I know this is controversial but looking at the science from the National Institute for Health it appears about 200 mg or so of vitamin C per day pretty much saturates a human body and amounts beyond this are quickly urinated out. Why would anyone want to take more? It seems to me if one took a supp with about 200 mg of vitamin C with breakfest and ate a decent amount of fruits and veggies during the day there would be little point in additional vitamin C supplementation. Any thoughts?
Vitamin C Saturation
#1
Posted 30 June 2011 - 03:55 AM
I know this is controversial but looking at the science from the National Institute for Health it appears about 200 mg or so of vitamin C per day pretty much saturates a human body and amounts beyond this are quickly urinated out. Why would anyone want to take more? It seems to me if one took a supp with about 200 mg of vitamin C with breakfest and ate a decent amount of fruits and veggies during the day there would be little point in additional vitamin C supplementation. Any thoughts?
#2
Posted 30 June 2011 - 11:52 AM
http://www.newmediae...t_all_along.htm
#3
Posted 30 June 2011 - 03:15 PM
Read the book Ascorbate: The Science of Vitamin C by Dr. Steve Hickey & Hilary Roberts
http://www.amazon.co...09446790&sr=1-1
In the book, pay particular attention to the "Dynamic flow model."
Edited by pycnogenol, 30 June 2011 - 03:17 PM.
#4
Posted 30 June 2011 - 07:46 PM
Also from what I understand about 200 mg or so per day of C gets you to the renal threshold. If you are not satisfied with this level you obviously need to take large amounts of C frequently throughout the day to maintain elevated levels above the renal threshold due to the very short half life at this point. So I guess it boils down to how high one wants their C levels and how much work one wants to do (supplementing throughout the day).
Also, I personaly am somewhat hesitant to supplement nutrients on a long term basis at what seems to be unnatural levels. If 5 servings of fruits and veggies have around 200 mg of C I don't believe cave man evolved taking in gram amounts of C daily. Since it doesn't seem we evolved taking in this much C, I'm not sure of the risk vs. reward of the high dose C regimen. Also for me at least, high dose C irritates my stomach. I wonder how many people might have long term GI tract issues taking high dose C?
From a practical standpoint maybe some of you high dose C people could let us know how much you take and how long you have been taking it and what your results and any side effects are? I'm not discounting that there very well may be benefits to a high dose C regimen but I'm somewhat skeptical of the risk vs reward.
#5
Posted 30 June 2011 - 10:44 PM
We are basically monkeys. We changed a little, but still we are no more, no less but monkeys.
http://cast.uark.edu...on/kmilton.html
Monkeys like us eat like 5 grams of vitamin C daily. We don't, hence all the trouble with cancer, heart diseases and so on.
There are other differences between our natural food and this trash we eat. For example, potassium - wild monkey of our size can eat as much as 20 grams of potassium. Average American is happy if he get more than 2 grams.
#6
Posted 01 July 2011 - 02:05 AM
What type of C dosage do you take and how does your stomach tolerate it?
#7
Posted 01 July 2011 - 06:45 AM
Are you taking straight ascorbic acid? That would seem to me to be the most likely reason for stomach/intestinal issues. If you haven't yet, try taking a mineral ascorbate (either calcium or magnesium). The C supplement I take is this one from Bluebonnet: http://www.iherb.com...caps/10460?at=0 It seems pretty good because of the bioflavonoid composition, which supposedly increases bioavailability (and maybe half-life? not sure) of C. Still, when this bottle runs out I'm probably going to look for a similar product in a 250mg dose.
#8
Posted 01 July 2011 - 01:53 PM
So:
1. our pre-ancestors ate 5 grams of vitamin C daily
2. there was time when they were forced to eat as little as 0,1 gram / daily
3. studies shows, that supplementation with at least 1 gram of vitamin C daily extend life by 6 years
It clearly shows, that "paleo" diet (and modern diet as well, but this is obvious) is not the best thing that happened to humanity.
I'm taking half teaspoon of vitamin C powder few times a day, and it feels GREAT. Everyone I know who startet vitamin C supplementation with such doses feels the same thing - incredible improvement in overall health.
As hbar said, ascorbates are better (completely neutral) for your stomach, I'm taking ascorbid acid as it's cheaper, I bought mine for ~10$/kg, enough for a year or so.
#9
Posted 01 July 2011 - 08:09 PM
When I tried the normal ascorbic acid I had to spit it out! I then tried the calcium ascorbate and it only had a slight bite. It was gritty with a fairly large crystal size and did not disolve fast in my mouth. Then I tried the Nature's Way product and it tasted very bland and smooth and was milled into a very fine powder that disolved almost instantly in my mouth. So far so good, I have taken a few of the Nature's Way C's with meals and no stomach issues.
The Nature's Way product is interesting. It is probably too expensive to take on a daily gram basis but it might be worthwhile for those who prefer moderate C dosages and have sensative GI tracts. The product says all the C comes from 4 different high C containing fruits. Supposidly no ascorbates added. If this is true it seems like a fruit extract standardized for C. The volume of the dose is more bulky than normal C. You must take 4 fairly bulky capsules to get 500 mg of C.
I know that C is well absorbed (in moderate doses at least) so maybe there is no need to get fancy but if the marketing is true there might also be other good-for-you things in there as well. Does anyone know about this product or has anyone used it? Below is what they advertise on the box:
"In whole foods, vitamin C is part of a total complex that includes ascorbic acid, bioflavonoids and co-factors known to aid its absorption in the body. Food-source vitamin C is also naturally buffered, so it's less acidic and gentler on the stomach. Unlike other supplements that use isolated ascorbic acid or cultured bacteria as thier source of vitamin C, Alive! 100% Whole Food Complex derives its entire vitamin C content from four of Mother Nature's most potent organic fruit sources acerola, goji, amla & kiwi."
#10
Posted 01 July 2011 - 09:25 PM
I guess those who take multi-gram doses of C daily must have acid-proof stomachs or something. I wouldn't be able to tolerate it. I sometimes wonder if those who claim to 'feel great' on multi-gram doses may have excess copper, since high levels of C can lower copper in the body
For myself, I just take a half-tablet of Ester-C daily (250mg) and get the rest from either a multi or the foods I eat. It's inexpensive and easy on my belly.
Edited by nameless, 01 July 2011 - 09:25 PM.
#11
Posted 01 July 2011 - 09:45 PM
I guess those who take multi-gram doses of C daily must have acid-proof stomachs or something. I wouldn't be able to tolerate it.
Or they take liposomal vit C. It also increases serum vit c higher and for longer periods.
#12
Posted 01 July 2011 - 10:31 PM
I guess those who take multi-gram doses of C daily must have acid-proof stomachs or something. I wouldn't be able to tolerate it.
Or they take liposomal vit C. It also increases serum vit c higher and for longer periods.
Yeah, I forgot about liposomal.
Happen to know of any studies using this form? A liposomal C study using dosing based on serum levels could be interesting and presumably easier for participants to take.
Can liposomal C result in higher serum levels than is possible using regular ascorbic acid? Or is it a matter of simply liposomal C being equal to several times the amount of regular C?
I read one manufacturer claiming 8g of ascorbic = 1g liposomal. Just wondering if liposomal raised serum levels even higher than 8g of ascorbic would, since 8g of ascorbic can't all be absorbed at one time.
#13
Posted 01 July 2011 - 10:39 PM
#14
Posted 01 July 2011 - 11:03 PM
Nameless, I thought the Ester C's came only in a capsule. You get them in a tablet that you can break? Also, could you taste a bit of one and see if they taste tart? Another thing that upsets my stomach is the citrus bioflavinoids that manufacturers love to add. It's hard to find a brand of buffered C that does not add them.
They may be slightly tart, but I'm not exactly chewing them or anything. Keep in mind a tablet has fillers too, so the fillers probably mask some of the tartness on my tongue.
But I can say they are certainly easier on my belly than ascorbic acid is.
And yeah, Ester C comes in capsules and tablets. Check out iHerb, they have like 20 varieties of Ester C there. Costco sells them too -- 500mg, 300 tablets.
#15
Posted 01 July 2011 - 11:10 PM
Happen to know of any studies using this form? A liposomal C study using dosing based on serum levels could be interesting and presumably easier for participants to take.
Can liposomal C result in higher serum levels than is possible using regular ascorbic acid? Or is it a matter of simply liposomal C being equal to several times the amount of regular C?
I read one manufacturer claiming 8g of ascorbic = 1g liposomal. Just wondering if liposomal raised serum levels even higher than 8g of ascorbic would, since 8g of ascorbic can't all be absorbed at one time.
Yes, I believe liposomal C can send serum levels as high 400 µM/L at 36g of lipo-c.
http://www.canceract...somal vit C.pdf
#16
Posted 02 July 2011 - 03:20 PM
http://www.pdazzler.com/archives/62
not sure if it makes sense, tho. Prices of the original liposomal vitamins are erm... very high, to say least.
#17
Posted 03 July 2011 - 02:38 AM
Since it's not acidic, I've been breaking the tablets in half and taking them sublingually. I have a bad wound on my arm that's in the process of healing and I'm trying to precipitate collagen formation. I already was taking 10000 mg a day of regular ascorbic acid for rheumatoid arthritis... I was thinking of reducing my ascorbic acid intake to 6000mg and working in two 500 mg Ester-C tablets a day - which is apparently the equivalent of 4000 mg of normal ascorbic acid?
#18
Posted 04 July 2011 - 12:20 PM
#19
Posted 05 July 2011 - 01:30 PM
Howard
#20
Posted 05 July 2011 - 09:17 PM
#21
Posted 10 February 2013 - 12:10 AM
I have adrenal fatigue, leaky gut, candida, thyroid probelms and FMS, and I have always been told to take vitamin c. I came across this the other day and wondered what you all thought about it: http://www.docrobert...bromyalgia.aspx
Cheers
#22
Posted 10 February 2013 - 02:04 AM
Quote: " In light of the results of our study (4), the studies of Yfanti and colleagues (14, 15) and earlier studies (6, 11, 12), we conclude that there is no evidence that antioxidant vitamins interfere with the adaptive responses to endurance exercise training."
http://ajpendo.physi.../302/4/E478.ful
The subject remains controversial .
I take 500mg of a mixed mineral buffered ascorbate four times a day.
#23
Posted 10 February 2013 - 02:22 AM
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