5 replies to this topic

[UOchris1]

Hi All

Been trying to find the right system to buy. Does anyone have any recommendations for a system they are using that is moderately cost effective and has a good selection of software. Looking to train working memory, attention, and maybe artistic ability?

A little bit about myself and more about the question:

Ill be in medical school next year, the idea is to get a head start using a system on myself so that I can gain insight on how I might design a four year research project around the technology. My ultimate goal is to get people smarter. Currently been using brainworkshop (Dual-N-Back), Harry Kahn's techniques for developing multiple mentalism, and various exercises from cognitivefun.net. Id like to start generating data as my brain progesses as well as use the eeg programs in themselves to generate comparative data. I have focused my undergraduate studies in Philosophy of Consciousness, Eastern Thought, and Molecular and Cellular Biology.

Thank You for you welcoming me aboard.

Chris

[drmz]

Hi All

Been trying to find the right system to buy. Does anyone have any recommendations for a system they are using that is moderately cost effective and has a good selection of software. Looking to train working memory, attention, and maybe artistic ability?

A little bit about myself and more about the question:

Ill be in medical school next year, the idea is to get a head start using a system on myself so that I can gain insight on how I might design a four year research project around the technology. My ultimate goal is to get people smarter. Currently been using brainworkshop (Dual-N-Back), Harry Kahn's techniques for developing multiple mentalism, and various exercises from cognitivefun.net. Id like to start generating data as my brain progesses as well as use the eeg programs in themselves to generate comparative data. I have focused my undergraduate studies in Philosophy of Consciousness, Eastern Thought, and Molecular and Cellular Biology.

Thank You for you welcoming me aboard.

Chris

OpenEEG --> http://openeeg.sourceforge.net/doc/

[m86]

Well, that would depend on how you would define 'moderately cost effective'...

An OpenEEG would certainly be one of the cheaper options for hardware, but you will be limited to a max. of 6 channels (with 3 analog boards) and will have to assemble + acquire the parts (or at a bare minimum acquire and assemble everything other than the fully assembled boards - you can get them at Olimex [ http://www.olimex.co...gets/index.html ] ).

Going by http://brain-trainer.com/ prices, a 2-channel EEG + software (BioExplorer) would run you at least $1k (not including electrodes and supplies), a 4-channel EEG amp + BioExplorer at $2.7k, and a 8-channel + BioExplorer at $4k. I imagine there may be some better priced outlets out there somewhere and you can definitely find some better deals in the used equipment market.

There is also some other more cost-effective equipment out there too... but most is not currently supported by most software. Most relevant of these would be the cheap Chinese EEGs you can grab off eBay (16-channel for less than $1k, search eBay for "16 channel eeg" and http://tinyurl.com/ycszg47 is a quick mention of the device) and, probably most relevant, the recently released Emotiv EPOC ( www.emotiv.com ).

I'm a pretty big fan of the EPOC - it's quickly usable without much prep work (as opposed to.. any other EEG system out there), has 14 channels (most are frontal), and is cheaper than just about anything else (though, to be fair, raw data access would require a Dev. headset [$500] at the very least [and officially only w/ $750+ licenses], their consumer headset [$299] will only run with approved applications [of which neurofeedback software, which exposes raw data, is unlikely to be included within] ).

Software wise, you're pretty much limited to BioExplorer (which is basically the industry leader in the near non-existent biofeedback industry) or BioEra right now. Both should be able to handle a fair amount of neurofeedback protocols.. but BioExplorer is, IMO and IIRC, considerably more featureful. It also has support for external data sources w/ the 'server' object so devices not strictly compatible can be hacked into working with it.

Edited by m86, 15 January 2010 - 10:29 AM.

[kanzure]

I am looking into designing and building a (cheap) 32-channel version of the OpenEEG boards. Right now I am experiencing a perverse lack of motivation, however- what's the point? 32 channels of meditation and biofeedback? Please try to excite me and make me do this :-).

- Bryan
http://heybryan.org/
1 512 203 0507

[UOchris1]

Thank You everyone for your replies. Very informative. As of yet I'm still doing research, and have not decided on a model that both fits my budget/interests. Recently picked up "Handbook of EEG Inerpretation" and am slowly going through it as I stay on top of my other coursework. However, my intuition tells me that I should go ahead and purchase the KT88-1016 from Ebay.

Bryan, unfortunately it will be difficult for me to motivate a you at this time. Other than pointing to the literature that suggests there is promise in training with an EEG, it remains uncertain to me how much I can hope to gain by using one. Nonetheless, I have enough faith to stick out a solid training regime for at least a year to see if I can actually make myself smarter while discovering something about my technique along the way.

The first thing I want to find out is whether there is a correlation between particular brainwave states and the positive gains I am making on various cognitive tasks (especially during my unusually high scores). If I find a correlation, I will further test to see if training such a brain state alone will allow me to improve my scores on said task independent of training with the task itself. From here I will move toward seeing how far the transfer carries (have my IQ tested and record its change). I am optimistic and if my experiment is successful, then theoretically I should have developed a mind capable of continuing my research at a professional level. If I fail, I guess I just learn more about myself, which isn't too bad.

This will take some time to progress, but if anyone is interested maybe I can figure a way to get my preliminary results online in a format open for criticism.

[UOchris1]

Okay guys. I just ordered the Emotiv Epoc Research Edition headset. I will be training with Dual-N-Back from brainworkshop, exercises from mybraintrainer.com, and Harry Kahne's techniques for multiple mentalism. I will continue with Piracetam, Vinpocetine, will be adding 5mL of Cerebrolysin daily to the regimen, and am also considering Noopept. My brain will be in a peatree dish with all I can give it to grow. I can't get too focused on this project until summer rolls around, but will be my all summer project.

Ill keep you updated when this all starts.