70 replies to this topic

[Solarclimax]

VI, how about this one.

You guys are all dreaming hippies that need to get productive jobs and stop wasting the worlds time and resources with stupid goals like indefinite life extension.

If someone asked in that exact tone, it may not even justify a civilised response.. but we are all civilised people so anyway...

I'm sorry you feel that way, however if you where to do some research maybe you would see for yourself that life extension is not a waste of time, but in fact one of the best uses of time and resources.

You could get into excuse me don't generalise i'm not a hippy, i would probably disagree with you on even the meaning of what would be considered a productive job ect, so on. But as hard as it is sometimes (especially for me as i like to punch people in the face) You gotta ignore it and remember that they are not as fortunate as you in that they don't have the mental capacity to talk on a mature level, so please excuse their ignorance they just don't have the intellect to compute some basic things. Even the things that seem so obvious. Well that's all fine and good but how does that help in getting the message across ? All you can do is pick out the best of the worst people and focus your efforts on them. Whilst remaining your good self, and trying to keep your sanity.

PS i don't really like to punch people... which is lucky for some.

[The Immortalist]

My apologies for not seeing to this topic. I've been somewhat busy with coursework, the AI, and my research.

In response to The Immortalist's comments...

There is a time in every humans life when they are a child that they first begin to understand the concept of death, when they realise they may die they usually get upset (at least I did) and consult their parents, the parents being programed by society usually to believe there is an "afterlife" tell the child that death is not a problem their is an afterlife. The child being very impressionable psychologically by there parents and because of there young age is "indoctrinated to believe death is okay they don't have to worry and that there is a heaven to go to. Also because most humans are programmed to mindlessly follow social norms they just believe what everyone around them tells them.

You should do some reading on terror management theory as your description is succinctly explained by it. Your "hypothesis" is actually in line with part II of mine, albeit not quite as detailed. TMT suggests that people employ various psychological mechanisms (among which self-esteem and group affiliation are primary) to cope with the inevitability of their own death. Cross cultural studies have demonstrated this all across the globe. However, the pro aging trance is a curious bugger to understand. According to TMT, one would assume that if you presented someone with information about promoting their longevity, they would be supportive of this idea, as it would lead to decreased levels of the deep rooted terror accompanying knowledge of personal mortality. Curious, the pro aging trance indicates that this is not the case. What does this mean? This is the topic of my paper, which is currently in its second draft form and will be completed shortly (just waiting on a few papers from the library).

If anyone is interested in the draft, please email me and I would be happy to provide it. This is a very important topic, but I would caution you to avoid subjective research. There is a lot of information about this topic available. If you are interested, perhaps you should enroll in the AI and do it as a structured project. I would be more than happy to mentor such an undertaking, having run my own research team last semester to look into this.

Your right. I don't know what I was doing when I started this topic. I'm sorry if I caused any trouble. What was I thinking? any type of subjective research is not really worth doing.
I only wanted to generate discussion and I think I achieved that goal. Wouldn't people posting their own experiences talking to people about the subject of life extension be useful? (only if what they said was true of course).
Kelsey if you research more into this topic in the future could you somehow see to it that a guide book gets published (to teach people how to break other peoples pro-aging trance).

[brokenportal]

Theres a lot more discussion to be had here. We just want to make sure that we dont go around asserting just anything and making just anything official. Discussion, collaborating, crowdsourcing, is one of the best ways to learn about a subject. It leads you to key points to research and rehash and discuss.

I can help you develop at least part of the outline on a proposal for say, a booklet or maybe a set of wiki pages, to help inform people. Many of us have taken classes on this stuff, read a ton of books on it, watched a ton of lectures and videos on it, and listened to a ton of audio books on it. We could propose it, "peer review it" in a way, and theres a good chance we can get it to pass.

I know of some techniques that work to different degrees in different scenerios. Alot of us know where we can find examples of a lot of other techniques that work and Im sure others have examples too.

[chuckb]

I have no patience for those with small minds. I would simply say to them "Drop dead, then, if you wish it," (then take a step closer to glare them right in the eyes and strengthen voice) "but don't you damn well dare to tell me that I have to follow your stupidity. I'm not aging and dying just because you think I should."


The problem is that they have the option to NOT age or age - a free choice. Yet they would remove that same free choice from us - and force us to age (and die). It's a simple precedent - if you are born Amish and wish to leave it, legally, you cannot be held back.

The danger here is simply religion. If a religious president is in power, he will pass laws that quite literally kill us.

I am a karate teacher. I do not relent, or give in, or respect with kindness and consideration an enemy that seeks to harm you, even if they do so with best intentions on their part (they think they're saving your 'soul').
I am also a non-professional scientist. The data speaks clearly and unambiguously, and in 99% of the cases gives you the superior answer.

One can choose to be treated for cancer(example) with modern medicine or choose to pray instead. When the religious force you to prayer only, they are committing a crime.
It is exactly the same case.

[Shepard]

Forgive me if I've missed something in this conversation. What is the specific project proposed?

My project idea is to start a compilation of all known or possible ways to combat the psychological fenomenon many of us Immortalists encounter frequently called the Pro Aging Trance.

Would you like ImmInst to create a special webpage of these ideas? FAQ entry? Wiki entry?

If so, do we have a volunteer to spearhead the collection and organization of the proposals that have been given so far?

[kenny001]

if you can explain this suggestion more clearly and let us get more information for it, we will appreciate you for it, thank you.

[brokenportal]

We have a nice evolving guide going on here: http://www.imminst.o...the-uninformed/

[Shepard]

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This topic has been moved from "Action! -> Suggestions & Project Ideas -> Project Ideas" to "Action! -> Suggestions & Project Ideas -> IdeasDewar".

[solbanger]

Maybe you guys could use Kickstarter to endorse specific life extension experiments? (like for instance the soil gathering project from a few months back)I haven't seen that suggested.

If you have enough projects on the site, maybe the message would spread by mere presence? By the way I saw that the Methuselah Foundation had ads on Hulu!

Edited by solbanger, 08 March 2011 - 02:53 PM.

[brokenportal]

This project is done. Im closing it here and moving it to projects. Further refinement and development and applications of ways to use this tool are encouraged, please continue this at the compilation of ways, called,
-Guide to Getting Through to the Fence Sitters, the Skeptics, the Uninformed, and the Pro-Aging Trancists-
http://www.longecity...ed/#entry423155

Thank you to the contributors of this topic who have contributed and helped to inspire, remind and drive this project along.

Idea complete and moved into action and so this topic is closed.

[brokenportal]

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This topic has been moved from "Action! -> Suggestions & Project Ideas -> Ideas " to "Action! -> Projects & Teams".