17 replies to this topic

[harvillionare]

I started taking piracetam and choline bitrate this monday.

Heres what i've taken so far.

Monday:

4:00PM - 800mg piracetam, 250 choline

8:00PM - 800mg piracetam

***Both of mondays doses felt a calming effect and a little confusion

Tuesday:

8:00AM - 800mg piracetam, 250 choline

1:00PM - 800mg piracetam

4:00PM - 800mg piracetam

8:00PM - 800mg piracetam

***Tuesdays doses felt same as mondays with more forgetfullness. Intense and focused workout.

Wednesday:

8:00AM - 1600mg piracetam, 250 choline

1:00PM - 800mg piracetam

4:00PM - 800mg piracetam, 250 choline

8:00PM - 800mg piracetam

***Started feeling more aware today, but forgetfull, at 4:00 dose felt real tired and took a nap. Intense and focused workout.

Today:

8:00AM - 800mg piracetam, 250 choline

***not very much motivation at work, although my workout today during lunch break was more intense and focused than usual (same as tuesday and wednesdays workouts)



I have been reading a lot about how much choline you should take with piracetam and its very confusing because everyones different. I am not experiencing any substantial headaches besides mild ones because i have cut my caffeine intake by half this week. So overall I am feeling tired (except during workouts), somewhat unmotivated, a little forgetfull, but aware. Any suggestions?

[luv2increase]

I have been reading a lot about how much choline you should take with piracetam and its very confusing because everyones different. I am not experiencing any substantial headaches besides mild ones because i have cut my caffeine intake by half this week. So overall I am feeling tired (except during workouts), somewhat unmotivated, a little forgetfull, but aware. Any suggestions?

Much of this can be due to the cutting down by half of your caffeine intake. Also, piracetam does this to some. Your first course of action would be to up your choline intake until you come to a point just before your neck muscles start to tense up. This is your optimal level.

If this doesn't help, you may need to just let your body adjust to the lowered caffeine intake or quit all together which will make your symptoms last for "2 WEEKS".

[harvillionare]

I have been reading a lot about how much choline you should take with piracetam and its very confusing because everyones different. I am not experiencing any substantial headaches besides mild ones because i have cut my caffeine intake by half this week. So overall I am feeling tired (except during workouts), somewhat unmotivated, a little forgetfull, but aware. Any suggestions?

Much of this can be due to the cutting down by half of your caffeine intake. Also, piracetam does this to some. Your first course of action would be to up your choline intake until you come to a point just before your neck muscles start to tense up. This is your optimal level.

If this doesn't help, you may need to just let your body adjust to the lowered caffeine intake or quit all together which will make your symptoms last for "2 WEEKS".

Ok i wasnt sure if i should try more or less choline, but tomorow morning ill try 800 piracetam with 750 choline and see how that feels.

[hamishm00]

Dump the Choline Bitartrate. It's bioavailability is apparently low.

Lecithin + b5 or even better just take CDP Choline or Alpha GPC with your piracetam.

Try some Alcar + ALA as well, i've found that usually picks up the pace of things.

[brotherx]

Hi Harvillionare,

3200mg - 4000mg Piracetam might also be too much.
There are a lot of people how find a low dose (something between 400mg - 1600mg) much more effective.
There is an inverted U-Curve with Piracetam - which means: There is an optimal dose - and if you take more - it will be counter productive.

You write that you weren't very much motivated at work. This is an interesting comment - but only useful if you set it into context. Like: I am always very motivated and focused at work - and this is the first day I am not.

And as others have already stated - it is said that choline bitrate is not very effective. You might switch to another source.

Cheers

Alex

I started taking piracetam and choline bitrate this monday.

Heres what i've taken so far.

Monday:

4:00PM - 800mg piracetam, 250 choline

8:00PM - 800mg piracetam

***Both of mondays doses felt a calming effect and a little confusion

Tuesday:

8:00AM - 800mg piracetam, 250 choline

1:00PM - 800mg piracetam

4:00PM - 800mg piracetam

8:00PM - 800mg piracetam

***Tuesdays doses felt same as mondays with more forgetfullness. Intense and focused workout.

Wednesday:

8:00AM - 1600mg piracetam, 250 choline

1:00PM - 800mg piracetam

4:00PM - 800mg piracetam, 250 choline

8:00PM - 800mg piracetam

***Started feeling more aware today, but forgetfull, at 4:00 dose felt real tired and took a nap. Intense and focused workout.

Today:

8:00AM - 800mg piracetam, 250 choline

***not very much motivation at work, although my workout today during lunch break was more intense and focused than usual (same as tuesday and wednesdays workouts)



I have been reading a lot about how much choline you should take with piracetam and its very confusing because everyones different. I am not experiencing any substantial headaches besides mild ones because i have cut my caffeine intake by half this week. So overall I am feeling tired (except during workouts), somewhat unmotivated, a little forgetfull, but aware. Any suggestions?

Edited by brotherx, 01 August 2008 - 11:57 AM.

[Declmem]

I know its been asked before, but do you think CDP-Choline is synergistic with Piracetam?

I'm also experiencing some "forgetfullness" while on Piracetam. The stuff seems to help alleviate depression and have other benefits, but makes me forget common words and facts I should know. I'm taking 3200mg of Piracetam spread throughout the day in 4 800mg doses. The only choline source I'm taking is 250mg Life Extension CDP-choline in the morning early morning. I'm limiting it to one dose because that is what the instructions call for.

I'm waiting for some Centrophenoxine to arrive as well. Looking forward to that.

Thanks

Edited by Declmem, 01 August 2008 - 12:42 PM.

[harvillionare]

Dump the Choline Bitartrate. It's bioavailability is apparently low.

Lecithin + b5 or even better just take CDP Choline or Alpha GPC with your piracetam.

Try some Alcar + ALA as well, i've found that usually picks up the pace of things.

This morning I took 800mg with 750 bitrate and got same results. Im gonna go pick up some Lecithin at gnc today and try 2 400mg piracetam doses with the Lecithin. If that doesnt work i might try Alpha GPC or just try a different nootropic.

[harvillionare]

Hi Harvillionare,

3200mg - 4000mg Piracetam might also be too much.
There are a lot of people how find a low dose (something between 400mg - 1600mg) much more effective.
There is an inverted U-Curve with Piracetam - which means: There is an optimal dose - and if you take more - it will be counter productive.

You write that you weren't very much motivated at work. This is an interesting comment - but only useful if you set it into context. Like: I am always very motivated and focused at work - and this is the first day I am not.

And as others have already stated - it is said that choline bitrate is not very effective. You might switch to another source.

Cheers

Alex

Ya your prolly right, because i dosed high for the first three days i think im gonna take this weekend off and start fresh on monday with the lower dose as i mentioned earlier and the Lecithin. And as for work, I am usually semi motivated haha. Having a computer job its easy to get distracted.

[brotherx]

Lol - so Piracetam might not be the source of your semi-motivation.
By the way a lot of people think that Lecitin is an inferior source of choline. Alpha GPC or CDC-choline might be a better choice.

Cheers - and enjoy your weekend!

Alex

Hi Harvillionare,

3200mg - 4000mg Piracetam might also be too much.
There are a lot of people how find a low dose (something between 400mg - 1600mg) much more effective.
There is an inverted U-Curve with Piracetam - which means: There is an optimal dose - and if you take more - it will be counter productive.

You write that you weren't very much motivated at work. This is an interesting comment - but only useful if you set it into context. Like: I am always very motivated and focused at work - and this is the first day I am not.

And as others have already stated - it is said that choline bitrate is not very effective. You might switch to another source.

Cheers

Alex

Ya your prolly right, because i dosed high for the first three days i think im gonna take this weekend off and start fresh on monday with the lower dose as i mentioned earlier and the Lecithin. And as for work, I am usually semi motivated haha. Having a computer job its easy to get distracted.

[luv2increase]

I'm waiting for some Centrophenoxine to arrive as well. Looking forward to that.

This is the best choline source available and provides the best complimentary benefits available from any and all of the choline sources put together. Absolutely phenomenal!

[hamishm00]

Dump the Choline Bitartrate. It's bioavailability is apparently low.

Lecithin + b5 or even better just take CDP Choline or Alpha GPC with your piracetam.

Try some Alcar + ALA as well, i've found that usually picks up the pace of things.

This morning I took 800mg with 750 bitrate and got same results. Im gonna go pick up some Lecithin at gnc today and try 2 400mg piracetam doses with the Lecithin. If that doesnt work i might try Alpha GPC or just try a different nootropic.

Always take b5 with the lecithin. Get your dosages right. 2.4grams of piracetam is quite a big dose by the way. I wouldn't just give up on 800mg - as BrotherX said, it's a U curve. it's entirely possible that 800mg might be on the same horizontal latitude of the U curve (just on the other side of the U) assuming you assign dosages on the horizontal and effectiveness on the vertical of an effectiveness/dosages graph.

[hamishm00]

I'm waiting for some Centrophenoxine to arrive as well. Looking forward to that.

This is the best choline source available and provides the best complimentary benefits available from any and all of the choline sources put together. Absolutely phenomenal!

Doesn't centrophenoxine just break down into DMAE in the blood? I am sure it is more effective than DMAE, but isn't that the effective ingredient.

I only ask this because I've seen some recent reports on DMAE and the manner in which is increases (or doesn't for that matter) choline in the brian.

[harvillionare]

Always take b5 with the lecithin. Get your dosages right. 2.4grams of piracetam is quite a big dose by the way. I wouldn't just give up on 800mg - as BrotherX said, it's a U curve. it's entirely possible that 800mg might be on the same horizontal latitude of the U curve (just on the other side of the U) assuming you assign dosages on the horizontal and effectiveness on the vertical of an effectiveness/dosages graph.

Sorry, i didnt mean a 2400mg dose i meant two 400mg doses during one day to see if i reacted better to a lower dose. I should be getting some alpha gpc in today or tomorrow, then i'll try it. Thanks.

[luv2increase]

I'm waiting for some Centrophenoxine to arrive as well. Looking forward to that.

This is the best choline source available and provides the best complimentary benefits available from any and all of the choline sources put together. Absolutely phenomenal!

Doesn't centrophenoxine just break down into DMAE in the blood? I am sure it is more effective than DMAE, but isn't that the effective ingredient.

I only ask this because I've seen some recent reports on DMAE and the manner in which is increases (or doesn't for that matter) choline in the brian.

DMAE is a component of centrophenoxine yet both have different mechanisms of action. There has been negative info on DMAE yet none on centrophenoxine. I said in another post about MDMA and methamphetamine. They are both very similar yet with very different modes of action.

[Advanc3d]

How much Choline Bitartrate is Equivalent to say a single dose of CDP-Choline?


Choline bitartrate is very cheap compared to any other choline source,
so i rather take that instead
even if it means i have to take grams of it a day to get same desirable effects


I my self take 2400mg Piracetam, 2000mg Choline Bitartrate, 100mg DMAE Bitartrate, 500mg Vitamin B5 and Vitamin C together and i get good effects out of it

Edited by Advanc3d, 05 August 2008 - 11:56 AM.

[hamishm00]

How much Choline Bitartrate is Equivalent to say a single dose of CDP-Choline?


Choline bitartrate is very cheap compared to any other choline source,
so i rather take that instead
even if it means i have to take grams of it a day to get same desirable effects


I my self take 2400mg Piracetam, 2000mg Choline Bitartrate, 100mg DMAE Bitartrate, 500mg Vitamin B5 and Vitamin C together and i get good effects out of it

Just quickly: thanks for the response luv2increase - very interesting and I understand and agree with the analogy.

I don't think it's fair to compare CDP Choline to Choline Bitartrate, although if you were to rate choline sources on their ability to convert into Acetylcholine in the brain, the weakest to strongest would probably be:

1. PhosphatidylCholine
2. Choline (As bitartrate, Chloride, and Citrate) & Lecithin - the effect of supplementing with this stuff with b5 could improve this rating.
3. DMAE (with reservations - see posts on this recently)
4. CDP-Choline / Alpha-GPC

CDP-Choline is what I'm using and seems to work well. Lots of studies conducted on it so that it's effective.

I myself would give Choline Bitartrate a miss, but hey if it works then it works. In theory it should work, but it might not work as well as others. *laugh*

I suspect the fact that you take b5 with it makes all the difference. I would be interested to know what effect you would feel if you took b5 out of your stack.

[harvillionare]

Got my alpha gpc in yesterday so heres what i took today.

8AM: 500mg piracetam, 500mg alpha

4PM: 500mg piracetam, 500mg alpha


***would have wrote something about each dose, but didnt feel anything substantial enough to write except maybe some fatigue and very mild headache at times. Any thoughts on upping lowering or keeping same doses?

Am going to start taking a b complex that has b5 in it. 100mg 2 times a day.

[harvillionare]

Did a few days with alpha gpc and got the same results after a few days..

I take a preworkout drink called white flood, half dose on workout days and non workout days. And just noticed that it contains huperzine-a. After my couple of weeks of trying piracetam my conclusion was that piracetam without choline didnt do much, but choline by itself or with piracetam made me tired and forgetfull. I wanted to see if huperzine-a would be interfering and according to this website it is a acetylcholinesterase inhibitor. Not sure exactly what it means but anyone know if this is interfering?
http://relentlessimp...huperzine-a.htm