Anyone tried p5p (activated B6) as a NA agonist?

#1 celavie

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Posted 11 March 2008 - 01:12 PM

p5p, or pyridoxal-5-phosphate, is the active form of vitamin B6, and is an antagonist for the enzyme reaction that metabolises NA (noradrenaline). This means that once released, NA should stay around longer in the brain, given the presence of higher level of p5p.

In theory, this means it could have stimulant-like action. Anyone know if it has any nootropic effects in practice?

-Mark

Edited by celavie, 11 March 2008 - 01:14 PM.

#2 LIB

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Posted 15 March 2008 - 05:54 PM

I've taken it before because I believe I have a b6 defeciency and I know this is the activated form. I didn't really notice any nootropic/stimulating effect. Maybe a slight energizing effect that B's are known to give. Hope that helps.

#3

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Posted 18 March 2008 - 04:40 PM

I've taken it before because I believe I have a b6 defeciency and I know this is the activated form. I didn't really notice any nootropic/stimulating effect. Maybe a slight energizing effect that B's are known to give. Hope that helps.

My information says that everyone at some point will need to supplement the p-5-p form of b6. I mean that anyone supplementing b6 will need to take the p-5-p form at some point. I take high doses (2 grams per day) of pyridoxine and had that experience (needed to take higher amounts of p-5-p. (I have pyroluria so that dose of 6b is not standard for others.) I think your liver is not able to convert the common form into the active form at some point because of enzymes. I was under the impression it may also have to do with riboflavin levels too, but not absolutely sure about that causing the need to add p-5-p to their supplements.

In the US we call it norepinephrine.

I think that b6 plays a role in both serotonin levels and dopamine (or catecholamine levels). But the effect p-5-p has NE levels may also be about other nutrients needed like DLPA and pyridoxine for starters. To put it another way, b6 can be converted into the active form by the liver and will do the same as the p-5-p form if you have the necessary nutrients to support that process. So there may be some truth to that if you need the p-5-p form and have low NE levels or low catecholamine levels. Again that sounds like some people need the p-5-p form and this seems to be something that comes on at some point in the process of supplementing over time.

I usually have different symptoms from missing p-5-p vs. missing pyridoxine, which may be related to my NE levels. (I usually sweat at night - when I am sleeping - when my p-5-p levels are low, which I think may be an NE issue.) But, I take p-5-p at night, so the stimulating effect is not something I have ever experienced. Of course I don't usually take more than 100 mg. of p-5-p at night. It may be possible that too much p-5-p at night might interfere with sleep. The high doses of b6 I take I always take that with breakfast and lunch only because too much b6 at a high dose would interfere with my sleep if taken later in the day. Of course the dose I take of b6 is much higher than the daily dose I take of p-5-p. So it may be true and it may be relative too (how much of each you are getting that your body needs).

#4 jordan2

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Posted 15 April 2008 - 05:48 PM

Is it possible to acheive all B6 requirements solely (or mostly) through p-5-p?

I have some of the pyroluria-type issues (measured a moderate 20 at one point, have issues with dream recall, etc.)

BUT I also have some type of tendinopathy/peripheral nerve pain going on in my wrist
and I'm concerned that too much b6 could be affecting peripheral nerve health
AND I've read articles like this http://www.latitudes...p?showtopic=877
indicating that IF (a big if, I suppose) there is an issue with the *sulfation process* then too much B6 results in breakdown of too much homocysteine to too much cysteine - which can have adverse affects that can't be handled by a faulty sulfation process.

Is there an amount of b6, say 300mg or so, that would be considered safe under almost all circumstances?
Is the notion of faulty sulfation applicable to non-autistic non-add/adhd persons?
Is there any advantage to B6? Does B6 (as opposed to p-5-p) have more of a time-release effect or other benefit?
Could one simply supplement with high amounts of p-5-p and meet all B6 requirements?
Are there any other signs of b6 excess - more subtle than the obvious numbness and tingling of fingers and toes?

#5 Harry777

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Posted 25 April 2012 - 10:14 AM

I take both P5P and vitamin B6 as two of the supplements I take for Pyroluria. My doctor states it is good to take both, as the P5P gives protection from possible nerve damage caused by high does of vitamin B6. I'm also very aware that if I ever get tingling in my hands or feet, I should be reducing my intake of vitamin B6 - as this could be a sign of nerve damage. So far I've never had any unexplained tingling.

I started taking vitamin B6 initially without the P5P, as I was experimenting with Pyroluria while I was waiting for a doctors appointment to get tested. I found P5P had a more powerful effect than vitamin B6 when I did start taking it. I had a lot of brain fog/concentration issues with Pyroluria, so I could 'feel' the P5P acting upon my brain. Pretty weird sensation after feeling so crap for so many years.

Anyway I blog about life with Pyroluria at http://pyrolurialife.com

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#1 celavie

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