39 replies to this topic

[OneScrewLoose]

How effective is St Jon's Wort effective in preventing the conversion of dopamine to norepinephrine? I made a post about how I might have too much ne, and I am thinking that that's more and more true. I've had a lot of issues with anxiety and paranoia, especially at night. The last few days I was taking adrafinil, which inhibits the reup of ne, and I started getting super paranoid at night, like i was having an anxiety attack. Intense exercise stopped it, which would satisfy the flight or response. About a year ago, I was occasionally obusing my old strattera for fun, which is also an NERI. Since I hadn't taken it in a while, it would give me this very intense anxious feeling. Once, the last time I used it, I was feeling terrible until I started braking boards on road signs at my university, and then I felt amazing.

Some of you might remember this thread of mine way back when. I'm starting to have a theory on that one. The steroidal effects of that rapidly boosted my dopamine, making me feel great, but eventually the day-to-day anxiety I feel burned through it all, converting it to norepinephrine, causing weeks of anxiety attacks. The only thing that would periodically stop those attacks was punching/braking shit or intense exercise. The attacks didn't stop till I was given paxil. Not sure why that worked...does the brain reup serotinin when in situations of high anxiety?

So in all those experiences, the adrafinil, the high dose of strattera, and the weeks of anxiety attacks thanks to that test booster, all felt like the same type of anxiety, just at different levels. My alternative medicine doctor suggested that a lot of my anxiety is due to major damage to my stomach, which makes a lot of sense as to why my body would be so ready to convert dopamine to NE. I'm currently doing a lot to heal it, which I've discussed in other threads. What I want to know is if taking a high dose of SJW would be beneficial to me right now. I am taking Perika and thinking of combining it with Kira, the other major extract. Since I went on Perika I've halfed my dose of Celexa to a low 20mg, and would love to go off it eventually so my hands would stop shaking (all synth SSRIs cause this for me). I'm not to worried about serotonin syndrome because I've been on much more SSRIs before and I am currently on 300mg of Seroquel, which is a 5HT1 and 5HT2 antagonist.

I know a lot of this evidence for trying to surpress NE seems anecdotal, but it really makes a lot of sense through the lenses of my experiences. Is there anything else outside of SJW that inhibits NE?

Check out this thread for my current regimen and more info.

[OneScrewLoose]

No comments? Opinions?

[OneScrewLoose]

I have more evidence for this. Taking propanolol at night seems to help my sleep. Beta receptors are NE receptors.

I'm realizing more and more that my insomnia is caused by this intense fear and/or paranoia I get at night. The worst part about it is that I don't feel afraid of anything in particular, the fear has no object. I'm just scared...

[shaggy]

I have more evidence for this. Taking propanolol at night seems to help my sleep. Beta receptors are NE receptors.

I'm realizing more and more that my insomnia is caused by this intense fear and/or paranoia I get at night. The worst part about it is that I don't feel afraid of anything in particular, the fear has no object. I'm just scared...

I find it odd that propranalol helps you sleep...one of its side effects is insomnia!

[OneScrewLoose]

I have more evidence for this. Taking propanolol at night seems to help my sleep. Beta receptors are NE receptors.

I'm realizing more and more that my insomnia is caused by this intense fear and/or paranoia I get at night. The worst part about it is that I don't feel afraid of anything in particular, the fear has no object. I'm just scared...

I find it odd that propranalol helps you sleep...one of its side effects is insomnia!

It kills some of the night time fear I get.

[luv2increase]

I think you are overmedicating yourself, and need to quit your cocktails which your doctors do not know about. This is irresponsible and dangerous behavior.


And btw, it is norepinephrine. This right here shows that you don't know how all these drugs work which you are currently indulging in. I'd just call it quits. I am seriously thinking that your thinking is being altered which is ultimately preventing you from realizing just how dangerous you are being. I warned you in your previous thread about this, yet you obviously didn't take my nor anyone else's advice.


good luck

[OneScrewLoose]

I think you are overmedicating yourself, and need to quit your cocktails which your doctors do not know about. This is irresponsible and dangerous behavior.


And btw, it is norepinephrine. This right here shows that you don't know how all these drugs work which you are currently indulging in. I'd just call it quits. I am seriously thinking that your thinking is being altered which is ultimately preventing you from realizing just how dangerous you are being. I warned you in your previous thread about this, yet you obviously didn't take my nor anyone else's advice.


good luck

I have never seen someone so arrogant, condescending, insulting, and useless as you on these forums. You tell people what to do, you call them lazy and insult them for not matching your definition of ADD, you make stupid assumptions (my doctors are aware of everything I am doing), and most of all, you contribute nothing to these forums. I'm am going to kindly ask you to never post in one of my threads again.

[luv2increase]

I think you are overmedicating yourself, and need to quit your cocktails which your doctors do not know about. This is irresponsible and dangerous behavior.


And btw, it is norepinephrine. This right here shows that you don't know how all these drugs work which you are currently indulging in. I'd just call it quits. I am seriously thinking that your thinking is being altered which is ultimately preventing you from realizing just how dangerous you are being. I warned you in your previous thread about this, yet you obviously didn't take my nor anyone else's advice.


good luck

I have never seen someone so arrogant, condescending, insulting, and useless as you on these forums. You tell people what to do, you call them lazy and insult them for not matching your definition of ADD, you make stupid assumptions (my doctors are aware of everything I am doing), and most of all, you contribute nothing to these forums. I'm am going to kindly ask you to never post in one of my threads again.

I am trying to give you constructive advice. Do you only what to hear people post things that confirm that you are correct and doing the right thing? Are you always like this towards any advice that is opposite to what you are or want to do?

Realize that I am not your enemy nor one to give bad advice. I care for human life, and when I see someone such as yourself doing what you are doing, it sets off a red flag. You are among many people self-diagnosing and self-medicating albeit dangerously in this world. I understand that you don't mean to do harm to yourself, therefore, I give advice that will help you not do harm to yourself too.


Relax. Live. Learn. Enjoy Life

[OneScrewLoose]

I think you are overmedicating yourself, and need to quit your cocktails which your doctors do not know about. This is irresponsible and dangerous behavior.


And btw, it is norepinephrine. This right here shows that you don't know how all these drugs work which you are currently indulging in. I'd just call it quits. I am seriously thinking that your thinking is being altered which is ultimately preventing you from realizing just how dangerous you are being. I warned you in your previous thread about this, yet you obviously didn't take my nor anyone else's advice.


good luck

I have never seen someone so arrogant, condescending, insulting, and useless as you on these forums. You tell people what to do, you call them lazy and insult them for not matching your definition of ADD, you make stupid assumptions (my doctors are aware of everything I am doing), and most of all, you contribute nothing to these forums. I'm am going to kindly ask you to never post in one of my threads again.

I am trying to give you constructive advice. Do you only what to hear people post things that confirm that you are correct and doing the right thing? Are you always like this towards any advice that is opposite to what you are or want to do?

Realize that I am not your enemy nor one to give bad advice. I care for human life, and when I see someone such as yourself doing what you are doing, it sets off a red flag. You are among many people self-diagnosing and self-medicating albeit dangerously in this world. I understand that you don't mean to do harm to yourself, therefore, I give advice that will help you not do harm to yourself too.


Relax. Live. Learn. Enjoy Life

"I am seriously thinking that your thinking is being altered which is ultimately preventing you from realizing just how dangerous you are being."

This is constructive criticism? Telling me to "call it quits" is constructive criticism? I haven't liked you since I saw you insult that poor guy who was trying to figure out of he had ADD. You have no idea just how arrogant you are. It's a shame too, because you any knowledge you have is going to be quickly disregarded by anyone you try to help. Stay out of my threads.

[luv2increase]

I think you are overmedicating yourself, and need to quit your cocktails which your doctors do not know about. This is irresponsible and dangerous behavior.


And btw, it is norepinephrine. This right here shows that you don't know how all these drugs work which you are currently indulging in. I'd just call it quits. I am seriously thinking that your thinking is being altered which is ultimately preventing you from realizing just how dangerous you are being. I warned you in your previous thread about this, yet you obviously didn't take my nor anyone else's advice.


good luck

I have never seen someone so arrogant, condescending, insulting, and useless as you on these forums. You tell people what to do, you call them lazy and insult them for not matching your definition of ADD, you make stupid assumptions (my doctors are aware of everything I am doing), and most of all, you contribute nothing to these forums. I'm am going to kindly ask you to never post in one of my threads again.

I am trying to give you constructive advice. Do you only what to hear people post things that confirm that you are correct and doing the right thing? Are you always like this towards any advice that is opposite to what you are or want to do?

Realize that I am not your enemy nor one to give bad advice. I care for human life, and when I see someone such as yourself doing what you are doing, it sets off a red flag. You are among many people self-diagnosing and self-medicating albeit dangerously in this world. I understand that you don't mean to do harm to yourself, therefore, I give advice that will help you not do harm to yourself too.


Relax. Live. Learn. Enjoy Life

"I am seriously thinking that your thinking is being altered which is ultimately preventing you from realizing just how dangerous you are being."

This is constructive criticism? Telling me to "call it quits" is constructive criticism? I haven't liked you since I saw you insult that poor guy who was trying to figure out of he had ADD. You have no idea just how arrogant you are. It's a shame too, because you any knowledge you have is going to be quickly disregarded by anyone you try to help. Stay out of my threads.

Do you not think that someone taking the things which you are taking can and would "cloud your judgment"? Do you not think someone doing things as dangerously as you are should most definitely "call it quits"? Does you doctor know about all this?

I suggest you go talk to your doctor for any other advice that you may have. We do not give medical advice on these boards especially when it deals with prescription drugs like SSRIs and SNRIs or anti-depressants in general. This forum is mainly for "supplements" that are good for your body. I highly doubt that prescription drugs like Celexa or whatever it is that you are on are conducive to an extended lifespan.

Go see your doctor. If you don't like what he has to say, find another doctor.

[OneScrewLoose]

I think you are overmedicating yourself, and need to quit your cocktails which your doctors do not know about. This is irresponsible and dangerous behavior.


And btw, it is norepinephrine. This right here shows that you don't know how all these drugs work which you are currently indulging in. I'd just call it quits. I am seriously thinking that your thinking is being altered which is ultimately preventing you from realizing just how dangerous you are being. I warned you in your previous thread about this, yet you obviously didn't take my nor anyone else's advice.


good luck

I have never seen someone so arrogant, condescending, insulting, and useless as you on these forums. You tell people what to do, you call them lazy and insult them for not matching your definition of ADD, you make stupid assumptions (my doctors are aware of everything I am doing), and most of all, you contribute nothing to these forums. I'm am going to kindly ask you to never post in one of my threads again.

I am trying to give you constructive advice. Do you only what to hear people post things that confirm that you are correct and doing the right thing? Are you always like this towards any advice that is opposite to what you are or want to do?

Realize that I am not your enemy nor one to give bad advice. I care for human life, and when I see someone such as yourself doing what you are doing, it sets off a red flag. You are among many people self-diagnosing and self-medicating albeit dangerously in this world. I understand that you don't mean to do harm to yourself, therefore, I give advice that will help you not do harm to yourself too.


Relax. Live. Learn. Enjoy Life

"I am seriously thinking that your thinking is being altered which is ultimately preventing you from realizing just how dangerous you are being."

This is constructive criticism? Telling me to "call it quits" is constructive criticism? I haven't liked you since I saw you insult that poor guy who was trying to figure out of he had ADD. You have no idea just how arrogant you are. It's a shame too, because you any knowledge you have is going to be quickly disregarded by anyone you try to help. Stay out of my threads.

Do you not think that someone taking the things which you are taking can and would "cloud your judgment"? Do you not think someone doing things as dangerously as you are should most definitely "call it quits"? Does you doctor know about all this?

I suggest you go talk to your doctor for any other advice that you may have. We do not give medical advice on these boards especially when it deals with prescription drugs like SSRIs and SNRIs or anti-depressants in general. This forum is mainly for "supplements" that are good for your body. I highly doubt that prescription drugs like Celexa or whatever it is that you are on are conducive to an extended lifespan.

Go see your doctor. If you don't like what he has to say, find another doctor.

I already told you my doctor is aware of everything I am doing. And SJW is a supplement. I take a fraction of the stuff some of the people take on these boards. Now unless you have some responses to my original questions, beyond "call it quits," please stop.

[meatwad]

Wow, you guys need to lay off each other.

The OP is incredibly quick to anger - which he admits to - (lol @ the only thing that would relax you is breaking boards on road signs) and immediately rages when you tell him he needs to lay off the medication.

If you want a medical professional to take a look at your meds go ahead and post them.

[OneScrewLoose]

Wow, you guys need to lay off each other.

The OP is incredibly quick to anger - which he admits to - (lol @ the only thing that would relax you is breaking boards on road signs) and immediately rages when you tell him he needs to lay off the medication.

If you want a medical professional to take a look at your meds go ahead and post them.

I don't see how my response was unjustified when the basis for his recommendation was a spelling error (I see it, and I was probably tired). My meds are posted here. I am aware of the dangers of the high serotonergic combination I am taking, but, as depressing as it sounds, I don't care. I lived every day of 10 years of my life in absolute agony (because of the previously undiagnosed celiac disease) and I just want to feel good enough right now where I can get through school. I almost got kicked out a year and a half ago. My long term solution comes from the meditation I've been doing for 2 years now and the tai-chi I take, slowly willing my mind and shaping the attitude I want in life, but this is my short-term solution. My anger comes from unhelpful advice like "call it quits." I am fully willing to listern to recommendaitons and advice, but what luv2increase was giving was neither.

Edited by OneScrewLoose, 18 November 2008 - 07:53 AM.

[Ben]

I couldn't allow this reply of yours meatwad just to sit.

If you have been paying even a modicum of attention to what happens in this forum, meatwad, you would realise that luv2increase is a troll who uses this site as a way of working out what ever personal issues he has.

In the future if you see a heated exchange which luv2increase is party to then you can be almost certain that he has created it for his own amusement, or for whatever reason he does these things.

Wow, you guys need to lay off each other.

The OP is incredibly quick to anger - which he admits to - (lol @ the only thing that would relax you is breaking boards on road signs) and immediately rages when you tell him he needs to lay off the medication.

If you want a medical professional to take a look at your meds go ahead and post them.

[luv2increase]

I couldn't allow this reply of yours meatwad just to sit.

If you have been paying even a modicum of attention to what happens in this forum, meatwad, you would realise that luv2increase is a troll who uses this site as a way of working out what ever personal issues he has.

In the future if you see a heated exchange which luv2increase is party to then you can be almost certain that he has created it for his own amusement, or for whatever reason he does these things.

Wow, you guys need to lay off each other.

The OP is incredibly quick to anger - which he admits to - (lol @ the only thing that would relax you is breaking boards on road signs) and immediately rages when you tell him he needs to lay off the medication.

If you want a medical professional to take a look at your meds go ahead and post them.

BenAus, why the personal attacks? Are we not adults here?

Why not base your opinion off what I've said in this thread. Do you not like the advice of telling him to see a doctor? Is that what you consider a "troll" would say? What personal gain do you see from me telling this guy not to take a potentially lethal cocktail of substances which each raise serotonin levels via different pathways???? What is so "trollish" about trying to keep someone from hurting themselves? What is so "trollish" about caring for human life? What is so "trollish" about seeing somebody do something potentially dangerous and trying to help them out?

I think you have some serious problems is you believe the aforementioned are the definition of a troll. Maybe you do not care about people and the harmful things they could ignorantly do to their body, but I do!!!

If you would know anything about me and my posts, you'd see that 99.9999% of them are trying to help people out. I've received a lot of PMs from people saying they love my advice that I give. I believe in spreading the knowledge, and that is one of the reasons why I spend so much time on this board.

[OneScrewLoose]

I couldn't allow this reply of yours meatwad just to sit.

If you have been paying even a modicum of attention to what happens in this forum, meatwad, you would realise that luv2increase is a troll who uses this site as a way of working out what ever personal issues he has.

In the future if you see a heated exchange which luv2increase is party to then you can be almost certain that he has created it for his own amusement, or for whatever reason he does these things.

Wow, you guys need to lay off each other.

The OP is incredibly quick to anger - which he admits to - (lol @ the only thing that would relax you is breaking boards on road signs) and immediately rages when you tell him he needs to lay off the medication.

If you want a medical professional to take a look at your meds go ahead and post them.

BenAus, why the personal attacks? Are we not adults here?

Why not base your opinion off what I've said in this thread. Do you not like the advice of telling him to see a doctor? Is that what you consider a "troll" would say? What personal gain do you see from me telling this guy not to take a potentially lethal cocktail of substances which each raise serotonin levels via different pathways???? What is so "trollish" about trying to keep someone from hurting themselves? What is so "trollish" about caring for human life? What is so "trollish" about seeing somebody do something potentially dangerous and trying to help them out?

I think you have some serious problems is you believe the aforementioned are the definition of a troll. Maybe you do not care about people and the harmful things they could ignorantly do to their body, but I do!!!

If you would know anything about me and my posts, you'd see that 99.9999% of them are trying to help people out. I've received a lot of PMs from people saying they love my advice that I give. I believe in spreading the knowledge, and that is one of the reasons why I spend so much time on this board.

Calling people lazy because they don't match your definition of ADD is trollish. Telling people useless things like call it quits is trollish. Not reading that I have said my doctor is well aware of what I am doing is trollish. Giving specific advice about specific dosages and drugs is helpful, of which you have done none of in this thread.

[luv2increase]

I couldn't allow this reply of yours meatwad just to sit.

If you have been paying even a modicum of attention to what happens in this forum, meatwad, you would realise that luv2increase is a troll who uses this site as a way of working out what ever personal issues he has.

In the future if you see a heated exchange which luv2increase is party to then you can be almost certain that he has created it for his own amusement, or for whatever reason he does these things.

Wow, you guys need to lay off each other.

The OP is incredibly quick to anger - which he admits to - (lol @ the only thing that would relax you is breaking boards on road signs) and immediately rages when you tell him he needs to lay off the medication.

If you want a medical professional to take a look at your meds go ahead and post them.

BenAus, why the persrealizeonal attacks? Are we not adults here?

Why not base your opinion off what I've said in this thread. Do you not like the advice of telling him to see a doctor? Is that what you consider a "troll" would say? What personal gain do you see from me telling this guy not to take a potentially lethal cocktail of substances which each raise serotonin levels via different pathways???? What is so "trollish" about trying to keep someone from hurting themselves? What is so "trollish" about caring for human life? What is so "trollish" about seeing somebody do something potentially dangerous and trying to help them out?

I think you have some serious problems is you believe the aforementioned are the definition of a troll. Maybe you do not care about people and the harmful things they could ignorantly do to their body, but I do!!!

If you would know anything about me and my posts, you'd see that 99.9999% of them are trying to help people out. I've received a lot of PMs from people saying they love my advice that I give. I believe in spreading the knowledge, and that is one of the reasons why I spend so much time on this board.

Calling people lazy because they don't match your definition of ADD is trollish. Telling people useless things like call it quits is trollish. Not reading that I have said my doctor is well aware of what I am doing is trollish. Giving specific advice about specific dosages and drugs is helpful, of which you have done none of in this thread.

I don't see anyone else bothering to answer your question because they remember you from the one thread you posted where people told you it was a bad idea, yet you insisted on doing it anyways. That is all I have to say. I tried to help, but some people just don't want to hear answers that they simply do not care to hear, unfortunately.

[OneScrewLoose]

I couldn't allow this reply of yours meatwad just to sit.

If you have been paying even a modicum of attention to what happens in this forum, meatwad, you would realise that luv2increase is a troll who uses this site as a way of working out what ever personal issues he has.

In the future if you see a heated exchange which luv2increase is party to then you can be almost certain that he has created it for his own amusement, or for whatever reason he does these things.

Wow, you guys need to lay off each other.

The OP is incredibly quick to anger - which he admits to - (lol @ the only thing that would relax you is breaking boards on road signs) and immediately rages when you tell him he needs to lay off the medication.

If you want a medical professional to take a look at your meds go ahead and post them.

BenAus, why the persrealizeonal attacks? Are we not adults here?

Why not base your opinion off what I've said in this thread. Do you not like the advice of telling him to see a doctor? Is that what you consider a "troll" would say? What personal gain do you see from me telling this guy not to take a potentially lethal cocktail of substances which each raise serotonin levels via different pathways???? What is so "trollish" about trying to keep someone from hurting themselves? What is so "trollish" about caring for human life? What is so "trollish" about seeing somebody do something potentially dangerous and trying to help them out?

I think you have some serious problems is you believe the aforementioned are the definition of a troll. Maybe you do not care about people and the harmful things they could ignorantly do to their body, but I do!!!

If you would know anything about me and my posts, you'd see that 99.9999% of them are trying to help people out. I've received a lot of PMs from people saying they love my advice that I give. I believe in spreading the knowledge, and that is one of the reasons why I spend so much time on this board.

Calling people lazy because they don't match your definition of ADD is trollish. Telling people useless things like call it quits is trollish. Not reading that I have said my doctor is well aware of what I am doing is trollish. Giving specific advice about specific dosages and drugs is helpful, of which you have done none of in this thread.

I don't see anyone else bothering to answer your question because they remember you from the one thread you posted where people told you it was a bad idea, yet you insisted on doing it anyways. That is all I have to say. I tried to help, but some people just don't want to hear answers that they simply do not care to hear, unfortunately.

That's a pretty desperate response right there to justify your trolling. However, I am being helped in my regimen thread. So, once again, you are wrong.

The thread is here and if anyone has any responses to my questions I'd appreciate the input.

Edited by OneScrewLoose, 19 November 2008 - 04:44 AM.

[Wedrifid]

One Screw, I would not recommend adding in a high dose of SJW to reduce dopamine to norepinephrine conversion. This is not SJW's primary action and the mechanism of SJW is known to be far from pure. It would be no more than wishful thinking to hope that the exact desired action you mention would come from adding SJW to your already overloaded concoction. The risk far outweighs the potential reward. As tempting as it may be, more poorly targetted medicines are not your answer.

You may consider getting an apointment at (for example) the Amen clinics, who specialise in brain scans and creating targetted treatment programs for specific brain activation patterns. Most likely they have experience dealing with your hypothesised norepinephrine imbalance.

[OneScrewLoose]

One Screw, I would not recommend adding in a high dose of SJW to reduce dopamine to norepinephrine conversion. This is not SJW's primary action and the mechanism of SJW is known to be far from pure. It would be no more than wishful thinking to hope that the exact desired action you mention would come from adding SJW to your already overloaded concoction. The risk far outweighs the potential reward. As tempting as it may be, more poorly targetted medicines are not your answer.

You may consider getting an apointment at (for example) the Amen clinics, who specialise in brain scans and creating targetted treatment programs for specific brain activation patterns. Most likely they have experience dealing with your hypothesised norepinephrine imbalance.

How much do these clinics cost? I'm a poor college student. :(

I am currently taking 1200mg of SWJ, and will avoid upping it until, at least, I see how I fair as my digestive track heals. Plus, I don't want to have to put on sunscreen on me all day. Right now I am working getting off of Celexa (see my regimen thread), because I hate the side effects. I'm hoping this will also make this concoction less risky.

Edited by OneScrewLoose, 19 November 2008 - 08:44 AM.

[Wedrifid]

How much do these clinics cost? I'm a poor college student. :(

Too much.

I am currently taking 1200mg of SWJ, and will avoid upping it until, at least, I see how I fair as my digestive track heals. Plus, I don't want to have to put on sunscreen on me all day. Right now I am working getting off of Celexa (see my regimen thread), because I hate the side effects. I'm hoping this will also make this concoction less risky.

Sounds like a frustrating situation. The Celexa is a far better drug for the anxiety so your side effects there are a pain. Getting rid of it will definitely make the concoction safer since it is the most potent of the seratonergic substances you have there. I hope you don't experience the same SSRI side effects from large doses of SJW instead of the low dose Celexa.

[meatwad]

I have looked at the posted link.
Post recent cmp/bmp tsh/t4 or other lab draws?
Also knowing height weight age gender would be helpful.
Sleep quality? Have a reason to be awake everyday?
Significant other? Job that pays enough / challenges you reasonably?

Without hearing the results, I am going to guess you have
more energy than you know what to do with. A job that starts at
06:00 would be in your best interest.

for others in this thread, please look for my other thread that I am about to open
regarding medication interaction.

Edited by meatwad, 19 November 2008 - 06:04 PM.

[OneScrewLoose]

I have looked at the posted link.
Post recent cmp/bmp tsh/t4 or other lab draws?
Also knowing height weight age gender would be helpful.
Sleep quality? Have a reason to be awake everyday?
Significant other? Job that pays enough / challenges you reasonably?

Without hearing the results, I am going to guess you have
more energy than you know what to do with. A job that starts at
06:00 would be in your best interest.

for others in this thread, please look for my other thread that I am about to open
regarding medication interaction.

I had my tsh, and t4 tested at normal. My cmp shows up normal, not sure what a bmp is.

I am 5'11" @ 155

I have a lot of trouble going to sleep and a lot of trouble waking up. Sleep rarely feels restful. Only time in recent memory were I slept well was when I was on that test boosting sup, and when it fixed me for 2 weeks. None of these drugs compare still...

No significant other. I am a student and work at a dining hall. 8 hours/week, and the ppl there are fun. I am often frustrated because of my ADD. I do assignments the night before because it's the only way I can concentrate, because of the pressure. I try to do it earlier but I just can't concentrate. It's an extremely draining process. I've tried adderal, ritalin, focalin, hate how they make me feel and they don't really make me concentrate much. Plus they kill my appetite which is really bad considering I am constantly stuggling to keep on my weight. Strattera is garbage. I am currently on selegline which does help but not enough. I just upped the dose to 2.5/day to see what happens.

The only thing that I feel has worked is centrophenoxine, but it really, really hurts my stomach thanks to all the problems. I am hoping to take it again when all that stuff heals.

The lower dose of celexa was too stressful so I went back up to 20 and ditched the SJW and 5-htp. I'm sticking to the SAM-E cause I like the morning boost. My doctor is having me try nortryptaline for sleep and anxiety. I know it's an SNRI, but we'll see what happens...at least we get to test my NE theory for sure.

[meatwad]

I have looked at the posted link.
Post recent cmp/bmp tsh/t4 or other lab draws?
Also knowing height weight age gender would be helpful.
Sleep quality? Have a reason to be awake everyday?
Significant other? Job that pays enough / challenges you reasonably?

Without hearing the results, I am going to guess you have
more energy than you know what to do with. A job that starts at
06:00 would be in your best interest.

for others in this thread, please look for my other thread that I am about to open
regarding medication interaction.

I had my tsh, and t4 tested at normal. My cmp shows up normal, not sure what a bmp is.

I am 5'11" @ 155

I have a lot of trouble going to sleep and a lot of trouble waking up. Sleep rarely feels restful. Only time in recent memory were I slept well was when I was on that test boosting sup, and when it fixed me for 2 weeks. None of these drugs compare still...

No significant other. I am a student and work at a dining hall. 8 hours/week, and the ppl there are fun. I am often frustrated because of my ADD. I do assignments the night before because it's the only way I can concentrate, because of the pressure. I try to do it earlier but I just can't concentrate. It's an extremely draining process. I've tried adderal, ritalin, focalin, hate how they make me feel and they don't really make me concentrate much. Plus they kill my appetite which is really bad considering I am constantly stuggling to keep on my weight. Strattera is garbage. I am currently on selegline which does help but not enough. I just upped the dose to 2.5/day to see what happens.

The only thing that I feel has worked is centrophenoxine, but it really, really hurts my stomach thanks to all the problems. I am hoping to take it again when all that stuff heals.

The lower dose of celexa was too stressful so I went back up to 20 and ditched the SJW and 5-htp. I'm sticking to the SAM-E cause I like the morning boost. My doctor is having me try nortryptaline for sleep and anxiety. I know it's an SNRI, but we'll see what happens...at least we get to test my NE theory for sure.

Eight hours / week or 8 hours/day? What time does it start?
d/c selegiline and other psychotropics. Rationale: stating poor sleep secondary to stimulant use.
On the subject of sleep - 1) blackout curtain everything. zero light from computers, not even a clock timer light in your room. If you can see the morning sun from your window it is not done correctly. If you can see any light at all from the moment you close your eyes to the moment you decide to leave your room then this is not correct sleep. Think "coffin" - rationale: melatonin synthesis is inhibited with even a pinpoint of light on the back of your skin.

You also are trying to understand deep complex neurological/biochemical responses with Braverman's sell a book scheme. DA, NE, GABA, A-choline does not take into count the numerous other hormones that affect mood. Testosterone, Cortisol, Vitamin D, etc have systemwide affects.

You sound like you are sleep deprived and stressed out. I can tell you that doctor's 90% of the time are just trying to get out the door with the least amount of work as possible. The more time they spend with you the higher chance of a law suit. You certainly are not someone of great importance (ie senator/rich person/president) so they are looking to get in and get out, hopefully many times in a single year.

d/c selegiline, d/c any "stimulant" except caffeine, consider dropping money on high quality anti cortisol supplements (new chapter holy basil extract, new chapter stress take care and new chapter neurozymes - buy them from gnc, try 1 pill of each bottle at the same time. (Afterwords, return the stuf for a full refund. GNC return policy is 100% - even if you use the entire bottle. Or you can pay a "deposit" for the bottles - buy them off the internet for 1/4th the price then return it to GNC... Nothing is sleazy when your brain/body is dieing and you can't afford rent.) Doing this would definitely be cheaper than visiting your doctor even one time.

[OneScrewLoose]

I have looked at the posted link.
Post recent cmp/bmp tsh/t4 or other lab draws?
Also knowing height weight age gender would be helpful.
Sleep quality? Have a reason to be awake everyday?
Significant other? Job that pays enough / challenges you reasonably?

Without hearing the results, I am going to guess you have
more energy than you know what to do with. A job that starts at
06:00 would be in your best interest.

for others in this thread, please look for my other thread that I am about to open
regarding medication interaction.

I had my tsh, and t4 tested at normal. My cmp shows up normal, not sure what a bmp is.

I am 5'11" @ 155

I have a lot of trouble going to sleep and a lot of trouble waking up. Sleep rarely feels restful. Only time in recent memory were I slept well was when I was on that test boosting sup, and when it fixed me for 2 weeks. None of these drugs compare still...

No significant other. I am a student and work at a dining hall. 8 hours/week, and the ppl there are fun. I am often frustrated because of my ADD. I do assignments the night before because it's the only way I can concentrate, because of the pressure. I try to do it earlier but I just can't concentrate. It's an extremely draining process. I've tried adderal, ritalin, focalin, hate how they make me feel and they don't really make me concentrate much. Plus they kill my appetite which is really bad considering I am constantly stuggling to keep on my weight. Strattera is garbage. I am currently on selegline which does help but not enough. I just upped the dose to 2.5/day to see what happens.

The only thing that I feel has worked is centrophenoxine, but it really, really hurts my stomach thanks to all the problems. I am hoping to take it again when all that stuff heals.

The lower dose of celexa was too stressful so I went back up to 20 and ditched the SJW and 5-htp. I'm sticking to the SAM-E cause I like the morning boost. My doctor is having me try nortryptaline for sleep and anxiety. I know it's an SNRI, but we'll see what happens...at least we get to test my NE theory for sure.

Eight hours / week or 8 hours/day? What time does it start?
d/c selegiline and other psychotropics. Rationale: stating poor sleep secondary to stimulant use.
On the subject of sleep - 1) blackout curtain everything. zero light from computers, not even a clock timer light in your room. If you can see the morning sun from your window it is not done correctly. If you can see any light at all from the moment you close your eyes to the moment you decide to leave your room then this is not correct sleep. Think "coffin" - rationale: melatonin synthesis is inhibited with even a pinpoint of light on the back of your skin.

You also are trying to understand deep complex neurological/biochemical responses with Braverman's sell a book scheme. DA, NE, GABA, A-choline does not take into count the numerous other hormones that affect mood. Testosterone, Cortisol, Vitamin D, etc have systemwide affects.

You sound like you are sleep deprived and stressed out. I can tell you that doctor's 90% of the time are just trying to get out the door with the least amount of work as possible. The more time they spend with you the higher chance of a law suit. You certainly are not someone of great importance (ie senator/rich person/president) so they are looking to get in and get out, hopefully many times in a single year.

d/c selegiline, d/c any "stimulant" except caffeine, consider dropping money on high quality anti cortisol supplements (new chapter holy basil extract, new chapter stress take care and new chapter neurozymes - buy them from gnc, try 1 pill of each bottle at the same time. (Afterwords, return the stuf for a full refund. GNC return policy is 100% - even if you use the entire bottle. Or you can pay a "deposit" for the bottles - buy them off the internet for 1/4th the price then return it to GNC... Nothing is sleazy when your brain/body is dieing and you can't afford rent.) Doing this would definitely be cheaper than visiting your doctor even one time.

The thing is light helps me sleep. I've figured out that a lot of my insomnia comes from this irrational paranoia, a feeling of a "presence." There's a little lot that comes in my window at night, and the ambiance of it makes me feel very comfortable. Is this still bad?

I am generally sleep deprived and stressed out, you're right on that. Hate getting up in the morning.

Three days ago my doctor gave me Rozerem to try. Hated it. Groggy all day. But the last two nights I've had a lot less trouble getting to sleep for some reason...even though I've been really stressed this week...not sure why. Haven't taken the picamilon nor rozerem nor 5-htp. Maybe it'll keep getting better as my stomach is getting better. My appetite's been the most consistent it has ever been since I was 7 years old.

Also, I just bought some kava for my sleep in case I need it. I took it years ago when I was much more of a mess (before knowing I had celiac) and it was one of the few supps I could say really made a difference. But like I said, I haven't needed it yet so i haven't tried it. I got the NOW brand, any comments on NOW's kava?

I'll post my newest regimen later, but I got work now. Thanks for the help so far.

[luv2increase]

You are taking so many psychotropics that it would be impossible to determine what you are attempting to determine ---> the NE thing. You also have to realize that certain supps and pharmaceuticals take at least a month or more to give their true effect. These are the SAM-e, celexa, SJW, and the others. Your brain is probably literally crying out for help. Someone or something, tell this crazy guy to quit putting whoopins on me. I can't take it anymore. This is evident by all the trouble you are currently having; all the side-effects you are having; all the problems with your life and sleep that you are having.


Why not just talk to your doctor to start a program of cessation. You need to give your brain a rest, seriously. When you take a step back and look at it from the sidelines, you'll see that you are taking MAO-Is, SNRIs, SSRIs, anti-anxiety drugs, drugs with shouldn't be combined, drugs whose interactions haven't even been studied, and those drugs which are obviously not to be used in combination.


You have engraved into your consciousness that you need to take something to be normal and survive from day to day.
You need to undo this and just start again from the basics like diet, exercise and sleep. Good luck.

Edited by luv2increase, 23 November 2008 - 12:43 AM.

[OneScrewLoose]

You make so many assumptions in your post that it's not worth responding to. I am respectfully asking you to please leave my thread.

For those who have been helpful, this is my updated regimen. I've taken some things out to lessen the variables because of the recent changes:

Morning
Trader Joes Fish Oil (450mg EPA & 225mg DPA)
Glucosamine and Chondortin w/ MSM
Ginkgold Ginkgo Baloba 60mg
Zyrtec 10mg
Selegiline 2.5mg
Celexa 10mg
SAM-E 400mg

Afternoon
Trader Joes Fish Oil (450mg EPA & 225mg DPA)
Glucosamine and Chondortin w/ MSM
Ginkgold Ginkgo Baloba 60mg
NOW Vitamin D-3 1000 IU

Evening (couple hours before bed)
Trader Joes Fish Oil (450mg EPA & 225mg DPA)
Glucosamine and Chondortin w/ MSM
Protonix 20mg
Seroquel 300mg

Bedtime
Trader Joes Fish Oil (450mg EPA & 225mg DPA)
Celexa 10mg
Bluebonnet Chelated Magnesium 250mg

I am noticing significant increases in concentration with the increase in selegiline. I'm gonna try this for now and even up it in a couple weeks if my doc is ok with that. She's aware of my current increase to 2.5mg.

This doesn't include my stomach stack which is spread throughout the day as:
NAG
Zinc-Carnosine
DLG
D-Limonene
BioGenesis ParaBiotic Plus
Culturelle
NOW Gr8-Dophilus
L-Salivarius
L-Glutamine

I start the beginning of my day, on an empty stomach, with l-glutamine and a culturelle pill & DLG chews, have my weight gain/maintain shake, and then have my morning bunch listed above with, Zinc-Carnosine, Gr8-D, & para biotic plus. From what I understand, the only possibly psychoactive items out of my stomach stack are the zinc-carnosine and L-Glutamine. From what I've researched these shouldn't interfere with the other stuff I am taking. Did I jump to conclusions?

Edited by OneScrewLoose, 23 November 2008 - 09:29 AM.

[luv2increase]

You are taking two medicines for Acid Reflux?


You are taking Seroquel? Are you bi-polar too? So, you are bi-polar, unmotivated, and depressed, and you are taking selegiline, seroquel, celexa, fish oil, AND SAM-e? WoW!!! Overkill much???


Also, 3 different probiotic formulas? I think that you think that more is better. Hmmm....


Good luck bro. I hope you are not in an insane asylum anytime soon from all these wreckless indulgences.


I know you didn't tell your doctor what all you are taking. No doctor in their right mind would give the thumbs up to a program like that. I am going to tell you again. Find a good psychiatrist and a good doctor, and have them work in collaboration to get you better. It wouldn't hurt to throw in a naturopathic doctor (ND) in that mix also. You are coming to the wrong place with all what you are asking.

[bran319]

He's asked you four times now to leave his thread and yet you keep coming back. How rude!

Clearly, you have offered your advice and opinion already, yet you keep repeating it even though he has politely refused it and asked you to leave.

Are you really that unaware of yourself?

You took Tramadol with Deprenyl and a host of other substances. You are no one to talk about polypharmacy and whether it is dangerous.

Really, I feel genuinely sorry for you if you truly lack the self-awareness that seems so evident in your posts!

[OneScrewLoose]

I hope you realize you are embarrassing yourself with your continued posting. Please stop.

For those sincerely interested in my progress, I am doing much, much better after the latest changes. I am sure some of it is related to my stomach healing. The increase of the selegeline has done great for my concentration. I feel like I have something to build on instead of the desire to tweak and tweak until I feel better. Not only that, but based on all your comments, what I am doing now appears much safer.

What I still want to know though, is if I am taking my probiotics in an efficient manner. To recap, I take a culturelle, l-salivarius once a day and NOW Gr8_Dophilus twice.

Thanks.