3 replies to this topic

[ChromodynamicGirl]

Just blogged this over at my...blog.
Wiccans, neo-animists, nature-worshippers, polytheists and so forth are just as philosophically and empirically ridiculous as Christianity is.While Christianity, and to a lesser extent Islam, bear the brunt of anti-theism and naturalism, there is another group of crackpot magic-worshipers who are not as prominent but, in some ways, even more annoying.

Christianity is so superdominant and assumed among many people in the West that it plays very little role in most people’s lives; they’re too saturated and typically unchallenged to ever give it much thought. It also actually is an ancient religion, or set of religions, which does have still existing institutions which can be more or less directly traced from around 300AD, give or take a century.

Paganism, however, has none of these ameliorating traits. Paganism is not believed by practically anybody, and outright declared mythology by most people who have ever given it any thought. Therefor Pagans are strident and flamboyant; it isn’t enough that they believe crazy nonsense, they also have to dress up like some Hippy-Goth and tell you about the soul of nature.

Paganism isn’t even real Paganism. Aside from the Greco-Roman pantheons and some of their temples, we know practically nothing about ancient polytheistic and animistic religions of the West. There are some statues, some disconnected accounts (largely by opponents) and some simple rituals, the significance of which is lost, that we are aware of. Thus ‘Paganism’ is really just what it seems, New Age mysticism deriving largely from the 19th century with a bunch of arbitrary names and symbols, which have long lost their true meaning, super imposed on it. Good evidence for this is the fact that the various ‘pagans’ demonstrate the same sort of hand-wavy, nature-oriented mysticism that the non-pagan hippies and new agers they descend from do.

An amusing point is that they claim to have some vastly divergent morality from the cruel Christian religion, in fact they’re just regurgitating left-wing liberal tropes that actually come from liberal Christianity and Protestantism in general.

Edited by ChromodynamicGirl, 10 November 2010 - 12:06 PM.

[Kolos]

An amusing point is that they claim to have some vastly divergent morality from the cruel Christian religion, in fact they’re just regurgitating left-wing liberal tropes that actually come from liberal Christianity and Protestantism in general.

Perhaps in the US it's true but here in Europe many Neo-pagans are also Neo-Nazists(there are some more liberal groups too) I could name quite a few far right groups and bands(some of which I really like to listen) that declare loyalty to pagan Gods and tribal values so I would be rather cautious with such generalizations.

[nowayout]

Christianity is so superdominant and assumed among many people in the West that it plays very little role in most people's lives; ...

Not in the U.S. In the U.S., Christianity plays a very active deleterious role in the political landscape. The Chritianists in the U.S. would be little different from the Taliban if they got their way. They are all about imposing their petty and ignorant way of life on everybody else, taking us back to the pre-Enlightenment. And believe me, they are fighting tooth and nail, with significant success at even the highest levels of government, to get their way.

So while I have a lot of sympathy for your view, I'll take touchy-feely New Agists over Christianists any day if I have to choose.

Edited by viveutvivas, 10 November 2010 - 04:07 PM.

[Rational Madman]

Just blogged this over at my...blog.
Wiccans, neo-animists, nature-worshippers, polytheists and so forth are just as philosophically and empirically ridiculous as Christianity is.While Christianity, and to a lesser extent Islam, bear the brunt of anti-theism and naturalism, there is another group of crackpot magic-worshipers who are not as prominent but, in some ways, even more annoying.

Christianity is so superdominant and assumed among many people in the West that it plays very little role in most people's lives; they're too saturated and typically unchallenged to ever give it much thought. It also actually is an ancient religion, or set of religions, which does have still existing institutions which can be more or less directly traced from around 300AD, give or take a century.

Paganism, however, has none of these ameliorating traits. Paganism is not believed by practically anybody, and outright declared mythology by most people who have ever given it any thought. Therefor Pagans are strident and flamboyant; it isn't enough that they believe crazy nonsense, they also have to dress up like some Hippy-Goth and tell you about the soul of nature.

Paganism isn't even real Paganism. Aside from the Greco-Roman pantheons and some of their temples, we know practically nothing about ancient polytheistic and animistic religions of the West. There are some statues, some disconnected accounts (largely by opponents) and some simple rituals, the significance of which is lost, that we are aware of. Thus 'Paganism' is really just what it seems, New Age mysticism deriving largely from the 19th century with a bunch of arbitrary names and symbols, which have long lost their true meaning, super imposed on it. Good evidence for this is the fact that the various 'pagans' demonstrate the same sort of hand-wavy, nature-oriented mysticism that the non-pagan hippies and new agers they descend from do.

An amusing point is that they claim to have some vastly divergent morality from the cruel Christian religion, in fact they're just regurgitating left-wing liberal tropes that actually come from liberal Christianity and Protestantism in general.

Okay, but what does the demographic data say about paganism in the United States? I can't imagine that they constitute more than a minor irritant, but maybe their numbers are increased in the Pacific Northwest? I ran into them occasionally in Boston, and though eccentric, I never found them to be either vocal or forceful about their beliefs. On the other hand, the legions of evangelical Christians are the real threat to progress and my peace of mind. Unlike pagans, they insist on bombarding you with their nonsense, and are much more unforgiving of resistant non-believers. So overall, this rant strikes me as such a waste of energy, and if you continue down avenues like these, you'll suffer progressively more opportunity costs.

Edited by Rol82, 11 November 2010 - 12:38 PM.