27 replies to this topic

[setotitan]

hey all! well this is my inaugural post on here, hope i don't get crucified i saw a program today on racetams and it was thoroughly compelling. the idea that you could take a supplement and enhance your cognitive functionality is mind blowing! i've always been one to try and keep my mind sharp, buying one of those "brain challenge" games, taking flax seed and such, anything that would give me that little mental edge. so naturally racetams interested me and i wanted to check them out. doing a couple hours research today i quickly found that not everyone has such a definitive position on the what, when, and why's of their application. being a man of practice rather than theory i decided i'd give one a try. i must admit i'm very much looking forward to the results and will be sure to post an in detailed mini journal of my dosage and experience. however i did have two questions before i got started. looking at the major front runners in the racetam realm there appears to be three that really stand out:

piracetam - the original

aniracetam - the next big thing

pramiracetam - the future

from what i've read piracetam was the first of the racetam's and seems to be everyone's "go to" when they talk about the subject. then there's aniracetam that's fat soluble and up to 8 times more potent than piracetam. lastly i see pramiracetam claiming to be up to 30 times more potent than piracetam. personally i tend to push the envelope a little and want to go beyond the norm, but at the same time don't want to go to close to the edge and fall off. as such i decided to give aniracetam a shot. i really wanted to experience pramiracetam but i just couldn't find enough information on it to feel safe. i placed my order through Relentless Improvement and was very impressed with all their information. which leads me to my two questions...

1) i've heard some people say dosage is everything with racetams, i'm 5'11" 250lbs what should my dosage be?

2) why is there so much talk about piracetam when obviously racetams are moving beyond it?

Edited by setotitan, 19 September 2008 - 12:24 AM.

[Rags847]

Welcome. Excellent first post.

Piracetam is still popular because it has unique, subtle effects. It isn't simply that the other racetams are more potent - they each have different qualities. Do a search and you can find reports desribing users experiences with each.

Choline supplementation with the racetams is basic. Prevents headaches and neck/upper body muscle tension.
CDP-Choline and Centrophenoxine are the two most popular.
See this thread http://www.imminst.o...mp;#entry264050

Dose range of Piracetam is generally 2.4g - 9.6g. The middle range (4.8g/day) is often used.
Too much and many report a tired/fatigue problem.

Good luck.

Report back.

[Zoroaster]

I wouldn't say racetams are "moving beyond" piracetam. Just because aniracetam is 8 times more potent doesn't mean it produces a greater effect in the body. For all of the racetams there is a U-shaped dose response curve, meaning that too much makes you feel worse and too little doesn't do much. So there is a sweet spot. Turns out the sweet spot for aniracetam is at a much smaller dose than the sweet spot for piracetam. So you can't just take equivalent amounts of piracetam and aniracetam and expect to simply get 8 times the effect with aniracetam. It doesn't work that way. You take less aniracetam and end up having a fairly similar experience. Its the same deal with pramiracetam, oxiracetam, and all the others.

But each of the racetams has a somewhat unique effect. So people tend to chose their racetams based not on potency, but on which one they like the best. Cost and convenience ends up being a consideration as well. I cap my own nootropic mixes so piracetam is not a good choice for me. Each dose would take up several caps. So I use oxiracetam the most. Doses are small so I can fit it in my caps, and its water soluble (unlike ani or pram) so I can cap it with my other noots most of which are also water soluble. Its also cheaper than the most expensive racetams.

So there you go. Hate to burst your bubble but taking a dose of pram isn't 30 times better than a dose of piracetam. Its just much much smaller. Anyway, welcome to the forum.

Oh and for your dose of aniracetam I'd just say, experiment. Everyone's optimal dose seems to be a bit different. And its pretty hard to hurt yourself with racetams. Don't take like 10 of them or anything, but I'm just saying a little bit of experimentation isn't going to hurt you.

[hamishm00]

I stack it like this:

800mg Oxi
1500mg piracetam
800mg ani

with 500mg CDP choline.

That's a pretty normal racetam stack, although quite a sizeable one. It's impossible to push yourself over the edge with racetams, all you will do is reach a point where you become dumber and you get what we like to call 'brian fog'.

Pretty interesting supplement actually, and a true nootropic in the sense that it's almost completely non-toxic, although aniracetam is not as well tolerated as pira and oxi. I can definitely sense a slight shift in skin "toxicity" with aniracetam, although it's nothing I really give two thoughts about, but it's my least favourite racetam for work, but definitely ranks ahead of pira and oxi for being a creativity enhancer (music, abstract though, lateral thinking).

Pram? definitely not the future. More like an undiscovered country that noone wants to visit because they have better places to go on holiday.

For your size, I'd recommend 500-800mg of ani to start with, work up to a gram (a pretty sizeable dose), then work down to 300mg or lower, see what's best. follow the advice you've gotten on the choline as well.

Edited by hamishm00, 19 September 2008 - 01:15 PM.

[setotitan]

thanks guys for all the information and setting me straight on some things. it's one thing to speculate from google results, and it's quite another to hear first hand account from real people. i will definitely pick up some choline and incorporate that into my regimen. it's interesting to hear that different racetams give you different feelings. i'd heard piracetam actually helped aleviate anxiety in some peoples accounts. i have a little touch of SAD (social anxiety disorder) myself, so i'm hoping to get some postive results. either way as i mentioned earlier i'll report back with my results.

[Rags847]

it's interesting to hear that different racetams give you different feelings. i'd heard piracetam actually helped aleviate anxiety in some peoples accounts. i have a little touch of SAD (social anxiety disorder) myself, so i'm hoping to get some postive results.

Absolutely on Piracetam and calmness. I think of it as Piracetam's dual-layer effect. Your PNS isn't jacked like with the stimulants (your body is calm), but when the nootropics kick in your CNS (brain) becomes enlivened and stimulated. Brain forward, body calm - I love it. I feel I can calm down and feel settled, etc and then put a stimulated, more active and receptive brain in gear, at will. And I can choose either direction at will - both are simultaneously available. Also, regarding calmness, Piracetam does enhance in that direction as well; at that level, a calmer, more flowing creativity is opened up.

As long as I don't over-administer and take too much Piracetam, I'll experience the dual-layers, both concurrant effects. Too much and fatigue and tiredness take over.

Edited by Rags847, 20 September 2008 - 08:49 PM.

[mystery]

Choline supplementation with the racetams is basic. Prevents headaches and neck/upper body muscle tension.
CDP-Choline and Centrophenoxine are the two most popular.
See this thread http://www.imminst.o...mp;#entry264050

Dose range of Piracetam is generally 2.4g - 9.6g. The middle range (4.8g/day) is often used.
Too much and many report a tired/fatigue problem.

Good luck.

Report back.

Acetylcholine boosters sometimes might exerbate muscle tension, as they do in me. It depends on which one, and I'm still experementing with lots of them. I prefere just not taking any acetylcholine booster, so this very much depends on the individual. In general though, most people like to take an acetylcholine booster with a racetam.

Dosing of piracetam (or any of the racetams) appears to be highly variable. I like to take just 150 mg of piracetam or less. I'm experimenting more with the other racetams, and less than that seems to be optimal. If I take too much piracetam then I notice pain in eyes, and I feel mental fog with muscle tension. If I was taking as much as peole often recommend, then my eyes would be totally bloodshot!

Don't get discouraged if your response to aniracetam (or any other individual racetam for that matter) is not great. Personally, I find it can make me drowsy on just a very small dose (150 mg), which might actually prove to be very useful. I've tried piracetam, aniracetam, oxiracetam, and phenylpiracetam, and I find them all quite distinct. I find myself using oxiracetam and phenylpiracetam more during work, and piracetam more when I want to play computer games or listen to music. It makes it a more enjoyable experience.

I don't think any one racetam is the future, but that they are all likely to become much more popular.

Edited by mystery, 20 September 2008 - 11:34 PM.

[nancy_axel]

Does anyone know how to extend the effects of aniracetam? I find the pira/pram combo to be excellant when you are 'riding the top of the wave', so to speak. Every 3-4 hours you have to redose, at least with the anira -- which is really annoying because you feel the effects of anira transiently, which causes one to feel chemically-induced mood swings. I was wondering if anyone found deprenyl or anything else to help prolong the effects of anira?

[john16]

I stack it like this:

800mg Oxi
1500mg piracetam
800mg ani

with 500mg CDP choline.

That's a pretty normal racetam stack, although quite a sizeable one. It's impossible to push yourself over the edge with racetams, all you will do is reach a point where you become dumber and you get what we like to call 'brian fog'.

Pretty interesting supplement actually, and a true nootropic in the sense that it's almost completely non-toxic, although aniracetam is not as well tolerated as pira and oxi. I can definitely sense a slight shift in skin "toxicity" with aniracetam, although it's nothing I really give two thoughts about, but it's my least favourite racetam for work, but definitely ranks ahead of pira and oxi for being a creativity enhancer (music, abstract though, lateral thinking).

Pram? definitely not the future. More like an undiscovered country that noone wants to visit because they have better places to go on holiday.

For your size, I'd recommend 500-800mg of ani to start with, work up to a gram (a pretty sizeable dose), then work down to 300mg or lower, see what's best. follow the advice you've gotten on the choline as well.

can you elaborate on that..im confused as to what you mean..thanks!!

[luv2increase]

Pram? definitely not the future. More like an undiscovered country that noone wants to visit because they have better places to go on holiday.

LOL Oh so true from all the information I've read on Pram over the last few years.

I think of it as Piracetam's dual-layer effect. Your PNS isn't jacked like with the stimulants (your body is calm), but when the nootropics kick in your CNS (brain) becomes enlivened and stimulated. Brain forward, body calm - I love it.

That is a beautiful way to put it Rags; it fits my perception of piracetam to a T! I really enjoyed reading that

[nancy_axel]

Pram? definitely not the future. More like an undiscovered country that noone wants to visit because they have better places to go on holiday.

LOL Oh so true from all the information I've read on Pram over the last few years.

I think of it as Piracetam's dual-layer effect. Your PNS isn't jacked like with the stimulants (your body is calm), but when the nootropics kick in your CNS (brain) becomes enlivened and stimulated. Brain forward, body calm - I love it.

That is a beautiful way to put it Rags; it fits my perception of piracetam to a T! I really enjoyed reading that

Poetically true. Pram is one hell of a drug. Judging from the vast majority, memory is improved over the course of weeks but its not worth the side effects for me. I prefer piracetam -- which does the exact same thing (although it'll take you weeks to get there) -- the feeling is that one is more in touch with reality. With pram you can open up a dream world where I've found myself severely detached from reality. Its a noot that helps a little with memory -- but it'll restructure your thinking and quiet your mind. From the words of fear & loathing .. 'we're in batt country' ladies and gentlemen .. not too pleasant unless your present reality is unbearable.

[yoyo]

thanks guys for all the information and setting me straight on some things. it's one thing to speculate from google results, and it's quite another to hear first hand account from real people. i will definitely pick up some choline and incorporate that into my regimen. it's interesting to hear that different racetams give you different feelings. i'd heard piracetam actually helped aleviate anxiety in some peoples accounts. i have a little touch of SAD (social anxiety disorder) myself, so i'm hoping to get some postive results. either way as i mentioned earlier i'll report back with my results.

I'd look into aniracetam then, as it has been shown to have axiolytic and antidepressant properties. Not annihilating anxiety like a benzo, but it is nice because it helps you think, unlike a benzo which will mess with memory.

[john16]

I wouldn't say racetams are "moving beyond" piracetam. Just because aniracetam is 8 times more potent doesn't mean it produces a greater effect in the body. For all of the racetams there is a U-shaped dose response curve, meaning that too much makes you feel worse and too little doesn't do much. So there is a sweet spot. Turns out the sweet spot for aniracetam is at a much smaller dose than the sweet spot for piracetam. So you can't just take equivalent amounts of piracetam and aniracetam and expect to simply get 8 times the effect with aniracetam. It doesn't work that way. You take less aniracetam and end up having a fairly similar experience. Its the same deal with pramiracetam, oxiracetam, and all the others.

But each of the racetams has a somewhat unique effect. So people tend to chose their racetams based not on potency, but on which one they like the best. Cost and convenience ends up being a consideration as well. I cap my own nootropic mixes so piracetam is not a good choice for me. Each dose would take up several caps. So I use oxiracetam the most. Doses are small so I can fit it in my caps, and its water soluble (unlike ani or pram) so I can cap it with my other noots most of which are also water soluble. Its also cheaper than the most expensive racetams.

So there you go. Hate to burst your bubble but taking a dose of pram isn't 30 times better than a dose of piracetam. Its just much much smaller. Anyway, welcome to the forum.

Oh and for your dose of aniracetam I'd just say, experiment. Everyone's optimal dose seems to be a bit different. And its pretty hard to hurt yourself with racetams. Don't take like 10 of them or anything, but I'm just saying a little bit of experimentation isn't going to hurt you.

wow, this is interesting...so basically, piracetam at 500g for $15.00 is will last you just as long as aniracetam at 250g for $30.00?? this is because you can take half the dose of aniracetam and still feel the effects?

[Rags847]

I think of it as Piracetam's dual-layer effect. Your PNS isn't jacked like with the stimulants (your body is calm), but when the nootropics kick in your CNS (brain) becomes enlivened and stimulated. Brain forward, body calm - I love it.

That is a beautiful way to put it Rags; it fits my perception of piracetam to a T! I really enjoyed reading that

Thanks luv2increase. It's really worthwhile and fascinating to try to really self-observe and capture in words the specific qualities of any psychotropic substance.

Right now I'm exploring piracetam and dextroamphetamine on the same day, for the first time, having always done trials of these two substances separately. When I take piracetam alone (w/o the dex) at a medium dose (3.2g), I get a certain degree of good stimulation, but when I take a second dose (3.2) I have so much in my system that I then get the calmer and sleepier effects to too great a degree for studying. I'm finding that the piracetam and dextroampamine really potentiate one another. Lately, taking just a little piracetam, and then dextroamphetamine a few hours later, causes the piracetam to feel eight times a strong and very long lasting. The dextroamphetamine stimulation drives the piracetam into the brain. Great for studying.

It might be interesting on certain days when I just want to chill, to take the medium to higher doses of piracetam alone for those great calm, creative, spacey, enhancing effects. In general, piracetam is excellent for increasing higher order thinking, access to and recall of memory, and for creating a really strong, intense concentration. Piracetam-concentration, as a result of intense thought-production and mental processing, is of a higher quality and far superior to taking stimulants (dextroamphetamine) alone, with concentration that results from being forced shockingly awake and alert, like a fluorescent lightbulb, but not from being thought-enriched and front-brain led.

Piracetam-stimulated - piracetam-boosted formula - is what I'm going for.

Mentally chewing and tearing up life is the deal and the ideal.

Rags

Edited by Rags847, 12 October 2008 - 07:26 AM.

[nancy_axel]

Can one extend the effects of aniracetam with huperzine?

[graatch]

I wish I could consistently reproduce the effects that some of you guys describe with piracetam, but it's really inconsistent for me. The dose that one day eased my thought into beautiful patterning threads gives me a dull, cloudy, "what?" feeling the next day. Oh well.

[Conanld]

Yes, that has been my experience, but I have found that huperzine will extend the effect of virtually any racetam in my experience. Just don't take huperzine very often or in large doses.

LD

Can one extend the effects of aniracetam with huperzine?

[Conanld]

I have found the same to be true with adderall and piracetam.

LD

I'm finding that the piracetam and dextroampamine really potentiate one another.

[Rags847]

I wish I could consistently reproduce the effects that some of you guys describe with piracetam, but it's really inconsistent for me. The dose that one day eased my thought into beautiful patterning threads gives me a dull, cloudy, "what?" feeling the next day. Oh well.

I have found the same to be true with adderall and piracetam.

LD

I'm finding that the piracetam and dextroampamine really potentiate one another.

How are you finding adderral + piracteam, LD? Positive/negative?



Piracetam can have a really great effect for me or make me sleepy and then all is ruined.


Been trying to combine piracetam w/ other things to prolong piractams posiive effects and overcome it's sleepy ones:

Piractam + caffeine - so far not working out, not stimulating enough.

Piracteam + detroamphetamine - problematic, so far. Headaches. Too much bloodflow to the head. Piracetam/cdp-choline increasing bloodflow to head and the d-amp increasing bloodpressure. Both together -> headache.
Also, stomach upset, both taken together produces a very acidic reaction. So, started taking with food and taking the pir/ch first and the d-amp 3 hours later. Seemed to help.

Frustrating, cause when Piracetam works it is very special.

Wondering about Piracetam + Modafinil. If it could be useful in keeping Piracetam awake. Although, Modafinil alone didn't impress much and did lead to headaches/back of neck and shoulder tension after a few weeks of regular use.


Grrrr ... I'd love to get the three golden effects:

• Mood elevation

• Energy

• Mind enhancement

D-Amp provides the first two. Piracetam/Choline source the third.

Perhaps, I'll try an AM/PM split. D-Amp in the morning to really get my day going. Piracetam/CDP-Choline in the afternoon to mind enhance and wind down the day, without the sleep disturbance risk and continued appetite-suppresion of stimulants late in the day.



Can't find a lab rat, so I guess I'll be one.

Edited by Rags847, 16 October 2008 - 02:53 AM.

[Conanld]

In terms of how I feel, the adderall and piracetam combination has been absolutely wonderful. In fact I've never felt better in my life. I also add something like CDP choline to the mix.

If I take piracetam in isolation, I have noticed that it can make me sleepy at times as well. However, I do not recall a single instance where I have felt sleepy with the adderall/piracetam/choline source combination.

Nor have I experienced any headaches from this combination. Ironically perhaps, I have even noticed a significant reduction in the migraine headaches that used to plaque me on nearly an every other day occurrence. Now, when I do get them regardless, they are always of lesser intensity too.

There is one caveat, and you have already brought this potential issue to light. I have noticed a slight increase in my blood pressure, but I'm not yet prepared to place the blame squarely upon the adderall/piracetam combination. Moreover, adderall in isolation, has not had a significant lasting long term impact upon my BP, and I've been taking it for about 4 years now at dosages of 10 mg twice a day. I'm currently in the midst of experimenting in order to flush out the source for the BP rise. So far, my results appear to be inconclusive. Unfortunately, there are so many other factors that can contribute to a blood pressure increase, that it can be very difficult to isolate the impact of a single potential factor. Some aspect of my BP rise could of course have nothing whatsoever to do with my supplementation. For example, the company I work for is currently downsizing, and so work stress and worry could undoubtedly be a factor.

At the present time I am beginning to suspect that it is the L-carnitine that either in isolation or in combination with some other supplement(s), is causing the rise in BP. When I remove this one supplement, I notice that my BP tends to head back down again over a period of days, although not yet to the point of my original baseline. It will likely take me a few more weeks of experimenting for me to get a better handle on this.

LD

I wish I could consistently reproduce the effects that some of you guys describe with piracetam, but it's really inconsistent for me. The dose that one day eased my thought into beautiful patterning threads gives me a dull, cloudy, "what?" feeling the next day. Oh well.

I have found the same to be true with adderall and piracetam.

LD

I'm finding that the piracetam and dextroampamine really potentiate one another.

How are you finding adderral + piracteam, LD? Positive/negative?



Piracetam can have a really great effect for me or make me sleepy and then all is ruined.


Been trying to combine piracetam w/ other things to prolong piractams posiive effects and overcome it's sleepy ones:

Piractam + caffeine - so far not working out, not stimulating enough.

Piracteam + detroamphetamine - problematic, so far. Headaches. Too much bloodflow to the head. Piracetam/cdp-choline increasing bloodflow to head and the d-amp increasing bloodpressure. Both together -> headache.
Also, stomach upset, both taken together produces a very acidic reaction. So, started taking with food and taking the pir/ch first and the d-amp 3 hours later. Seemed to help.

Frustrating, cause when Piracetam works it is very special.

Wondering about Piracetam + Modafinil. If it could be useful in keeping Piracetam awake. Although, Modafinil alone didn't impress much and did lead to headaches/back of neck and shoulder tension after a few weeks of regular use.


Grrrr ... I'd love to get the three golden effects:

• Mood elevation

• Energy

• Mind enhancement

D-Amp provides the first two. Piracetam/Choline source the third.

Perhaps, I'll try an AM/PM split. D-Amp in the morning to really get my day going. Piracetam/CDP-Choline in the afternoon to mind enhance and wind down the day, without the sleep disturbance risk and continued appetite-suppresion of stimulants late in the day.



Can't find a lab rat, so I guess I'll be one.

[Rags847]

Interesting LD. Thanks for the account of Adderall with Piracetam.

Some qts:

10 mg twice daily for the Adderall, what is your dosing of Piracetam/Choline?
You take them at the same time?
With/without food?
Which effects do you find potentiated, both the Adderall's and Piracetam's?
Do you find the length of action potentiated (lasts more hours) as well as the strength of effects?
Any overstimulation experienced?
Lower dose of each or same as when used them seperately?

And how do you get your BP measured? How often? I was thinking of buying a BP kit to regularly (weekly?) track mine.

I think the whole world's BP has risen with the uncertain state of the world's economy.

What supps lower bloodpressure? Fish oil, for example is great for the health of the cardiovascular system.

Edited by Rags847, 16 October 2008 - 05:11 PM.

[brotherx]

I hope you didn't invest too much into Lehman Brothers!;-)

Some qts:


I think the whole world's BP has risen with the uncertain state of the world's economy.

What supps lower bloodpressure? Fish oil, for example is great for the health of the cardiovascular system.

[Conanld]

I take the adderall first by itself, and then I follow-up approximately 20 minutes later with 800 to 1,600 mg of piracetam and 250 mg of CDP choline taken together. All three are taken on an empty stomach early in the morning prior to breakfast.

I find that Adderall and Piracetam potentiate each other, but not on an equal basis. Piracetam appears to potentiate the adderall to a greater extent than the reverse scenario. I find the 'length of action' as well as the 'strength of effects' to be potentiated by the combination of these supplements. Perhaps related to the strength issue, is the elimination of the sleepy state whenever combining piracetam with adderall.

Normally I don't experience 'over-stimulation' unless I add too much CDP choline, or perhaps something like L - Huperzine A, combined with too much CDP choline.

I suspect that my U shaped racetam curve is a bit more forgiving than it is for other folks. I can gain a great deal of benefit on a moderate dosage, while a heavy dose will not necessarily cause problems for me other than perhaps to be a waste of money.

There is one other phenomenon that I have noticed whenever combining adderall with a racetam. This combination will most definitely allow me to power through a tough day at full throttle, and certainly in a way that is far superior to anything that I could ever manage on my own without these supplements. However, after some point, I can become mentally exhausted and not fully realize this until after I start making mistakes. I may still feel alert, but the mistakes will start to happen at some point, and they will almost always surprise me. Naturally, I would reach this state more quickly without the supplementation of the adderall and piracetam, but it is something to be aware of nevertheless.

I use an OMRON Deluxe wrist Blood Pressure Monitor to take my blood pressure. It's reasonably accurate and its very convenient, but if you get one you should have it validated at the doctor's office, or a fire station.

A few supplements that might help with blood pressure include these:

Potassium

Fish Oil

Magnesium

Hawthorn (herb)

Diabetics and pre-diabetics can sometimes lower their blood pressure by more closely monitoring and controlling their blood sugar, since hypertension and diabetes are often interrelated.

LD

Interesting LD. Thanks for the account of Adderall with Piracetam.

Some qts:

10 mg twice daily for the Adderall, what is your dosing of Piracetam/Choline?
You take them at the same time?
With/without food?
Which effects do you find potentiated, both the Adderall's and Piracetam's?
Do you find the length of action potentiated (lasts more hours) as well as the strength of effects?
Any overstimulation experienced?
Lower dose of each or same as when used them seperately?

And how do you get your BP measured? How often? I was thinking of buying a BP kit to regularly (weekly?) track mine.

I think the whole world's BP has risen with the uncertain state of the world's economy.

What supps lower bloodpressure? Fish oil, for example is great for the health of the cardiovascular system.

[nancy_axel]

Interesting LD. Thanks for the account of Adderall with Piracetam.

Some qts:

10 mg twice daily for the Adderall, what is your dosing of Piracetam/Choline?
You take them at the same time?
With/without food?
Which effects do you find potentiated, both the Adderall's and Piracetam's?
Do you find the length of action potentiated (lasts more hours) as well as the strength of effects?
Any overstimulation experienced?
Lower dose of each or same as when used them seperately?

And how do you get your BP measured? How often? I was thinking of buying a BP kit to regularly (weekly?) track mine.

I think the whole world's BP has risen with the uncertain state of the world's economy.

What supps lower bloodpressure? Fish oil, for example is great for the health of the cardiovascular system.

Do you still feel like yourself on this stack (ie. is your personality still distinctly yours or do you feel the spock effect)? Does the piracetam tend to bring the more 'you' out?
Do you notice any synergy like other people have said? Have you reduced the amount of adderall you normally take in to compensate?

[Conanld]

For me, I cannot say that it is always one way or the other. At times I do very much feel the so called spock effect, where I am inclined to want to discuss something strictly from a logical perspective with all emotion removed from the discussion, but it is not always this way. I can just as easily feel more empathatic towards others than I might otherwise be inclined to feel. I believe the context of the situation will in some way determine how I will respond.

The notion of personality change is an interesting one. In my mind, if a person grows emotionally or intellectually, then they are in effect having a personality change. If nootropics are in some way responsible for this, then I say, why not?

Sometimes I will take only 1 adderall pill per day rather than the two that I used to consistently take.

LD

Do you still feel like yourself on this stack (ie. is your personality still distinctly yours or do you feel the spock effect)? Does the piracetam tend to bring the more 'you' out?
Do you notice any synergy like other people have said? Have you reduced the amount of adderall you normally take in to compensate?

[setotitan]

well i know i haven't given a great play by play of my experience but i did want to check back in and report. first off i had no real side effects from aniracetam, i tried stacking with the choline for the first week and i didn't really notice a difference so i discontinued it. i started with 750mg and really didn't feel much effect. i then worked up to 1500mg and i did feel a big effect. i felt quicker and more focused, like after drinking a red bull but without the side effects. unfortunately i only felt a real effect for 60-90min, which was the most disappointing part of the whole experience. i was looking for a permanent boost, something i could take once maybe twice a day and feel sustained difference. also just in general memory i haven't noticed a clear change. i think that aniracetam is nice for a quick boost when you need it. i'm going to give piracetam a try and see if there's any difference. i'll let you know how it goes...

[graatch]

For the purpose of thread continuity, I detailed my (pleasant) response to CDP-choline added to dextroamphetamine (and memantine) in another thread:

I take citicoline, 500-1000mg in the morning and 500mg 6 hours later. It rocks. Certainly, personally, my favorite out of the cholinergics I've tried. Taking it later in the day very noticeably messes up my sleep, both induction and quality.

I notice a very substantial increase in rumination and thought "intensity", loops and threads of cognition, if you will.

It is very helpful if I am focused to direct it, as I now am, successfully medicated with memantine and dextroamphetamine. Previously, in my inattentive depressed state, it was perhaps not so helpful, even depressiogenic if the intense thought process ended up being applied to unpleasant feelings. If you will. Speaking of consciousness here ... it requires some metaphor. ;-)

Although, citicoline was less problematic in that way than choline citrate or galantamine was. I never noticed much effect from alpha-GPC, personally.

But yeah, now very helpful. The intensified thought-process is applied to deepening my understanding, everything thinking is good for, yadda yadda.

I also notice an increased desire for nicotine. This is not problematic for me (besides cost), as I use nicotine lozenges and enjoy them as a neuroprotective supplement

I haven't been able to get much out of piracetam lately, although I've been wary of experimenting because I don't want to be brain-fogged for 8 hours if I get the dose wrong, which tends to happen to me.

[Advanc3d]

I take piracetam at 2.4mg x2 a day.
im guessing this is a pretty optimal dose considering "lower" doses doesnt do shit and neither do higher.
actually i dont think piracetam does anything for me other than make stimulants a few times stronger