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Omega 3 6 9


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#1

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Posted 13 March 2008 - 09:30 PM


I bought an omega fatty acid supplement, a pill of which gives 180mg of O3, and 90mg of O6 and O9 each.

However, the only information pertaining to an RDA that I found online was that "a dose shouldn't exceed 4g". Which leads me to a question - how much should I consume per day for the best effect?

Also, what time of the day should I eat the pill, and is it before or after a meal?

#2 ajnast4r

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Posted 14 March 2008 - 01:54 AM

what form is that 180mg o3 as?

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#3 OneScrewLoose

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Posted 14 March 2008 - 02:02 AM

I bought an omega fatty acid supplement, a pill of which gives 180mg of O3, and 90mg of O6 and O9 each.

However, the only information pertaining to an RDA that I found online was that "a dose shouldn't exceed 4g". Which leads me to a question - how much should I consume per day for the best effect?

Also, what time of the day should I eat the pill, and is it before or after a meal?


You should probably base your dose on Omega-3, as it seems we get enough of 6 and 9 in our diets.

#4 niner

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Posted 14 March 2008 - 03:39 AM

I don't understand why people supplement omega-6. I thought the whole problem with our modern diets was that omega-6 was too high relative to omega-3. I guess this is mainly caused by o-3 being too low, but I don't see how adding more o-6 is of benefit. There must be something to it that I'm missing... Anyone know what the story is on this?

#5 ajnast4r

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Posted 14 March 2008 - 04:16 AM

I don't understand why people supplement omega-6. I thought the whole problem with our modern diets was that omega-6 was too high relative to omega-3. I guess this is mainly caused by o-3 being too low, but I don't see how adding more o-6 is of benefit. There must be something to it that I'm missing... Anyone know what the story is on this?


youre not missing anything.. youre correct.

#6 edward

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Posted 14 March 2008 - 04:27 AM

I don't understand why people supplement omega-6. I thought the whole problem with our modern diets was that omega-6 was too high relative to omega-3. I guess this is mainly caused by o-3 being too low, but I don't see how adding more o-6 is of benefit. There must be something to it that I'm missing... Anyone know what the story is on this?


Long answer to a short question, note that I am being lazy and not including references mainly because I have read so much information on fats in the past week or so that citing everything would make this post a research paper.

Fats, Fatty Acids, daily requirements, etc. etc. this is an exhausting topic, so much information so many contradictions etc etc. Since I have been on my ketogenic diet experiment I have been spending free time (and probably more work/school time than I should) studying fats. I have multiple excel files on the fatty acid profiles of everything from lard to grapeseed oil, while trying to tease out what the human body actually needs in terms of which fatty acids and what amounts along with the evidence for a high amount of certain fatty acids, saturated etc. to potentially cause cardiovascular problems. I have looked at crappy studies from the 1950s that keep on getting sited over and over again, to more contemporary studies.

My conclusions: The human body optimally needs a certain amount of LA (omega 6) (10-20 grams depending on your caloric intake) and omega 3 (ultimately the body needs EPA and DHA but can get convert some from ALA which is in flax seed oil and others, but in truth if you go right for the EPA DHA in fish oil and apparently grass fed "natural" animals then the ALA is really second best and not needed, though maybe it could be a good "neutral fat")

Apparently there is an optimal ratio of omega 6 to omega 3, some say 2:1 some say 1:1 but regardless it is no where what is provided in the average modern diet. So for most people supplementing fish oil or at the very least flax or another high ALA oil is very very important. For most people (we on this board are not most people) there is no need to supplement omega 6 as most people eat so much of this. Health conscious people may however be on diets that either due to their low fat or their avoidance of processed foods and trans fat (from my research this stuff is just plain evil, even more so than I originally thought, if you want CV disease quick in a hurry start guzzling trans fat). So by avoiding processed foods and trans fats what happens is the amount of monounsaturated fats (omega 9, olive oil canola etc, yes this stuff is not essential) goes up but very little polyunsaturates (sources of omega 6) get consumed because polyunsaturates have a terrible shelf life unless hydrogenated or partially hydrogenated (trans fat). Monounsaturates have a great shelf life and thus are used in their natural unadulterated form in products that end up being healthier.

I looked at my own diet (both before the ketogenic experiment and now while doing the ketogenic thing) and in both cases my dietary intake of Omega 6 was actually below optimal due to my healthy food choices very little processed food etc. I intend to supplement a small amount of Omega 6 via expeller pressed safflower oil and grapeseed oil (both oils have high vitamin E content and if bottled in a dark bottle should have pretty good shelf lives thus reducing the risk of oxidation, apparently consuming oxidated oils is pretty bad and often overlooked). One can pick these up from most grocery stores that contain a more eclectic variety of oils. I dont seed the need to get a fancy 3-6-9 supplement as you dont need omega 9, omega 6 can be had as described above and Fish Oil as long as it is fresh and properly bottled and refrigerated is the most effective way of getting omega-3

"Neutral Fats" (sort of) Monounsaturated fats and Saturated fats are two fats that The perponderance of the evidence suggest are neutral energy supplying substances. Some studies show Saturated Fats to raise cholesterol and some show it to lower it. The deal with monosatured fats is that in some studies the replacement in the diet of Saturated Fats by Monounsaturated fats as a source of calories lowered cholesterol in cases where the Saturated fats raised cholesterol. When you look at the actual studies things are very very very far from clear. There are even some studies that show that Monounsatured fats while being neutral or positive on lipid profile actually raise the incidence of cardiovascular disease (I have a feeling this is related to total caloric intake and activity level but these variables were not taken into account). The studies on Saturated fat that raise cholesterol inevitably are in cases where their is a deficiency of Omega 6 and Omega 3. When appropriate levels of Omega 6 and Omega 3 are in the picture the lipid altering effects of Saturated fat disappear.

Conclusion, Fats are all about balance. There are no bad fats (edit: except for trans fat which is man made and oxidized fat, ie rancid or spoiled). Saturated and Monounsaturated can be good sources of neutral calories but only and this is a big only if the proper amounts of Omega 6 and Omega 3 (preferably in the form of EPA and DHA) are in the diet. So track your diet for awhile, if you are a health conscious consumer you may actually getting less Omega 6 than you think, There is a handy chart on this website (ignore most of the website but the chart is good) http://curezone.com/...fatspercent.asp Olive Oil, Canola Oil, Nuts and Nut Oils all have very little Omega 6 so if you think you are getting your essential fats from them then think again.

Edited by edward, 14 March 2008 - 04:36 AM.


#7 balance

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Posted 14 March 2008 - 09:36 AM

There are even some studies that show that Monounsatured fats while being neutral or positive on lipid profile actually raise the incidence of cardiovascular disease (I have a feeling this is related to total caloric intake and activity level but these variables were not taken into account)


I think this is due to monosaturated fat's ability to increase insulin resistance, yet this is only seen when monosaturated fat is taken in very high amounts.

Nice post Edward, I myself have a hunch I may not be getting much omega 6 either, as I'm on an extremely healthy diet.

#8 wayside

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Posted 14 March 2008 - 05:51 PM

FWIW, LEF recommends 1400 mg EPA/1000 mg DHA per day:

Commercial tests of EPA/DHA blood levels are not yet available. To achieve higher blood levels, members are advised to consume about 1400 mg of EPA and 1000 mg of DHA each day. If triglyceride levels remain above 100 mg/dL of blood, even higher amounts of fish oil should be considered.


http://www.lef.org/m...007_awsi_01.htm

This would be around 4 gm of a high-concentration fish oil.

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#9 david ellis

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Posted 15 March 2008 - 03:45 AM

I am trying to figure out how a healthy diet can be low in Omega-6. If you are a vegetarian, eating soy/canola oil, the oil is 23% Omega6. If you are an ominivore, there is plenty of omega6 in meat. Especially in grain fed animals, chicken fat for instance, is 20% omega6. What am I missing? Vegetarians and omnivores cover the majority of diets.

Edited by david ellis, 15 March 2008 - 05:57 PM.





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