18 replies to this topic

[Urbaneast]

I'm starting a regimen of Nootropics/Supplements, but I'm concerned about the effect of what I'm taking recreationally.
About 2 months ago, I started using Codeine as an escape to combat some situational anxiety. I started low but now take almost 300mg per day.

Does anyone know if there are long-term cognitive damage from taking codeine? I've searched online and have found nothing.

[eternaltraveler]

it's an opiate like morphine and heroin (it is in fact converted into morphine in the body, it's active form, so is heroin). The effects are the same though weaker. Get yourself off it. Get help if you need it.

[rfarris]

Does anyone know if there are long-term cognitive damage from taking codeine?

I have arthritis in my spine, so I've been taking opiates for over a decade. I don't think codeine has any cognitive issues (other than making you stupid and look like a zombie while you're on it) but it definitely constipates you and makes you itch. The itching makes you scratch and pretty soon you have white scab-marks, which is the sure sign of a speed freak or a junkie.

You ought to get off of those, but if you must take opiates I suggest that you move on to oxycodone instead of hydrocodone. Fewer side effects.

[Urbaneast]

I have arthritis in my spine, so I've been taking opiates for over a decade. I don't think codeine has any cognitive issues (other than making you stupid and look like a zombie while you're on it) but it definitely constipates you and makes you itch. The itching makes you scratch and pretty soon you have white scab-marks, which is the sure sign of a speed freak or a junkie.

You ought to get off of those, but if you must take opiates I suggest that you move on to oxycodone instead of hydrocodone. Fewer side effects.

Thanks for the replies. rfarris, I'm taking codeine, which is weaker than either oxy or hydrocodone. I'm glad to hear that you haven't had any cognitive issues with opiates.

[zoolander]

There are many side effects associated with the use of codeine/opoid medications. One huge concern is the ability of opiod compounds to suppress the immune system.

Am J Ther. 2004 Sep-Oct;11(5):354-65.Click here to read Links
Opioid therapy and immunosuppression: a review.
Vallejo R, de Leon-Casasola O, Benyamin R.

Research Program, Millennium Pain Center, Biology Department, Illinois State University, Bloomington-Normal, USA. vallejo1019@yahoo.com

The idea that opioids modulate the immune system is not new. By the late 19th century, Cantacuzene, used morphine to suppress cellular immunity and lower the resistance of guinea pigs to bacterial infection. While exogenous opioids mediate immunosuppression, endogenous opiates exert opposite actions. Acute and chronic opioid administration is known to have inhibitory effects on humoral and cellular immune responses including antibody production, natural killer cell activity, cytokine expression, and phagocytic activity. Opiates behave like cytokines, modulating the immune response by interaction with their receptors in the central nervous system and in the periphery. Potential mechanisms by which central opiates modulate peripheral immune functions may involve both the hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal axis and the autonomic nervous system. The presence of opioid receptors outside the central nervous system is increasingly recognized. Those receptors have been identified not only in peripheral nerves but also in immune inflammatory cells. The immunosuppression mediated by opiates may explain the increased incidence of infection in heroin addicts. Opiates may also promote immunodeficiency virus infection by decreasing the secretion of alpha and beta chemokines (important inhibitory cytokines for the expression of HIV) and at the same time increasing the expression of chemoreceptors CCR5 and CCR3, coreceptors for the virus. The fact that peripheral immunosupression is mediated at least in part by opioid receptors located in the central nervous system and that intrathecally administered opioids do not exert the same immunosuppressive effects may have important clinical implications for those patients receiving long-term opioid therapy for malignant and nonmalignant pain.

The opoid use is not justified but from what I've read you definately need the smart drugs. You've made a pretty stupid decision to use pain killers recreationally.

[Urbaneast]

The opoid use is not justified but from what I've read you definately need the smart drugs. You've made a pretty stupid decision to use pain killers recreationally.

Zoolander,

Thanks for the abstract. I appreciate your opinion, and even the slap that came with it. I've been taking it for 2 months and am indeed trying to taper off. In addition, I'm a non drinker who's never tried marijuana or any other illegal drug. I was/am going through a bad period and needed a way to escape; since I don't drink, my options are limited. I resisted the harder core, more addictive stuff and stuck with Codeine.

Sure, it's not optimal, but I'm trying to guage how much damage has been done.

[niner]

The opoid use is not justified but from what I've read you definately need the smart drugs. You've made a pretty stupid decision to use pain killers recreationally.

Zoolander,

Thanks for the abstract. I appreciate your opinion, and even the slap that came with it. I've been taking it for 2 months and am indeed trying to taper off. In addition, I'm a non drinker who's never tried marijuana or any other illegal drug. I was/am going through a bad period and needed a way to escape; since I don't drink, my options are limited. I resisted the harder core, more addictive stuff and stuck with Codeine.

Sure, it's not optimal, but I'm trying to guage how much damage has been done.

I don't know how much long term damage you may have, but my guess is probably not that much. I was on a megadose of fentanyl for about a month, and can't perceive any long term effects. You are likely to be addicted; that's the main thing you need to deal with. Codeine isn't even that good for anxiety anyway. How's the tapering off working? Do you think you can get all the way off? This is a situation where I would want to talk to a professional. Maybe a drug treatment center could refer you to a doctor or psychiatrist. You might be able to get off the codeine and transition to something more benign, as well as maybe more effective. There's probably a role for counseling here too. Good luck; I hope you get it sorted out.

[zoolander]

Urbaneast, I'm glad to took what I said as constructive. Addiction to pain killers is more common than people think and it can turn out to be a nasty situation.

[gashinshotan]

Urbaneast, I'm glad to took what I said as constructive. Addiction to pain killers is more common than people think and it can turn out to be a nasty situation.

Not if you're rich.

[lunarsolarpower]

Not if you're rich.

Rich enough to buy a new liver now and then...

[Urbaneast]

Rich enough to buy a new liver now and then...

I think it's the APAP (Tylenol) included in many OTC codeine products that causes the liver damage. To my knowledge, opiates themselves don't do this.

Edited by Urbaneast, 07 June 2008 - 10:26 AM.

[luv2increase]

Rich enough to buy a new liver now and then...

I think it's the APAP (Tylenol) included in many OTC codeine products that causes the liver damage. To my knowledge, opiates themselves don't do this.

Opiates are not at all toxic to the liver! Maybe "lunarsolarpower" was confusing the acetaminophen (APAP) that is in Vicodin and Percocet as being bad on the liver? I hope so. Otherwise he needs to shut it.

Edited by luv2increase, 20 June 2008 - 08:44 AM.

[luv2increase]

I don't know how much long term damage you may have, but my guess is probably not that much.

You guessed right smart guy...

I still can't believe you are a navigator niner. Wow!

[FunkOdyssey]

luv2increase: you are correct on this point but that is no excuse to be disrespectful and rude. Opiates are remarkably benign in their effects on physical health. They interfere with your well-being indirectly: financially, psychologically, relationships with spouse/family/friends, etc

[luv2increase]

luv2increase: you are correct on this point but that is no excuse to be disrespectful and rude. Opiates are remarkably benign in their effects on physical health. They interfere with your well-being indirectly: financially, psychologically, relationships with spouse/family/friends, etc

Very very true...

[zoolander]

Yes I agree with Funk Luv2increase. I remember that side of you very well. Let me remind you that this is an open forum where people are permitted to be both wrong and right. Telling people to "shut up" does not promote open discussion. All that said, it's good to see that you're back matey. I look forward to the many heated discussions

Edited by zoolander, 21 June 2008 - 12:57 AM.

[Matt]

Codeine just makes me feel weird, even half a solphadol knocks me out in a short amount of time lol. Though taking this kind of drug regularly is not good!

[zoolander]

That's good to hear Matty. Unfortunately though, for some people, codeine takes them to a nice place and it's to easy for these people to go to that nice place. I'm not one of those people

[Matt]

I probably take paracetamol / codeine tablets no more than 5 times per year.... Only when I REALLY need it, not for anything else other than controlling pain. My mother however is now addicted to it, and has been for several years.