5 replies to this topic

[ultranaut]

I've got various supplements arriving soon that I will begin experimenting with.

I currently regularly take:

450mg bupropion extended release daily. I skip taking this a day or two at a time per month.

30mg to 60mg of mixed amphetamine salts (instant release generic adderall) daily. Normal dose is 30mg in the AM and another 20mg in the afternoon. Some days I skip the afternoon booster, some I take 10mg or 30mg depending on circumstances. I skip taking this a day or two at a time per week.

2mg to 20mg of deprenyl monthly, usually spaced apart by a few weeks. Last month I took approximately 6mg total in two doses. This month I've taken 1mg thus far. I don't know the consequences of excessive dopamine but due to the possible risk I do not take large doses unless I have not taken bupropion or amphetamines recently. The most I've taken at once was 10mg.

500mg to 1000mg of Acetyl-L-Carnitine Arginate daily. Most days I take at least one on an empty stomach.

I drink alcohol regularly. I get at least a little intoxicated about once per week. I tend to have one drink after work two or three times per week on average.

I smoke approximately one cigarette per week on average.


Things I've been experimenting with and still have "in stock":

Famotidine - It's an OTC histamine antagonist used as an antacid. I take 20mg once or twice a month because it improves amphetamine absorbtion.

Rhodiola - I took it regularly for about two weeks, one dose in the morning and occasionally one in the early evening. I'm not certain it had any real effect.

Bacopa - I took it regularly for about three weeks, one dose in the evening. It may of made me drowsy.

Ashwagandha - Same as above

CDP-Choline - I have some left over that I paired with piracetam. I take one on occasion but I've yet to notice any effect.

Mucuna Puriens 40% L-Dopa - I have only taken this a few times, I'm concerned it may be dangerous. The times I have taken it I have either gotten sexually arroused, sleepy, or both at the same time.

Magnesium Malate - I took this daily for about two weeks in varying doses. I was hoping its role as an NMDA antagonist would help with amphetamine tolerance. It seems to have minimal effect in that regard. I still take some occasionally, once or twice a week.

Theanine - I've taken 200mg to 600mg at once. It's hard to tell if it works or is just placebo/coincidence. I took it once nightly for about a week. Since then I take it once or twice per week.

I have this coming:

Agmatine - It's an obscure possible neurotransmitter produced from arginine that among many possible benefits blocks NMDA receptors and thus hopefully helps mitigate amphetamine tolerance. It may improve mood, memory, and sleep as well.

Huperzine A - Again, NMDA action for amphetamine tolerance. Hopefully some memory improvement. I've read that this may be dangerous to take regularly so I will probably go with 200mcg every other day.

Green tea extract - It's high in ECGC. I figured I could use a good anti-oxidant. I will likely take this daily.

Arginine alpha-ketoglutarate - I'm hoping this will help with amphetamine-induced vasoconstriction. Since I'm not a body builder I will probably take a half dose daily for a week and see what happens.

Horny goat weed - Same as above. PDE5 inhibition could be helpful as well on occasion (those first couple hours of amphetamine are brutal).

Sulbutiamine - I'm hoping it can occasionally serve as an amphetamine replacement. It sounded interesting.

Phenibut - I have trouble falling asleep, I take zolipidem occasionally but I'd like an alternative. I've read that this can be addictive and that tolerance can build quickly so I will probably take this no more than two or three times per week.



Thoughts? Advice? Insults? If I take one of everything should I have a team of medics on standby?

[mentatpsi]

I've got various supplements arriving soon that I will begin experimenting with.

I currently regularly take:

450mg bupropion extended release daily. I skip taking this a day or two at a time per month.

30mg to 60mg of mixed amphetamine salts (instant release generic adderall) daily. Normal dose is 30mg in the AM and another 20mg in the afternoon. Some days I skip the afternoon booster, some I take 10mg or 30mg depending on circumstances. I skip taking this a day or two at a time per week.

2mg to 20mg of deprenyl monthly, usually spaced apart by a few weeks. Last month I took approximately 6mg total in two doses. This month I've taken 1mg thus far. I don't know the consequences of excessive dopamine but due to the possible risk I do not take large doses unless I have not taken bupropion or amphetamines recently. The most I've taken at once was 10mg.

500mg to 1000mg of Acetyl-L-Carnitine Arginate daily. Most days I take at least one on an empty stomach.

I drink alcohol regularly. I get at least a little intoxicated about once per week. I tend to have one drink after work two or three times per week on average.

I smoke approximately one cigarette per week on average.


Things I've been experimenting with and still have "in stock":

Famotidine - It's an OTC histamine antagonist used as an antacid. I take 20mg once or twice a month because it improves amphetamine absorbtion.

Rhodiola - I took it regularly for about two weeks, one dose in the morning and occasionally one in the early evening. I'm not certain it had any real effect.

Bacopa - I took it regularly for about three weeks, one dose in the evening. It may of made me drowsy.

Ashwagandha - Same as above

CDP-Choline - I have some left over that I paired with piracetam. I take one on occasion but I've yet to notice any effect.

Mucuna Puriens 40% L-Dopa - I have only taken this a few times, I'm concerned it may be dangerous. The times I have taken it I have either gotten sexually arroused, sleepy, or both at the same time.

Magnesium Malate - I took this daily for about two weeks in varying doses. I was hoping its role as an NMDA antagonist would help with amphetamine tolerance. It seems to have minimal effect in that regard. I still take some occasionally, once or twice a week.

Theanine - I've taken 200mg to 600mg at once. It's hard to tell if it works or is just placebo/coincidence. I took it once nightly for about a week. Since then I take it once or twice per week.

I have this coming:

Agmatine - It's an obscure possible neurotransmitter produced from arginine that among many possible benefits blocks NMDA receptors and thus hopefully helps mitigate amphetamine tolerance. It may improve mood, memory, and sleep as well.

Huperzine A - Again, NMDA action for amphetamine tolerance. Hopefully some memory improvement. I've read that this may be dangerous to take regularly so I will probably go with 200mcg every other day.

Green tea extract - It's high in ECGC. I figured I could use a good anti-oxidant. I will likely take this daily.

Arginine alpha-ketoglutarate - I'm hoping this will help with amphetamine-induced vasoconstriction. Since I'm not a body builder I will probably take a half dose daily for a week and see what happens.

Horny goat weed - Same as above. PDE5 inhibition could be helpful as well on occasion (those first couple hours of amphetamine are brutal).

Sulbutiamine - I'm hoping it can occasionally serve as an amphetamine replacement. It sounded interesting.

Phenibut - I have trouble falling asleep, I take zolipidem occasionally but I'd like an alternative. I've read that this can be addictive and that tolerance can build quickly so I will probably take this no more than two or three times per week.



Thoughts? Advice? Insults? If I take one of everything should I have a team of medics on standby?

Are you seeing a psychiatrist for these medications... cause if not I'd recommend doing that instead. You're currently taking a lot of products that seem like they could have interactions with one another... primarily the buporion, deprenyl and amphetamines. I've heard of welbutrin and adderall together, but with deprenyl I'm not sure how that'll work. I know you're already doing this and are trying to space them out appropriately, but i think you need an objective eye, so talk with a doctor, or at the least be extremely careful .

[acantelopepope]

I've got various supplements arriving soon that I will begin experimenting with.

I currently regularly take:

450mg bupropion extended release daily. I skip taking this a day or two at a time per month.

30mg to 60mg of mixed amphetamine salts (instant release generic adderall) daily. Normal dose is 30mg in the AM and another 20mg in the afternoon. Some days I skip the afternoon booster, some I take 10mg or 30mg depending on circumstances. I skip taking this a day or two at a time per week.

2mg to 20mg of deprenyl monthly, usually spaced apart by a few weeks. Last month I took approximately 6mg total in two doses. This month I've taken 1mg thus far. I don't know the consequences of excessive dopamine but due to the possible risk I do not take large doses unless I have not taken bupropion or amphetamines recently. The most I've taken at once was 10mg.

500mg to 1000mg of Acetyl-L-Carnitine Arginate daily. Most days I take at least one on an empty stomach.

I drink alcohol regularly. I get at least a little intoxicated about once per week. I tend to have one drink after work two or three times per week on average.

I smoke approximately one cigarette per week on average.


Things I've been experimenting with and still have "in stock":

Famotidine - It's an OTC histamine antagonist used as an antacid. I take 20mg once or twice a month because it improves amphetamine absorbtion.

Rhodiola - I took it regularly for about two weeks, one dose in the morning and occasionally one in the early evening. I'm not certain it had any real effect.

Bacopa - I took it regularly for about three weeks, one dose in the evening. It may of made me drowsy.

Ashwagandha - Same as above

CDP-Choline - I have some left over that I paired with piracetam. I take one on occasion but I've yet to notice any effect.

Mucuna Puriens 40% L-Dopa - I have only taken this a few times, I'm concerned it may be dangerous. The times I have taken it I have either gotten sexually arroused, sleepy, or both at the same time.

Magnesium Malate - I took this daily for about two weeks in varying doses. I was hoping its role as an NMDA antagonist would help with amphetamine tolerance. It seems to have minimal effect in that regard. I still take some occasionally, once or twice a week.

Theanine - I've taken 200mg to 600mg at once. It's hard to tell if it works or is just placebo/coincidence. I took it once nightly for about a week. Since then I take it once or twice per week.

I have this coming:

Agmatine - It's an obscure possible neurotransmitter produced from arginine that among many possible benefits blocks NMDA receptors and thus hopefully helps mitigate amphetamine tolerance. It may improve mood, memory, and sleep as well.

Huperzine A - Again, NMDA action for amphetamine tolerance. Hopefully some memory improvement. I've read that this may be dangerous to take regularly so I will probably go with 200mcg every other day.

Green tea extract - It's high in ECGC. I figured I could use a good anti-oxidant. I will likely take this daily.

Arginine alpha-ketoglutarate - I'm hoping this will help with amphetamine-induced vasoconstriction. Since I'm not a body builder I will probably take a half dose daily for a week and see what happens.

Horny goat weed - Same as above. PDE5 inhibition could be helpful as well on occasion (those first couple hours of amphetamine are brutal).

Sulbutiamine - I'm hoping it can occasionally serve as an amphetamine replacement. It sounded interesting.

Phenibut - I have trouble falling asleep, I take zolipidem occasionally but I'd like an alternative. I've read that this can be addictive and that tolerance can build quickly so I will probably take this no more than two or three times per week.



Thoughts? Advice? Insults? If I take one of everything should I have a team of medics on standby?

While I admire your psychotropic acrobatic daring, there are a few things that I would point out:

-You are taking a dose of Bupropion that is near the highest amount that Psychiatrists will prescribe for risk of seizure. You are also drinking, which from many, many accounts is dangerous whilst on Bupropion (read Erowid or just google Alcohol and Bupropion and you'll see what I mean). This dosage gets unpredictably more dangerous as you add ANY amount of Deprenyl. In general, MAOI's (A or B) should not be taken with Bupropion. In addition to this, you're experimenting with L-Dopa (which you noted some caution about) and Bacopa. I could be wrong about the Bacopa, but adding more dopamine to your already high combination of variables which act upon that neurotransmitter is cause for high caution.
-Phenibut, while I loved the initial effects (see my post Phenibut lifts brain fog) starts to become detrimental VERY FAST. So 2-3 times a week seems too much to me. Just be aware of this.
-Sulbutiamine is a funny substance. It's amazing at first. Many have noticed it decreases creativity to an extent, which I would tend to agree with. But it should also be used very sparingly-- tolerance will develop. Tip: because of the receptors it antagonizes/agonizes, its effects are much more pronounced with caffeine. I.e., it is synergistic.
-If you're taking any of these drugs for depression, be very careful with Huperzine A. As an acetylcholineesterase inhibitor, it's a great way to throw off your acetylcholine/dopamine balance (see my post in the research forum).

*This statement has not been evaluated by the FDA. This post is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease.

Keep us updated, especially on those less known substances.

[ultranaut]

Are you seeing a psychiatrist for these medications... cause if not I'd recommend doing that instead. You're currently taking a lot of products that seem like they could have interactions with one another... primarily the buporion, deprenyl and amphetamines. I've heard of welbutrin and adderall together, but with deprenyl I'm not sure how that'll work. I know you're already doing this and are trying to space them out appropriately, but i think you need an objective eye, so talk with a doctor, or at the least be extremely careful .

Yes, the bupropion and amphetamines are doctors orders. I take such low and irregular doses of deprenyl I don't think I have much to worry about. Others have raised this same concern, no one has ever really articulated what the supposed danger is. I could see if I was taking 5mg deprenyl a day on top of everything else but I'm taking closer to 5mg a month.

As far as the other stuff goes, what interactions do you see?

[ultranaut]

Yesterday evening I took 200mcg of Huperzine A. Didn't really notice much of anything. Around 11pm I took an Ambien, possibly due to the Huperzine it did not knock me out within 30 minutes like it normally does. This morning I took my normal doses of bupropion and amphetamine along with 200mcg of Huperzine, it's probably placebo but it felt like the amphetamines came on smoother, instead of going from 0 to 60 in 5 minutes it was more like 15 minutes of gradual acceleration. Normally the first hour or so is a bit "tweaky" (probably due to the L-Amphetamine, it's supposedly more of a PNS than CNS stim), but that seems less pronounced today.

[ultranaut]

While I admire your psychotropic acrobatic daring, there are a few things that I would point out:

-You are taking a dose of Bupropion that is near the highest amount that Psychiatrists will prescribe for risk of seizure. You are also drinking, which from many, many accounts is dangerous whilst on Bupropion (read Erowid or just google Alcohol and Bupropion and you'll see what I mean). This dosage gets unpredictably more dangerous as you add ANY amount of Deprenyl. In general, MAOI's (A or B) should not be taken with Bupropion. In addition to this, you're experimenting with L-Dopa (which you noted some caution about) and Bacopa. I could be wrong about the Bacopa, but adding more dopamine to your already high combination of variables which act upon that neurotransmitter is cause for high caution.

I've read the studies, the risk of seizure at 450mg is tiny. As I recall bupropion used to start at 600mg instant release when it first came out. I know mixing it with alcohol increases the risk somewhat. I take it first thing when I wake up, I don't typically consume any alcohol until 12+ hours later. The amount of bupropion in my system is about as low as it gets by that point.
Re: Bacopa, Mucuna, and Deprenyl adding more dopamine - what is the risk of more dopamine? I've never found a definitive answer. I'm sure there is a point where there is too much of it, but how will I be able to tell? What are the initial symptoms I should be looking for? Considering how low my dopamine levels apparently are without enhancement I believe I am still far below a "toxic" level of dopamine.

-Phenibut, while I loved the initial effects (see my post Phenibut lifts brain fog) starts to become detrimental VERY FAST. So 2-3 times a week seems too much to me. Just be aware of this.

Yeah, 2-3 times per month instead. Or, 2-3 per week followed by a significant break. I've read enough reports of addiction with this that I'm appropriately concerned I believe.

-Sulbutiamine is a funny substance. It's amazing at first. Many have noticed it decreases creativity to an extent, which I would tend to agree with. But it should also be used very sparingly-- tolerance will develop. Tip: because of the receptors it antagonizes/agonizes, its effects are much more pronounced with caffeine. I.e., it is synergistic.

Define sparingly? Does it enhance all stims or just caffeine? Since starting on amphetamines I consume significantly less caffeine so I've lost my tolerance for it, with that in mind what do you think would be a good dose of the two to start off with?

-If you're taking any of these drugs for depression, be very careful with Huperzine A. As an acetylcholineesterase inhibitor, it's a great way to throw off your acetylcholine/dopamine balance (see my post in the research forum).

The bupropion was originally for depression caused by events in my life which I've since dealt with. I realized though that my normal state without bupropion is basically a perpetual low-level depression, I suspect my default dopamine levels are low. Also, I love smoking and was spending a fairly significant amount of money on very expensive cigarettes. $15 a pack adds up fast. As long as I take the bupropion I don't feel the need to smoke.

Keep us updated, especially on those less known substances.

Still going very well. I took 200mcg more Huperzine yesterday evening. By that point I did not really feel the amphetamine at all but within about an hour it felt like it had kicked back in somewhat. The only side effect I've noticed is that my mouth waters more than normal. It is a bit annoying, but amphetamines make my mouth dryer than normal so I guess in some ways it is a nice change.
Thus far today I have not taken anything. I feel good, but I'm back to my normal easily distracted self and thus not as productive as I could be...