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Bacopa issues


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46 replies to this topic

#31 renfr

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 07:33 PM

Bacopa makes me extremely deep sleep dominant and suppress dopaminergic effects of sulbutiamine.
One time I ODed on sulbutiamine in the evening and could not sleep no matter how tired I was, I was thinking, thinking and then I decided to take some bacopa and it knocked me out.
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#32 xeon

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 08:29 PM

I have been experimenting with Bacopa. I have depression/anxiety issues and sleep issues.

The brand I take is Planetary Herbals. I take half a tablet (112.5 mg). Very interesting effects considering how I normally feel:

Pros:
  • Improved ability to concentrate for extended periods of time compared to normal without feeling mentally drained. Concentration is more smooth/fluid.
  • Reduced anxiety/depression from the day I started taking it
  • Stress does not drain me mentally like it normally does, which is a huge plus. Almost like I don't even get stressed.
  • I normally have a difficult time falling/staying asleep but Bacopa causes me to actually feel sleepy when I'm tired so I can fall asleep.
  • Sleep is extremely deep, like my brain is resetting. I woke up today completely confused about what time it was. Deepest sleep I've had in years. That's a big plus as well.
  • I do tend to remember everything in more detail, and it improves recall somewhat even early on (for me), but in the evening I've fallen asleep on the couch and when I woke up had no idea how I had gotten there. Weird.

Cons:
  • I feel like if I continue taking it daily it may reduce my motivation and that I may need to take something to combat it like Ginseng.
  • Pretty groggy when I wake up, but that's no big deal to me. It's far better than being extremely anxious about small things like I normally am.

It's only been a few days so far, so I will update with more info after I continue experimenting with it.

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#33 Godof Smallthings

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Posted 14 October 2013 - 02:13 AM

I finished 2 bottles of planetary herbals bacopa, 2 pills morning and evening, every day, and felt no particular effects.

Now I am taking Nature's Way Bacopa for 2 months - still no subjectively experienced cognition enhancing effects.

The only thing I get is that taking it in the evening makes me drowsy.

Once I have finished with Nature's Way I will try the Himalaya Herbals brand for 2 months too. If still no obvious effects, then at 6 months I think I've given it a fair chance, and won't use it anymore.

#34 xeon

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Posted 14 October 2013 - 09:20 AM

It seems to me that the people that it benefits the most are people who have some type of condition that Bacopa targets and repairs. Such as if you have a damaged memory (I may have a somewhat damaged memory from stress/anxiety/panic attacks, cortisol) because I noticed a marked change in memory. It may be because of the increase in Serotonin activity in certain parts of the brain such as the Hippocampus, that a depressed person may be lacking in. That's just my theory because I notice people with depression and anxiety benefit from it more than already healthy individuals.

What do you guys think?

#35 SirReal

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Posted 12 March 2014 - 11:50 PM

I use AOR bacopa and don't notice any excess fatigue during the daytime, but when I take it before bed I have noticed it disrupts my sleeping patterns. I use a sleep cycle app on my phone (dont know how great of a test this is) called Sleep as Android and have noticed the following from bacopa.

Example of an average nights sleep:
Attached File  normal.png   40.82KB   21 downloads

Example of a typical night when I took bacopa before bed:
Attached File  bacopa.png   42.57KB   20 downloads

With bacopa I am very restless for about the first ~3.5 hours
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#36 Strelok

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Posted 13 March 2014 - 05:02 AM

I use AOR bacopa and don't notice any excess fatigue during the daytime, but when I take it before bed I have noticed it disrupts my sleeping patterns. I use a sleep cycle app on my phone (dont know how great of a test this is) called Sleep as Android and have noticed the following from bacopa.

Example of an average nights sleep:
Attached File  normal.png   40.82KB   21 downloads

Example of a typical night when I took bacopa before bed:
Attached File  bacopa.png   42.57KB   20 downloads

With bacopa I am very restless for about the first ~3.5 hours


How long have you been taking Bacopa? I would be very interested to see if your sleep changes with Bacopa the longer you take it. Perhaps some adaptations/modulations need to occur, and then you'll start getting more deep sleep.

#37 SirReal

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Posted 13 March 2014 - 07:10 AM

How long have you been taking Bacopa? I would be very interested to see if your sleep changes with Bacopa the longer you take it. Perhaps some adaptations/modulations need to occur, and then you'll start getting more deep sleep.

Interesting theory, this was right when I started taking bacopa. As of right now I've been taking it just under a month. I guess every few months I'll take it at night for a few days and see if my sleep is effected.

#38 Godof Smallthings

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Posted 13 March 2014 - 10:43 AM

Interesting. If anything, bacopa appears to have a sedating effect on me, and I have never felt like I had a bad night's sleep after taking it.

What brand of bacopa have you been taking?

#39 SirReal

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Posted 13 March 2014 - 10:16 PM

Interesting. If anything, bacopa appears to have a sedating effect on me, and I have never felt like I had a bad night's sleep after taking it.

What brand of bacopa have you been taking?


I use AOR brand bacopa, which interestingly most people have found to be even more sedating than other brands, but I do not feel this. Because of this I might be an odd case study, but I will test my sleeping with bacopa again in a few weeks anyways. When I took it at night I didn't notice any major subjective change in how tired I was the next day.

#40 Godof Smallthings

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Posted 14 March 2014 - 03:36 AM

Ok. The brands I have tried are Planetary Herbals and Nature's Way. I have a bottle of Himalaya Herbs brand bacopa standing by for my next bacopa test run.

Edited by Godof Smallthings, 14 March 2014 - 03:36 AM.


#41 SirReal

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Posted 12 April 2014 - 01:54 AM

Alright so I've been taking bacopa for about two months, and I tried bacopa before bed three more times. In my sleep graphs I noticed the same pattern of being very restless for the first few hours of my sleep, then returning to a "baseline" sleeping pattern. I would encourage anyone that takes bacopa to asses their sleeping and see if they notice a similar effect.


Edited by SirReal, 12 April 2014 - 01:55 AM.


#42 xeon

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 07:33 PM

Alright so I've been taking bacopa for about two months, and I tried bacopa before bed three more times. In my sleep graphs I noticed the same pattern of being very restless for the first few hours of my sleep, then returning to a "baseline" sleeping pattern. I would encourage anyone that takes bacopa to asses their sleeping and see if they notice a similar effect.

 

Did you feel any different the next day? More or less rested?



#43 ActuariallySpeaking

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 08:26 PM

I don't know if this has been resolved yet for the OP, or anyone else having issues on this thread, but Bacopa Monnieri is fairly well-documented in terms of it being very potent and potentially harsh on the digestive tract. Here is an excerpt from a very helpful website (examine.com): "Its side effects are part conditional and part unavoidable; the conditional ones are secondary to it being a potent anxiolytic andAdaptogen, in that people who are already relaxed may be unmotivated to do additional work (eliminating the eustress)... Bacopa is not the easiest on digestion, and if a dose is taken on an empty stomach those with less apt digestive tracts may feel nausea, cramping/bloating, and diarrhea. Beyond those two adverse effects, none other have been reported so far...Bacopa has historically been consumed with ghee (animal fat), as aside from the supposed health properties of ghee itself bacopa is fat soluble and requires a lipid transporter to be best absorbed. Due to this, supplemental bacopa should be taken with meals."

 

I hope that helps a bit.



#44 V_Sal

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Posted 17 August 2015 - 05:08 PM

I tried Bacopa for a couple of months. It made me tired but I continued to take it since the reported memory enhancing effects are only prominent after ~12 weeks. It was a total disaster. I was extremely tired, somewhat depressed and totally unmotivated. I have no idea if my memory was better or worse during this period since I had no motivation to do anything even remotely intellectually challenging. My motivation was bad enough to begin with but Bacopa made it non-existent. Bacopa made me feel tired about everything and I slept half of the days away on it. I got very noticeably better when I stopped taking Bacopa. I even tried taking it again later despite the fact that I should have learned by my previous mistake, with exactly the same results: extreme fatigue and apathy. Bacopa; where motivation goes to die.

I have a tendency to get side effects though, but lethargy and lack of motivation to do anything are warning signs to look out for if you're taking Bacopa. If experienced I suggest you take a break for a couple of days to see if you improve, remember that the positive effects Bacopa has are long-term and unlikely to suffer that much from a break. Watch out for Bacopa fatigue, it kind of sneeks up on you since you get gradually more tired.

Hi aLurker,

I coud not post the lnk here, but I read in a forum someone saying he had problems (including sleepines) with all Bacopa except from Solaray.

He was havig problems finding it, but someone else said it is available at iherb.

I am going to try this;



#45 gamesguru

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Posted 18 August 2015 - 12:55 AM

I notice rice helps:

rqztl3.jpg

 

I also notice smaller doses are less disruptive of sleep, and so are doses taken more than 5-6hrs before bedtime.  The worst time to take it is 90 minutes before bed, this leaves you groggy upon waking and increases sleep latency (for me it does not induce waking or affect total sleep duration).

I have only been taking it 3-4 days a week, and most often 125 or 250mg, so I can't say if one can develop tolerance to bacopa's tendency to demotivation and insomnia, or if it will remain as a side effect.

One would have to endure some unpleasantness to pass this point, taking at least 300mg every day, diarrhea or not.

 

Not sure of the cause, potentially D2 antagonism [1]:

5vt7vb.jpg

It would have to overpower the anti-insomnia effects of serotonin [4 g or 5 g of L-tryptophane significantly increased sleep timenot a good thing?, reduced sleep latency, and reduced the number of awakenings].

 

Bacopa extract displays strong serotonin receptor activity

Bacopa extract displaces antagonist [3H] Ketanserin from serotonin receptor 5HT2A isolated from rats, and exhibited even stronger effects in its displacement of agonist 8-OH-DPAT from the 5HT1A receptor. The study also concluded that this Bacopa extract decreases cAMP production in cells with 5HT1a receptors, suggesting it causes an agonistic effect. This effect was similar to results from a previous study where Bacopa displayed antidepressant effects comparable to imipramine.

Edited by gamesguru, 18 August 2015 - 01:14 AM.

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#46 Sleepdealer

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Posted 24 August 2015 - 09:00 PM

I might as well share my experiences with bacopa since im using it at the moment.

 

I'm using Bacopa Gold, 500 mg capsules with 55% bacosides, so its pretty strong dosage. Initially I got extremely dull and felt nausea, but the nausea disappeared after I started taking it with or after meals. Now I only take it before I go to bed. Sometimes 20-30 minutes before bedtime, but always shortly after a small evening meal. I don't notice the dullness much during evenings, but if I try and take it during the day I become dull for an hour or two. I also get a little more emotional, slightly sadness prone, when directly under the influence. But only when I take it during daytime. I also notice an overall, but minor increase in memory recall. I also get quite horny on it.  :wub:  But also only when taking it during daytime. Appearently, according to Wikipedia, some serotonin receptors affect sex drive, which I can attest for in my case.

 

So my recommendation is also to take it with meals. Try to look over your dosages, try less if necessary. You might already be "sufficient" in the specific serotonin levels if you feel dull the whole day or even after sleep, that's my guess, so if lower dosages don't cut it, you might need to try another substance for memory.



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#47 Pirateer

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Posted 11 March 2018 - 07:06 AM

Huh wow. I didn't put it together until now, but I've been taking Bacognise for some time and struggled with tiredness during the day. After reading this thread I tried taking higher dose at night in an extended release cap, then normal cap and still had tiredness all next day. Then on top of that weird out of place worsening of depression towards late afternoon/evening of that following day. Cut it out completely now and haven't been tired and evening worsening of depression is gone - ie back to baseline. So pretty happy with that!

P.S. - just for the record I take anti-depressants also.


Edited by Pirateer, 11 March 2018 - 07:10 AM.

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