13 replies to this topic

[mediatech]

Considering how much material is wasted though the digestive process when taking oral amino supplements would not injections be more effective and far less expensive?

I've been searching Google in vain to find out more on this topic but have turned up very little. My concerns are amino purity, amounts and what substances are bad to introduce directly into the blood stream.

Common sense tells me its a bad idea to take a capsule of LEF's ChronoForte and take it in the arm. However if we were to isolate ingredients like Carnosine, Acetyl-L-carnitine, Benfotiamine, R-alpha lipoic acid, and add them a nootropic cocktail it could produce a most desirable effect at a fraction of the amount and cost.

I found a good syringe company at least

http://www.ryvmed.com

Just found this!

Needle Free Injector System... hmmmm
http://injex.com/products/injex30.asp

Edited by mediatech, 08 July 2004 - 12:17 AM.

[mediatech]

You can count on me consulting a good doctor or 2 before starting this type of treatment. I figure I'll locate one who prescribes B12 injections, get the Injex 30 kit then go for the carnosine...

Maybe marketing physicians that endorse B12 injections in the integrative medicical market will get me places

I'm willing to be a public guinea pig.

[eternaltraveler]

Injecting would be a great idea. With that injex system or an insulin needle it's really for subcutaneous injection. Which is somewhat safer than injecting into a vein, but also you arent delivering it directly into the blood. Fat soluble substances could become trapped in the fat, be released slowly, or be broken down before they are released.

I think the greatest problem would be getting ahold of the pure substance for injection. Keep us updated on what you find out

[mediatech]

Will do. For anyone else wishing to persue this:

http://www.lef.org/d...fdoctors02.html
http://dmoz.org/Heal..._Practitioners/

...and there are plenty more

[lynx]

IV glutathione is a real possibility, it is available, though usually done as a drip. You can get pharm grade amino's, but the real question is, WHY?

[mediatech]

1) To cut costs
2) To make sure more of the substance gets into the blood stream in a measurable way.

Is there any way of measuring how much carnosine and other vitamins like benfotiamine and B12 actually make it to the blood stream when injested?

I'm assuming far less of these substances will be needed at lower cost if they are introduced closer to blood vessels via subcutaneous injections. Obviously this is a may be a really poor idea for herbs and fat soluble substances.

Ideally I'd be using pure micronized substances.... and maybe stem cells some day [thumb]

[digdug]

My god. IV Nootropic users. I think there's more to this than just a more efficient dosage mechanism. You all are getting that needle high! The thought of injecting something tickles you!

[mediatech]

The trick will be finding the right suppliers or manufacturers. I'm doing research right now to see what a minimal order might be for micronized USP carnosine. This could be injected in a saline solution like found here:

http://www.bbraunusa...n-pvc_prod.html

Here's one good candidate for aminos but they apparently don't stock carnosine :(
http://www.finechemi...e/brochures.htm

If we were to manufacture a micronized carnosine or another substance the short term costs may be a bit high but possibly much lower long term.

Here's a good directory of companies that specialize in milling processes. I suspect a small percentage will be suitable for pharmaceutical processing.

http://www.powdershow.com

It may be simpler to go though a sports nutrition compnay like http://www.ast-ss.com

Anyone have any better ideas?

[LifeMirage]

I'm not against injections of compounds that need to be injected that is sold in ampoules or using nasal sprays (vasopressin. But due to a multitude of reasons I would never recommend or advise anyone making their own injections.

This in my opinion is overkill in a literal and figurative sense.

[mediatech]

What if this is done under the guidance of doctors and the substances produced by reputable labs and aquired by these doctors whom we contract services with?

It may take an initial 5,000.00+ investment but at least we'll have similar conditions to test "some" substances under the same clinical conditions of lab rats... can't remember the last time I saw a clinical study at Entrez PubMed where a lab rat swallowed carnosine or other such substances. Carnosine... the gateway drug [lol]

I saw a good article here about the next step in life extension being in the form of injections... I'll see if I can locate it.

Edited by mediatech, 11 July 2004 - 05:38 AM.

[strongman]

Well, as far as amino's and some other supplements go, I usually take them sublingually. Most of the amino's absorb fairly rapidly under the tongue. Not as good as injecting them, but at least it bypasses the stomach acid, and the liver.

[liorrh]

what about B12 injections? are they usefull in any way much more so than regular B12 supplements?

[ajnast4r]

I'm not against injections of compounds that need to be injected that is sold in ampoules or using nasal sprays (vasopressin. But due to a multitude of reasons I would never recommend or advise anyone making their own injections.

This in my opinion is overkill in a literal and figurative sense.

im right here with him on this one... there is NO need to inject anything. ESPECIALLY if its not sold in pre-made injectable form. you would be running WAY too large a risk of infection or screwing up somehow.

a totally horrible idea imo

The needle free injection system sounds like the "hypospray" from Star Trek.

lol YES i thought the same thing [lol]