in late 2011. Are there any foods or supps that can stimulate / revive enzyme production or should i resume taking pancreatin? Do you think i might have developed dependency?
Posted 01 August 2013 - 06:51 AM
Posted 12 April 2021 - 04:13 AM
Is long term use of enzymes, especially pancreatin harmful to the body? Will it promote dependency and thus inhibit inherent secretion of the enzymes?
Here's one study but I don't know how exactly to interpret this: http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/12492454
This is interesting. I actually emailed Mucos pharmacy (the company that makes Wobenzym) and asked if taking this could decrease self production and they said no. I'm going to mail them this study. And halt wobenzym.
Edited by ironfistx, 12 April 2021 - 04:14 AM.
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