6 replies to this topic

[learning]

I'm new so please bear with me questions.

In searching for my next multi-V, I came across AOR's Orthocore and MultiBasic3 as highly recommended here. I read and compared their ingredient list line by line and found that multiBasic3(3 caps) is almost identical to Orthocore(6 caps) in vitamines. Orthocore has some extras like phytonutrient complex, CoQ10, NAC etc.

I'm wondering if it is ok to combine the two in the following regime:
1 multibasic3 at morning
1 multibasic3 at lunch
2 orthocore at bedtime

The end result will be the same intake amount of multi-V as 3cap multibasic3 or 6cap orthocore but 1/3 of extra nutrients in orthocore that are not in multibasic3.

The reason why I'm thinking of doing this is to 1) take fewer number of pills 2) full multi-V coverage with a little extras from Orthocore 3) slightly cheaper this way than taking 6 caps of orthocore

My question is whether this would cause imbalance? I don't know if there is any ratio need to be maintained between multi-Vs and phytonutrients, CoQ10 complex etc.

I sent the question to AOR tech support but couldn't get a response. I hope the veterans here can give me some guidance with this.

Thanks a lot!

BTW, after taking this multi-V complex, do you recommend taking calcium, omg-3 and resverastrol (or others?) seperately? for how much? (I'm 35 y.o. female 135lbs) This will end up with lots of pills everyday!

Tiffany

[nowayout]

I'm wondering if it is ok to combine the two in the following regime:
1 multibasic3 at morning
1 multibasic3 at lunch
2 orthocore at bedtime

You can save yourself a lot of money (and probably do your health a favor) by taking less than that. Use the Cron-o-meter to estimate your intake of vitamins and minerals from diet for a couple of typical days. If you pay the least attention to your diet, you will probably already be getting 100% or more of your daily requirement for most of them. Then just take the appropriate fraction of the Multi-basics daily dose to make up any remaining deficiencies. For most people with a good diet, I doubt that more than one capsule a day (i.e., one third dose) is needed (if that).

You should be aware that Ortho-Core contains some extra stuff that some here consider risky. You are probably unlikely to have bad side effects from the small quantities you take, but who knows? I myself would be a little afraid of using NAC, R-ALA, or Co-Q10 on a regular basis.

My question is whether this would cause imbalance? I don't know if there is any ratio need to be maintained between multi-Vs and phytonutrients, CoQ10 complex etc.

Welcome to the club. Nobody has the foggiest.

Edited by andre, 05 April 2009 - 10:37 PM.

[nancyd]

I'm wondering if it is ok to combine the two in the following regime:
1 multibasic3 at morning
1 multibasic3 at lunch
2 orthocore at bedtime

You can save yourself a lot of money (and probably do your health a favor) by taking less than that. Use the Cron-o-meter to estimate your intake of vitamins and minerals from diet for a couple of typical days. If you pay the least attention to your diet, you will probably already be getting 100% or more of your daily requirement for most of them. Then just take the appropriate fraction of the Multi-basics daily dose to make up any remaining deficiencies. For most people with a good diet, I doubt that more than one capsule a day (i.e., one third dose) is needed (if that).

You should be aware that Ortho-Core contains some extra stuff that some here consider risky. You are probably unlikely to have bad side effects from the small quantities you take, but who knows? I myself would be a little afraid of using NAC, R-ALA, or Co-Q10 on a regular basis.

My question is whether this would cause imbalance? I don't know if there is any ratio need to be maintained between multi-Vs and phytonutrients, CoQ10 complex etc.

Welcome to the club. Nobody has the foggiest.

What are the risks of R-ALA and Co-Q10? I especially thought Co-Q10 was completely safe. I've been taking it on and off for years.

[nowayout]

What are the risks of R-ALA and Co-Q10? I especially thought Co-Q10 was completely safe. I've been taking it on and off for years.

The risks are unknown but animal experiments have shown reason for caution in both cases. For R-ALA, there have been several discussions that you can search for on these forums - the relevant study was one in which ALA in early life blocked the life-extending benefits of later CR in rats long after ALA supplementation was stopped. In other words, ALA is doing something unknown, not understood, and apparently irreversible and not always beneficial to genome expression and/or plasticity. For Co-Q10, there was an animal study (rats or mice) in which Co-Q10 supplementation shortened their lives compared to controls, and the Co-Q10 animals were found to have "crud" accumulated in their hearts. I don't have the reference but the study was brought up by Michael. I also remember a study in humans where Co-Q10 decreased endurance compared to controls.

Edited by andre, 06 April 2009 - 11:38 AM.

[Steve_86]

For R-ALA, there have been several discussions that you can search for on these forums - the relevant study was one in which ALA in early life blocked the life-extending benefits of later CR in rats long after ALA supplementation was stopped. In other words, ALA is doing something unknown, not understood, and apparently irreversible and not always beneficial to genome expression and/or plasticity.

From memory the dose given to the rats was massive, no human would ever be taking anywhere near that much.

[nowayout]

For R-ALA, there have been several discussions that you can search for on these forums - the relevant study was one in which ALA in early life blocked the life-extending benefits of later CR in rats long after ALA supplementation was stopped. In other words, ALA is doing something unknown, not understood, and apparently irreversible and not always beneficial to genome expression and/or plasticity.

From memory the dose given to the rats was massive, no human would ever be taking anywhere near that much.

No, not when metabolically adjusted. It was within the range of what many people take. But the point is that the dose-response curve is unknown. For example, if it is linear, it would mean that ALA has some unknown possibly irreversible effect on genome plasticity at any dose. But this discussion has been had several times before on these forums, so to avoid repetition you can do a search.

Paraphrasing a very wise poster on these forums: "We should heed the warning until it's proven false [], not ignore the warning until it's proven true by adverse effects."

Edited by andre, 06 April 2009 - 02:39 PM.

[nameless]

I can't comment about the R-ALA studies, as I don't take it and never researched it.

As for CoQ10... the studies are a bit weird. Some studies, such as that rodent study and I believe a yeast one, showed a decrease in lifespan. Yet in some studies CoQ10 improved the health of rodents (especially old rodents) or increased their lifespan (those with mitochondrial issues).

But unless your CoQ10 is low or you have a health issue that could benefit from it (mitochondrial, heart, possibly Parkison's), I'm not sure if supplementing is worth it.

And as for the original question, 1-2 MultiBasics/daily probably would be fine for most. I personally don't think the extras in OrthoCore are really worth it, but as with most supplements (and medications too), it's a risk/reward sort of thing.