11 replies to this topic

[Steve_86]

Does anyone have experience with using Tongkat Ali as a testosterone booster?

I'm strongly considering buying a 1:200 extract to see if it can help with my strength training.

THE ERGOGENIC EFFECTS OF EURYCOMA LONGIFOLIA JACK: A PILOT STUDY
S. Hamzah, A. Yusof.

Department of Exercise Physiology, Sports Centre, University of Malaya, 50603 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia

Eurycoma longifolia Jack (ELJ), which contains quassinoids such as eurycomalacton, eurycomanon, and eurycomanol, has been reported to have aphrodisiac properties and to increase testosterone levels in men.¹ Previous studies have established that the testosterone supplementation increases fat free mass, muscle strength, and muscle mass, which are important for physical function and athletic performance.^2,3 Thus, the objective of this study was to investigate the effect of the increase in testosterone levels, obtained by administration of ELJ, on body composition and muscle strength and size in man. Fourteen healthy men performed an intense strength training programme with initial load of 60% RM (2 sets of 10 repetitions with 1 minute rest between, for 10 stations) on alternate days for five weeks. Simultaneously, seven men were randomly selected to consume 100 mg/day ELJ water soluble extract, and seven men received placebo. The intensity of the exercise was increased by 10% RM/week. Body composition, arm circumference, one repetition maximum (1 RM), and surface electromyography (sEMG) activity were measured and recorded one day before and after the five weeks of supplementation and intervention. The lean body mass of the treatment group showed a significant increment, from 52.26 (7.18) kg to 54.39 (7.43) kg (p = 0.012), but no significant changes in fat free mass were observed in the placebo group. Percentage body fat was significantly decreased in the treatment and placebo group, from 31.30 (5.48)% to 28.44 (6.43)% (p = 0.01) and from 22.83 (2.43)% to 21.33 (2.35)% (p = 0.001) respectively. The 1RM test showed a significant increase from 73.71 (16.63) to 78.71 (17.0) kg (p = 0.006) in the treatment group and from 77.29 (8.9) to 79.43 (8.8) kg (p = 0.011) in the placebo group. The increase in strength in the treatment group was larger than in the placebo group (6.78% and 2.77% respectively). The mean frequency of sEMG on the biceps in the treatment and placebo groups decreased significantly, from 121.77 (40.0) to 90.47 (64.6) μV (p = 0.012) and from 127.95 (30.9) to 98.8 (50.1) μV (p = 0.036) respectively. The treatment produced 2.92% greater reduction in electrical activity of the muscle measured at the end of the experiment compared with placebo. The mean arm circumference of the treatment group increased significantly by 1.8 cm after the supplementation, from 30.87 (1.88) to 32.67 (1.96) cm (p = 0.011), but there was no significant increase in the placebo group. The results suggest that water soluble extract of Eurycoma longifolia Jack increased fat free mass, reduced body fat, and increased muscle strength and size, and thus may have an ergogenic effect. Further investigations are warranted.

1. Ismail MTM. Proceedings paper: Asian Congress of Sexology. 2002.



2. Bhasin S, Storer TW, Berman N, et al. The effects of supraphysiologic doses of testosterone on muscle size and strength in men. N Engl J Med 1996;335:1–7.

[CrossRef][Medline][Web of Science]

3. Brodsky IG, Balagopal P, Nair KS. Effects of testosterone replacement on muscle mass and muscle protein synthesis in hypogonadal men: a Clinical Research Center Study. J Clin Endocrinol Metab 1996;81:3469–75.

[Abstract]

Edited by Steve_86, 05 December 2010 - 11:59 AM.

[Joseph_Dantes]

It works. Cycle it 20-30 days, then 3-6 off. You'll need to ramp dosage as approach end of cycle.

I like it for the libido and psychological effects.

[Steve_86]

It works. Cycle it 20-30 days, then 3-6 off. You'll need to ramp dosage as approach end of cycle.

I like it for the libido and psychological effects.

I was going to do 6 days on 3 days off.

[Joseph_Dantes]

You can do a shorter cycle but from what I understand it's kind of a waste. Some German journalist who's big into sex tourism and reviewed all the Tongkat Ali manufacturer sources writes a bunch about it. Can't remember his name... Victor maybe?

EDIT: Oh yeah it was Serge Kreutz

Edited by Joseph_Dantes, 22 December 2010 - 11:15 AM.

[Steve_86]

You can do a shorter cycle but from what I understand it's kind of a waste. Some German journalist who's big into sex tourism and reviewed all the Tongkat Ali manufacturer sources writes a bunch about it. Can't remember his name... Victor maybe?

EDIT: Oh yeah it was Serge Kreutz

I can't find any solid evidence to prove the efficacy of one cycling method over another. Various web sites recommend 5 and 2, 6 and 3, 10 and 5, 14 and 7, on and off respectively. I think I'll give 14 and 7 a go for 2 months and see what results I get, particularly in strength training and body composition.

[nowayout]

That study is too small to really conclude anything.

Why didn't they measure serum testosterone, a cheap and easy metric to do? It seems unthinkable that they wouldn't have, so all I can conclude is that they probably did measure testosterone but found no effect.

[Steve_86]

That study is too small to really conclude anything.

Why didn't they measure serum testosterone, a cheap and easy metric to do? It seems unthinkable that they wouldn't have, so all I can conclude is that they probably did measure testosterone but found no effect.

Theres some interesting research here http://www.sd-200.com/research.html

Some people have taken blood tests before and after taking tongkat ali:
Example 1: http://www.testingto...estosterone.htm
Example 2: http://www.testingto...i.com/after.htm and http://www.testingto....com/before.htm
Example 3: http://www.testingto...eronelevels.htm


Anyway, I have begun taking a 2400mg a day of 1:200 extract so I'll let you guys know how it goes for me.

Edited by Steve_86, 22 December 2010 - 05:01 PM.

[smithx]

I'm not sure about the safety of tongkat ali (Eurycoma longifolia):

Eurycoma longifolia may be mutagenic as it contained alkaloids β-carboline. Alkaloids β-carboline was reported to be mutagenic and genotoxic as well (Picada et al., 1997; Boeira et al., 2002). This study has shown that some active components of E. longifolia that could be mutagenic were present but in very low concentration.
Eurycoma longifolia was the most cytotoxic extract which inhibited 50% of Hep2 and HFL1 cell growth at 11μg/ml and 13 μg/ml respectively. Many phytochemicals have been isolated from E. longifolia extract and found to be highly cytotoxic. Amongst the cytotoxic components of E. longifolia were canthin-6-one alkaloids, β-carboline alkoloids, and some quassinoids.

The paper does go on to say that:

Satyavivad et al. (1998) reported that toxicity of E. longifolia decreased by approximately 100-fold if taken orally indicating that the digestive tract filtered out many toxic compounds. High cytotoxicity of E. longifolia as found in this study suggests that E. longifolia should only be consumed orally.

But I would still be cautious.

Reference: http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/18209708

[nowayout]

Does anyone have experience with using Tongkat Ali as a testosterone booster?

I'm strongly considering buying a 1:200 extract to see if it can help with my strength training.

THE ERGOGENIC EFFECTS OF EURYCOMA LONGIFOLIA JACK: A PILOT STUDY
S. Hamzah, A. Yusof.

Department of Exercise Physiology, Sports Centre, University of Malaya, 50603 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia

Eurycoma longifolia Jack (ELJ), which contains quassinoids such as eurycomalacton, eurycomanon, and eurycomanol, has been reported to have aphrodisiac properties and to increase testosterone levels in men.¹ Previous studies have established that the testosterone supplementation increases fat free mass, muscle strength, and muscle mass, which are important for physical function and athletic performance.^2,3 Thus, the objective of this study was to investigate the effect of the increase in testosterone levels, obtained by administration of ELJ, on body composition and muscle strength and size in man. Fourteen healthy men performed an intense strength training programme with initial load of 60% RM (2 sets of 10 repetitions with 1 minute rest between, for 10 stations) on alternate days for five weeks. Simultaneously, seven men were randomly selected to consume 100 mg/day ELJ water soluble extract, and seven men received placebo. The intensity of the exercise was increased by 10% RM/week. Body composition, arm circumference, one repetition maximum (1 RM), and surface electromyography (sEMG) activity were measured and recorded one day before and after the five weeks of supplementation and intervention. The lean body mass of the treatment group showed a significant increment, from 52.26 (7.18) kg to 54.39 (7.43) kg (p = 0.012), but no significant changes in fat free mass were observed in the placebo group. Percentage body fat was significantly decreased in the treatment and placebo group, from 31.30 (5.48)% to 28.44 (6.43)% (p = 0.01) and from 22.83 (2.43)% to 21.33 (2.35)% (p = 0.001) respectively. The 1RM test showed a significant increase from 73.71 (16.63) to 78.71 (17.0) kg (p = 0.006) in the treatment group and from 77.29 (8.9) to 79.43 (8.8) kg (p = 0.011) in the placebo group. The increase in strength in the treatment group was larger than in the placebo group (6.78% and 2.77% respectively). The mean frequency of sEMG on the biceps in the treatment and placebo groups decreased significantly, from 121.77 (40.0) to 90.47 (64.6) μV (p = 0.012) and from 127.95 (30.9) to 98.8 (50.1) μV (p = 0.036) respectively. The treatment produced 2.92% greater reduction in electrical activity of the muscle measured at the end of the experiment compared with placebo. The mean arm circumference of the treatment group increased significantly by 1.8 cm after the supplementation, from 30.87 (1.88) to 32.67 (1.96) cm (p = 0.011), but there was no significant increase in the placebo group. The results suggest that water soluble extract of Eurycoma longifolia Jack increased fat free mass, reduced body fat, and increased muscle strength and size, and thus may have an ergogenic effect. Further investigations are warranted.

1. Ismail MTM. Proceedings paper: Asian Congress of Sexology. 2002.



2. Bhasin S, Storer TW, Berman N, et al. The effects of supraphysiologic doses of testosterone on muscle size and strength in men. N Engl J Med 1996;335:1–7.

[CrossRef][Medline][Web of Science]

3. Brodsky IG, Balagopal P, Nair KS. Effects of testosterone replacement on muscle mass and muscle protein synthesis in hypogonadal men: a Clinical Research Center Study. J Clin Endocrinol Metab 1996;81:3469–75.

[Abstract]

Let me get this right.

They investigated the effect of Tongkat Ali on testosterone. Yet they didn't bother to do the most obvious thing, which was to actually measure serum testosterone.

Garbage "science".

[nowayout]

//

Edited by viveutvivas, 24 December 2010 - 06:07 PM.

[Steve_86]

According to this website "1 g daily is recommended to be the maximum dose for supplemental use. For someone weighing about 180 lbs., this dose would equate to 12 mg/kg, less than 5% of a dose that did not cause apparent signs of toxicity in animals"
I have been unable to find the fulltext for their reference - Satayavivad, J., Soonthornchareonnon, N., Somanabandhu, A. and Thebtaranonth, Y., 1998, Toxicological and antimalarial activity of eurycomalactone and Eurycoma longifolia Jack extracts in mice. Thai Journal of Phytopharmacy, 5(2): 14-27

[dear mrclock]

any updates ?
isnt β-carboline helpful for depression and being present in syrian rue ? so it happens to be toxic ? i guess that ruins the idea of a natural antidepressant :/