• Log in with Facebook Log in with Twitter Log In with Google      Sign In    
  • Create Account
  LongeCity
              Advocacy & Research for Unlimited Lifespans

Photo
- - - - -

Green Tea causing depression?


  • Please log in to reply
37 replies to this topic

#1 Max

  • Guest
  • 3 posts
  • 0

Posted 09 May 2009 - 05:38 AM


Green tea, and in fact all Camellia teas, causes me to become depressed within an hour or less after drinking it. The effect lasts for a few hours.

I do not suffer from depression ordinarily.

As I am a voracious coffee drinker, and never have this reaction to coffee, I doubt it is the caffeine in tea that causes the depression.

Chocolate makes me feel jumpy and restless, but does NOT make me feel depressed.

Now I know chocolate has theobromine, which is also a component of tea, but since chocolate does not make me depressed, presumably we can rule out theobromine as the cause of depression when I drink tea.

Because green tea is consistently touted as a veritable miracle food, I have, over the years, tried if off and on, including extracts and supplements, hoping to benefit from its supposed long-term benefits. But at a certain point I realized that whenever I drank the stuff or took an extract, I got depressed.

Does anyone else have this reaction? Am I the one member of the human race for whom green tea is a *not* beneficial?

Hank

#2 dumbbellina

  • Guest
  • 20 posts
  • 0
  • Location:silicon valley CA

Posted 09 May 2009 - 07:20 AM

Green tea depresses me in the sense that I get more relaxed, even sleepy, after having a strong brew or supplement. The effect was more pronounced when I first began drinking green tea. After experiencing the sleepiness, I began drinking it before bed to help get me into the sleep mood (hard for me to do, but the tea did seem to help).

Some take theanine (it's in green tea) before bed for relaxation.

Ive been going through a lot of thyroid and adrenal threads recently, and see that many avoid all types of tea because it has flouride.

Strong black tea makes me jittery, definitely not in a caffeinated coffee way; it's something different, the causes of which are unknown to me. But I try to make the effect useful to me, by drinking black tea before I go to the gym - it enervates me to the point where I feel like I might go postal on anyone unlucky enough to tap on my shoulder... Not a healthy response... :)

sponsored ad

  • Advert
Advertisements help to support the work of this non-profit organisation. To go ad-free join as a Member.

#3 bgwithadd

  • Guest
  • 820 posts
  • 16

Posted 16 May 2009 - 11:12 PM

You could get depressed from the theanine, though rare. You could also get depressed from the ecgc due to increased norepinephrine. Usually this has opposite effect but it can make you more ocdlike which can lead to difficulty breaking out of negative thought cycles.

#4 JennyPenny

  • Guest
  • 1 posts
  • 0

Posted 27 August 2009 - 02:35 PM

Hank,

I found your post because I drank a mug of green tea yesterday and almost immediately I felt extremely depressed and spaced out and couldn't stop crying. I do suffer from depression, but have been feeling much better for weeks and this reaction was so strange and abnormal, and so unlike the way I had been feeling just hours earlier, I knew it was the green tea. It felt as if I had been drugged.

I looked it up on the internet, but as you say, all I could find was stories about how wonderful and beneficial green tea is. However, I think that anything which alters the levels of certain chemicals in our bodies, is bound to effect some people negatively. So I definitely won't be drinking it again.

Just wanted to let you know that you're not the only one!!

#5 Thorsten3

  • Guest
  • 1,123 posts
  • 3
  • Location:Bristol UK
  • NO

Posted 27 August 2009 - 05:17 PM

I think that anything which alters the levels of certain chemicals in our bodies, is bound to effect some people negatively

A true statement but you could say that about anything you consume as a being. This alone doesn't make green tea evil and maybe you guys are just a minority who react badly with it. Have any of you tried white tea? It would be interesting to find out if you would react the same to white tea at that same level. I personaly have drunk 3/4 cups of white tea minimum on a daily basis for the past 2yrs. 90% of white tea is too bland and uninteresting so I suppose a lot of it is actually choosing the right brand too. The tea I drink lifts my spirits, improves my focus and feels good to my body. I've noticed that I get quite ratty if I don't have my tea so I think that possibly there may be some kind of phycological dependance there especially with my chosen brand which I love. The tea itself has a very low caffeine level (most white tea does) and nothing else is added. Weird huh, being addicted to white tea? Still it has to be a good thing with people going on about the endless health benefits.

#6 VespeneGas

  • Guest
  • 600 posts
  • 34
  • Location:Oregon, atm

Posted 27 August 2009 - 05:34 PM

I think that anything which alters the levels of certain chemicals in our bodies, is bound to effect some people negatively

A true statement but you could say that about anything you consume as a being. This alone doesn't make green tea evil and maybe you guys are just a minority who react badly with it. Have any of you tried white tea? It would be interesting to find out if you would react the same to white tea at that same level. I personaly have drunk 3/4 cups of white tea minimum on a daily basis for the past 2yrs. 90% of white tea is too bland and uninteresting so I suppose a lot of it is actually choosing the right brand too. The tea I drink lifts my spirits, improves my focus and feels good to my body. I've noticed that I get quite ratty if I don't have my tea so I think that possibly there may be some kind of phycological dependance there especially with my chosen brand which I love. The tea itself has a very low caffeine level (most white tea does) and nothing else is added. Weird huh, being addicted to white tea? Still it has to be a good thing with people going on about the endless health benefits.


White tea, like green tea, has caffeine, theanine, and flavonoids (albeit a somewhat different profile), each of which directly or indirectly affect neurotransmitters (specifically, serotonin, dopamine, norepinephrine, and GABA, the receptors of which are all subject to downregulation to one degree or another) both in plasma and in the brain. I struggle to think of any substance which does this which, when withdrawn, doesn't produce temporary unpleasant effects - unless of course the effects of the substance were negative in the first place e.g. naltrexone.

#7 okok

  • Guest
  • 340 posts
  • 239

Posted 27 August 2009 - 10:35 PM

Hank,

I found your post because I drank a mug of green tea yesterday and almost immediately I felt extremely depressed and spaced out and couldn't stop crying. I do suffer from depression, but have been feeling much better for weeks and this reaction was so strange and abnormal, and so unlike the way I had been feeling just hours earlier, I knew it was the green tea. It felt as if I had been drugged.

I looked it up on the internet, but as you say, all I could find was stories about how wonderful and beneficial green tea is. However, I think that anything which alters the levels of certain chemicals in our bodies, is bound to effect some people negatively. So I definitely won't be drinking it again.

Just wanted to let you know that you're not the only one!!


from another post:

I would imagine that the neuroprotective action of EGCG on dopaminergic neurons would probably be absolutely dependant on the fact that it does NOT cross the blood brain barrier.

EGCG is a COMT inhibitor and an irreversible peripheral armomatic l-amino acid decarboxylase inhibitor. both essentially have the same effect in that they inhibit the peripheral metabolism of l-dopa and l-tryptophan into dopamine and serotonin (respectively) until it hits the brain. if EGCG were able to cross the blood brain barrier then i imagine it would probably leave you pretty depressed.

essentially, it has the same effect as drugs like Carbidop and Entacapone, but at the same time. This effect, plus L-Theanine's dopaminergic effects would probably act in a synergistic manner, much in the same way that the drug Sinemet works.

here:
http://www.cababstra...cNo=20053092663
http://cat.inist.fr/...cpsidt=14737203
http://grande.nal.us...p;therow=137300
http://www.biology-o...discussion.html


so yeah... it would probably be necessary for EGCG to not be able to cross the BBB in order for it to have any sort of theraputic effect on mental health.

Edited by okok, 27 August 2009 - 10:36 PM.


#8 youandme

  • Guest
  • 255 posts
  • 2

Posted 28 August 2009 - 02:54 AM

Green Tea does seem to have a dulling effect on me..in quick time.


Something is crossing the BBB to have such an effect.?


White Tea seems less of a problem for me..and I still drink it without problem.
A relaxing effect from White Tea is different from Black Tea which seems to affect me more in a jittery way.

#9 russianBEAR

  • Guest
  • 432 posts
  • 22

Posted 28 August 2009 - 01:39 PM

I have a friend who used to make amazing amounts of money at some ultra-posh restaurant being what he called a "tea-master".

He then set up his own little place with a "traditional" setting for a tea ceremony. 

What I figured out is that, if brewed properly, there are various kinds of teas and they all produce very profound and different effects.

If you drink coffee frequently, however, the depression may just be because your brain is expecting something different in your cup right about then :-D

If coffee wasn't a factor in all this, then I'd just suggest to try some different kind of teas. The really good ones can be quite expensive, so my friend imports from China for dirt cheap :p

#10 FunkOdyssey

  • Guest
  • 3,443 posts
  • 166
  • Location:Manchester, CT USA

Posted 28 August 2009 - 04:32 PM

Green Tea does seem to have a dulling effect on me..in quick time.


Something is crossing the BBB to have such an effect.?


White Tea seems less of a problem for me..and I still drink it without problem.
A relaxing effect from White Tea is different from Black Tea which seems to affect me more in a jittery way.


That is probably because white tea has the highest theanine/caffeine ratio as far as I know, with green tea in the middle and black tea on the other end.

#11 youandme

  • Guest
  • 255 posts
  • 2

Posted 29 August 2009 - 05:58 AM

Thanks Funk

I avoid the Green Tea now..and I dont miss it..White Tea has a better flavour IMHO
My tipple of choice so far..not tried any loose leaf white teas yet...might try and see if they have the same effect on me.

I have a Coffee once a day at most..usually first thing..then onto the White Tea..perhaps 2 max 3 in a day.

russianBEAR
What you say makes some sense.

Green Tea does seem to have a dulling effect on me..in quick time.


Something is crossing the BBB to have such an effect.?


White Tea seems less of a problem for me..and I still drink it without problem.
A relaxing effect from White Tea is different from Black Tea which seems to affect me more in a jittery way.


That is probably because white tea has the highest theanine/caffeine ratio as far as I know, with green tea in the middle and black tea on the other end.



#12 Jacovis

  • Guest
  • 247 posts
  • 1

Posted 30 August 2009 - 06:43 AM

This is out of left field, but Green Tea is an Iron chelator. Iron deficiency is associated with Restless Legs Syndrome, dopamigenic abnormalities, fatigue and depression. While Iron deficiency in healthy adult males is relatively uncommon, could even the bit of iron chelation from drinking one or two cups of Green Tea cause an individual's iron levels to be on the decline? The below study showed that "Decreased ability to concentrate may be an early indicator that an individual's iron levels are declining." If you have low Iron levels to begin with, the problem should be worse of course.

So what could be happening is that you might get a quick initial Dopamine and Norepinephrine boost from the Green Tea (namely from its Caffeine, Theanine and EGCG). Then after say a short time, when the boost is gone, what is left is 'Iron levels on the decline'.

*Of course, it is generally a good thing for long-term health (including brain health) to have relatively low Iron/Ferritin levels (though NOT bordering on Iron deficiency).

http://www.ars.usda....1/brain1001.htm
"...Iron Decline Shortens Attention Span
In a 20-week study with eight healthy men, aged 27 to 47 years, Kretsch looked at the relationship between iron and the volunteers' ability to concentrate. "We saw that a low score for volunteers' attention span corresponded with a subsequent decline in iron levels in the body."
In an earlier study with 14 obese but otherwise healthy female volunteers, aged 25 to 42 years, Kretsch and colleagues had documented a similar change in ability to focus. The 21-week experiment showed that volunteers with borderline anemia, as measured by blood hemoglobin, were less able to concentrate than volunteers with higher hemoglobin. However, because blood hemoglobin can be influenced by nutrients other than iron, Kretsch measured other indicators of iron status, as well. Those tests also showed that iron status declined for those volunteers with the lower ability to concentrate.

Her studies are the first—in healthy adults—to link a decrease in iron with a decline in attention span. Kretsch says the findings suggest that decreased ability to concentrate may be an early indicator that an individual's iron levels are declining.
"Somewhat the same trend has been observed in studies elsewhere with children. It's been found, for instance, that children with iron deficiency anemia have a short attention span," Kretsch says."
We plan followup studies, with healthy adults, to investigate whether iron supplementation can reverse this cognitive impairment. We would also like to learn more about the mechanisms at work here."
Kretsch plans to recruit premenopausal women as volunteers for these next studies. That's because iron deficiency and iron-deficiency anemia are still relatively common in the United States among women of that age group, as well as among adolescent females.
Kretsch and co-workers measured volunteers' ability to concentrate by giving them a 6-minute-long standardized test. "We presented a continuous, fast-moving stream of single-digit numbers on a computer screen," she says. "We asked the volunteers to quickly press the space bar on the computer keyboard whenever they saw either three even or three odd numbers in a row. That may sound easy, but it's actually a demanding task that requires paying attention."..."

Edited by Visionary7903, 30 August 2009 - 06:46 AM.


#13 splitastone

  • Guest
  • 18 posts
  • 5

Posted 29 October 2009 - 06:10 PM

Green tea contains a chemical called EGCG (epigallocatechins). One of the functions of EGCG is to inactivate an enzyme called DHFR (dihydrofolate reducatase). DHFR's function is to absorb folate (folic acid). Reduced folic acid levels have been linked to depression.

Folic acid can fuel cancer growth. This is probably one of the reasons (the other is inhibition of iron absorption) why Green Tea has been shown to protect against cancer.

RE: Green Tea and Iron

Green Tea inhibits the absorption of iron, it is not an iron chelator. Curcumin is an iron chelator. Reducing iron stores and intake is one of the major keys to longevity. Iron is implicated in every major disease of aging. The Medical community appears to be blind regarding the toxicity of iron and what safe levels of iron are. The current acceptable levels of iron are dangerously high.

This is a great book if you can find it:

http://books.google....W...;q=&f=false

#14 yoyo

  • Guest
  • 582 posts
  • 21

Posted 29 October 2009 - 10:57 PM

egcg can cross the bbb.

#15 Clarity

  • Guest
  • 135 posts
  • 13
  • Location:Long Island, NY

Posted 31 October 2009 - 02:15 AM

Green tea can also lower your blood sugar. If you're borderline hypoglycemic, it could be the straw that broke the camels back. I know when I've gone low in the past, I became a blubbery mess.
  • like x 1

#16 Jacovis

  • Guest
  • 247 posts
  • 1

Posted 31 October 2009 - 03:45 PM

Green tea contains a chemical called EGCG (epigallocatechins). One of the functions of EGCG is to inactivate an enzyme called DHFR (dihydrofolate reducatase). DHFR's function is to absorb folate (folic acid). Reduced folic acid levels have been linked to depression.

Folic acid can fuel cancer growth. This is probably one of the reasons (the other is inhibition of iron absorption) why Green Tea has been shown to protect against cancer.

RE: Green Tea and Iron

Green Tea inhibits the absorption of iron, it is not an iron chelator. Curcumin is an iron chelator. Reducing iron stores and intake is one of the major keys to longevity. Iron is implicated in every major disease of aging. The Medical community appears to be blind regarding the toxicity of iron and what safe levels of iron are. The current acceptable levels of iron are dangerously high.

This is a great book if you can find it:

http://books.google....W...;q=&f=false


splitastone,
there seem to be quite a few studies saying that Green Tea's ingredients chelate iron, rather than just inhibit the absorption of Iron (see below for my pasted examples).

It may well be true that reducing 'iron stores and intake is one of the major keys to longevity'. But that doesn't mean that slight reductions in iron could not trigger a lower mood at least temporarily. Especially in conjunction with some of the other factors that people have mentioned (like your mention of green tea decreasing the ability of the body to use folate by inhibiting the DHFR enzyme and also lowering of blood sugar).

Good things for longevity does not always equal good things for mood/feelings of wellbeing, just ask some of the people who practice Caloric Restriction!

Iron is an essential mineral responsible for transporting oxygen around the body, so when it’s in a slightly lower supply, oxygen levels in the brain may fall a little. Not to mention the fact that iron is involved in neurotransmitter synthesis.

One way to test whether it's the slight Iron depletion that might be the primary cause of a particular person's lower mood feelings after drinking green tea would be as follows. Try drinking the green tea along with the following and see if you can discern a difference after trying this a number of times (recording how you feel say 45 minutes after finishing each meal/green tea):
- a meal with plenty of iron, preferably in its more absorbable heme iron form (for examples of iron rich foods, see below).
- a low iron meal, preferably with other variables being almost identical to the other meal mentioned (so for example about the same amount of protein, carbohydrates and fats, and folate as well for each meal).

www.purewellness.com.au/docs/Pure%20Iron%20Deficiency.doc
[Some foods and their iron content:]
100g steamed clams 22.0mg
100g cooked chicken liver 8.5mg
100g cooked oysters 8.5mg
100g cooked beef liver 6.3mg
100g cooked beef (roast) 3.5mg
85g cooked minced beef 2.2mg
100g cooked chicken 2.1mg
100g cooked lamb 1.8mg
100g canned tuna 1.3mg
100g cooked fish 1.0mg


2008 American Society for Nutrition J. Nutr. 138:1578S-1583S, August 2008
Supplement: Proceedings of the Fourth International Scientific Symposium on Tea and Human Health
Targeting Multiple Neurodegenerative Diseases Etiologies with Multimodal-Acting Green Tea Catechins1,2
Silvia A. Mandel, Tamar Amit, Limor Kalfon, Lydia Reznichenko and Moussa B. H. Youdim
Eve Topf Center for Neurodegenerative Diseases Research and Department of Pharmacology, Faculty of Medicine, Technion, Haifa, Israel

From the full text at
http://jn.nutrition....teid=nutrition:
"...Collectively, the accumulated data support and extend the emerging view that green tea catechins are multimodal-acting, brain-permeable natural iron chelators-antioxidants endowed with polypharmacological activities and acting at multiple brain targets to prevent or delay neuronal death in the degenerating brain..."


Effect of Green Tea on Iron Status and Oxidative Stress in Iron-Loaded Rats
Authors: Ounjaijean, S.; Thephinlap, C.; Khansuwan, U.; Phisalapong, C.; Fucharoen, S.; Porter, J. B.; Srichairatanakool, S.
Source: Medicinal Chemistry, Volume 4, Number 4, July 2008 , pp. 365-370(6)
Publisher: Bentham Science Publishers

Abstract:
Plasma non-transferrin bound iron (NTBI) is potentially toxic and contributes to the generation of reactive oxygen species (ROS), consequently leading to tissue damage and organ dysfunction. Iron chelators and antioxidants are used for treatment of thalassemia patients. Green tea (GT) contains catechins derivatives that have many biological activities. The purpose of this study was to investigate the iron-chelating and free-radical scavenging capacities of green tea extract in vivo. Rats were injected ip with ferric citrate together with orally administered GT extract (GTE) for 4 months. Blood was collected monthly for measurement of iron overload and oxidative stress indicators. Plasma iron (PI) and total ironbinding capacity (TIBC) were quantified using bathophenanthroline method. Plasma NTBI was assayed with NTA chelation/ HPLC. Plasma malonyldialdehyde (MDA) was determined by using the TBARS method. Erythrocyte oxidative stress was assessed using flow cytometry. Levels of PI, TIBC, NTBI and MDA, and erythrocyte ROS increased in the ironloaded rats. Intervention with GT extract markedly decreased the PI and TIBC concentrations. It also lowered the transferrin saturation and effectively inhibited formation of NTBI. It also decreased the levels of erythrocyte ROS in week 4, 12 and 16. Therefore, green tea extract can decrease iron in plasma as well as eliminate lipid peroxidation in plasma, and destroy formation of erythrocyte ROS in the rats challenged with iron. The bifunctional effects could be beneficial in alleviating the iron and oxidative stress toxicity. In prospective, these GTE activities should be further examined in thalassemic animals or humans.

#17 kurt9

  • Guest
  • 256 posts
  • 26

Posted 31 October 2009 - 04:57 PM

I drink green tea every day, except during the summer. It has never made me depressed. It relaxes and puts me into a more reflective state of mind.

#18 StrangeAeons

  • Guest, F@H
  • 732 posts
  • 6
  • Location:Indiana

Posted 01 November 2009 - 02:16 AM

I think the EGCG crossing the BBB is a hypothetical possibility, but in the absence of any bizarre metabolic disorders with pronounced effects (i.e. some "schizophrenics" have a "leaky" BBB) I'd call that one a zebra.

The iron issue was the first thing that came to mind for me, given my experiences with it; still I don't think it's likely the effects would be acute. Still, I appreciate the articles from Visionary on the explicit chelation effects of iron, as this was news to me. Moussa Youdim continues to impress with his research on dopamine and iron.

All of the studies I've seen regarding the detrimental neuropsychiatric effects of iron deficiency seem to use ferritin levels as the chief indicator of iron status, but who's to say that's the most relevant indicator for the neuro aspects? After parenteral iron infusion (a total of 1gm of Iron sucrose) my ferritin is good but my serum Fe/TIBC are only marginal:
Ferritin 85.0 ng/mL -> Ref 15.0-400.0
Iron 59 mCg/dL -> Ref 50-160 (on the low side)---------->
TIBC 375 mCg/dL -> Ref 250-400 (on the high side)-----> Saturation (serum Fe/TIBC) 16% Ref 15-55

I've noticed no improvement from the infusions, so it's entirely possible the serum/plasma measurements are as or more relevant in this case, making the green tea pretty detrimental.
I don't think this phenomenon is likely to occur in people with normal iron levels, which is assumed to include healthy men and non-menstruating/childbearing women in first world countries. I would recommend getting your iron levels checked out, all three labs. You may have a hard time convincing your doc NOT to take a CBC and MCV too, because clinicians are by and large hardwired to associate iron deficiency with anemia.

Edited by StrangeAeons, 01 November 2009 - 02:18 AM.


#19 Thorsten3

  • Guest
  • 1,123 posts
  • 3
  • Location:Bristol UK
  • NO

Posted 01 November 2009 - 08:22 AM

I think that anything which alters the levels of certain chemicals in our bodies, is bound to effect some people negatively

A true statement but you could say that about anything you consume as a being. This alone doesn't make green tea evil and maybe you guys are just a minority who react badly with it. Have any of you tried white tea? It would be interesting to find out if you would react the same to white tea at that same level. I personaly have drunk 3/4 cups of white tea minimum on a daily basis for the past 2yrs. 90% of white tea is too bland and uninteresting so I suppose a lot of it is actually choosing the right brand too. The tea I drink lifts my spirits, improves my focus and feels good to my body. I've noticed that I get quite ratty if I don't have my tea so I think that possibly there may be some kind of phycological dependance there especially with my chosen brand which I love. The tea itself has a very low caffeine level (most white tea does) and nothing else is added. Weird huh, being addicted to white tea? Still it has to be a good thing with people going on about the endless health benefits.


White tea, like green tea, has caffeine, theanine, and flavonoids (albeit a somewhat different profile), each of which directly or indirectly affect neurotransmitters (specifically, serotonin, dopamine, norepinephrine, and GABA, the receptors of which are all subject to downregulation to one degree or another) both in plasma and in the brain. I struggle to think of any substance which does this which, when withdrawn, doesn't produce temporary unpleasant effects - unless of course the effects of the substance were negative in the first place e.g. naltrexone.



Well it is my intention to be drinking it for the rest of my life so hopefully I won't suffer too much although this would explain why I am addicted to it. It isn't the theanine beause when I take this through supplement means I don't care for it too much. Like I say though in the grand scheme of things there are worse things to be addicted to than white tea so it isn't all bad.

#20 pycnogenol

  • Guest
  • 1,164 posts
  • 72
  • Location:In a van down by the river!

Posted 01 November 2009 - 02:40 PM

Green tea can also lower your blood sugar.


Yes it does indeed lower blood sugar. In fact, that is the primary reason why I use Green Tea*

*brand: Herb Pharm, Green Tea, Alcohol-Free

Edited by pycnogenol, 01 November 2009 - 02:44 PM.


#21 shaggy

  • Guest
  • 282 posts
  • 4

Posted 04 November 2009 - 08:03 PM

egcg can cross the bbb.


Are you sure - evidence?

#22 FunkOdyssey

  • Guest
  • 3,443 posts
  • 166
  • Location:Manchester, CT USA

Posted 04 November 2009 - 08:05 PM

I thought I read somewhere that EGCG does not cross the BBB in humans. We should definitely try to clear this up.

#23 Pike

  • Guest
  • 517 posts
  • 6

Posted 05 November 2009 - 12:01 PM

well, seeing as EGCG is both a catechol-o-methyl-transferase inhibitor AND an irreversible aromatic l-amino acid decarboxylase inhibitor, i would imagine that it would be necessary for it to NOT cross the BBB in order to exert its typical antidepressant action. if it were to cross the BBB then it would just suppress your catecholamines in general, making it an anti-psychotic and not an antidepressant, which it is typically regarded as.

#24 StrangeAeons

  • Guest, F@H
  • 732 posts
  • 6
  • Location:Indiana

Posted 06 November 2009 - 01:42 AM

The COMT inhibition would lead to an increase in catecholamines, while the other enzyme inhibition would decrease levels of dopamine and serotonin, and thereby indirectly lead to lower catecholamine levels (dopamine being kind of an important ingredient there). I can see how the effects might be pretty profound for both those enzymes to be inhibited at once.

Still, I say the iron connection is far more prominent, and also explains why this doesn't happen to everybody that drinks green tea. It's far more likely that the OP has low iron than a leaky BBB, and if their BBB is normal than I can't imagine any reason why the green tea would effect them but not most others.

#25 Pike

  • Guest
  • 517 posts
  • 6

Posted 06 November 2009 - 10:58 AM

The COMT inhibition would lead to an increase in catecholamines, while the other enzyme inhibition would decrease levels of dopamine and serotonin, and thereby indirectly lead to lower catecholamine levels (dopamine being kind of an important ingredient there). I can see how the effects might be pretty profound for both those enzymes to be inhibited at once.

Still, I say the iron connection is far more prominent, and also explains why this doesn't happen to everybody that drinks green tea. It's far more likely that the OP has low iron than a leaky BBB, and if their BBB is normal than I can't imagine any reason why the green tea would effect them but not most others.


actually aromatic-l-amino-acid decarboxylase (aka dopa-decarboxylase) inhibition would not decrease DA or 5-HT. DDC inhibitors inhibit the process by which l-dopa and 5-htp are converted into their respective neurotransmitters. They can't cross the BBB, so once the l-dopa and 5-htp make it to the CNS, they can be converted into dopamine and serotonin, respectively --> essentially, telling your l-dopa and 5-htp to wait until they hit the brain to become neurotransmitters.

DDC inhibs like carbidopa extend the half-life of l-dopa. actually, they almost double the plasma half life of them.

#26 wolfeye

  • Guest
  • 124 posts
  • 7

Posted 06 November 2009 - 04:59 PM

Just want to remind you of some benefits from green tea.

Green tea consumption and mortality due to cardiovascular disease, cancer, and all causes in Japan: the Ohsaki study.

CONTEXT: Green tea polyphenols have been extensively studied as cardiovascular disease and cancer chemopreventive agents in vitro and in animal studies. However, the effects of green tea consumption in humans remain unclear. OBJECTIVE: To investigate the associations between green tea consumption and all-cause and cause-specific mortality. DESIGN, SETTING, AND PARTICIPANTS: The Ohsaki National Health Insurance Cohort Study, a population-based, prospective cohort study initiated in 1994 among 40,530 Japanese adults aged 40 to 79 years without history of stroke, coronary heart disease, or cancer at baseline. Participants were followed up for up to 11 years (1995-2005) for all-cause mortality and for up to 7 years (1995-2001) for cause-specific mortality. MAIN OUTCOME MEASURES: Mortality due to cardiovascular disease, cancer, and all causes. RESULTS: Over 11 years of follow-up (follow-up rate, 86.1%), 4209 participants died, and over 7 years of follow-up (follow-up rate, 89.6%), 892 participants died of cardiovascular disease and 1134 participants died of cancer. Green tea consumption was inversely associated with mortality due to all causes and due to cardiovascular disease. The inverse association with all-cause mortality was stronger in women (P = .03 for interaction with sex). In men, the multivariate hazard ratios of mortality due to all causes associated with different green tea consumption frequencies were 1.00 (reference) for less than 1 cup/d, 0.93 (95% confidence interval [CI], 0.83-1.05) for 1 to 2 cups/d, 0.95 (95% CI, 0.85-1.06) for 3 to 4 cups/d, and 0.88 (95% CI, 0.79-0.98) for 5 or more cups/d, respectively (P = .03 for trend). The corresponding data for women were 1.00, 0.98 (95% CI, 0.84-1.15), 0.82 (95% CI, 0.70-0.95), and 0.77 (95% CI, 0.67-0.89), respectively (P<.001 for trend). The inverse association with cardiovascular disease mortality was stronger than that with all-cause mortality. This inverse association was also stronger in women (P = .08 for interaction with sex). In women, the multivariate hazard ratios of cardiovascular disease mortality across increasing green tea consumption categories were 1.00, 0.84 (95% CI, 0.63-1.12), 0.69 (95% CI, 0.52-0.93), and 0.69 (95% CI, 0.53-0.90), respectively (P = .004 for trend). Among the types of cardiovascular disease mortality, the strongest inverse association was observed for stroke mortality. In contrast, the hazard ratios of cancer mortality were not significantly different from 1.00 in all green tea categories compared with the lowest-consumption category. CONCLUSION: Green tea consumption is associated with reduced mortality due to all causes and due to cardiovascular disease but not with reduced mortality due to cancer.



http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/16968850

Edited by wolfeye, 06 November 2009 - 05:00 PM.


#27 navyblue

  • Guest
  • 182 posts
  • 2

Posted 27 January 2010 - 07:58 AM

Grean tea also contains l-theanine which is know to increase dopamine and gaba levels. This increase in dopamine seems to bypass (or cover-up) any negative effect that EGCG may have on l-dopa.

#28 rwac

  • Member
  • 4,764 posts
  • 61
  • Location:Dimension X

Posted 22 May 2010 - 04:39 AM

Yeah, I just noticed this same effect myself. Drinking white tea makes me a bit tired.

I wonder if this is somehow related to a leaky BBB.

On the plus side, drinking it just before I sleep allows me to jump out of bed in the morning!

Edited by rwac, 22 May 2010 - 04:40 AM.


#29 Lufega

  • Guest
  • 1,810 posts
  • 274
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 22 May 2010 - 05:04 AM

My first thought was similar to Rwac's. Maybe you have another problem that is compromising BBB integrity. Do you have any known conditions?

sponsored ad

  • Advert
Advertisements help to support the work of this non-profit organisation. To go ad-free join as a Member.

#30 Ashley Phillips

  • Guest
  • 2 posts
  • 0

Posted 14 February 2012 - 09:08 PM

I know this is an old topic but I didn't see anyone mention the fact that green tea contains catechins (and epicatechins) which belong to the monoamine oxidase family... A family of enzymes that catalyse the oxidation of monoamines, which effect the neurotransmitters in our brains. And of course, when neurotransmitters are involved, people are bound to react differently.

Edited by Ashley Phillips, 14 February 2012 - 09:10 PM.





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users