300 replies to this topic

[Ampa-omega]

Hey med hows life treating you?

if your ocd, uridine, i heard works..
behavioral therapy? mindfullness, meditation, calm music, talking yourself out of your obsessive compulsiveness?
mood stabilizing helps, i love minerals like magnesium for this.

what are you ocd about if you dont mind sharing?

Edited by Ampa-omega, 23 February 2012 - 11:03 PM.

[owtsgmi]

"Its individual; da release abolishes my ocd; psychedelics dont also not in treshold doses; amt in daily low doses does tough; im a big fan of this old sovjet antidepressant.

Hey Medievil - I've read some recent postings of yours and am interested in your stack. If you don't mind me asking, what does your stack look like these days?

[choqueiro]

So at this point, and cause I also as hooter says: "I enjoy sex too much to take even that risk" I would like to take in consideration other options. Even though I´m not rejecting escitalopram, what is your opinion about St. John´s Wort, specially about perika or kira??

Any user of perika or kira with positive experiences in the treatment of depression and anxiety?? Even though we are talking about natural supplements, kira is used in Germany (where kira comes from) as a treatment and requires a prescription.

Does St. John´s Wort increase serotonin??

Thanks

[hooter]

Does St. John´s Wort increase serotonin??

Thanks

Yes. Also mixing it with certain other medications can cause serotonin syndrome.

I have not heard of anybody who has ever had success with St. John's Wort... If there's someone out there please prove me wrong.

[noos]

I think outside of ocd, even the 5mg of escitalopram should be avoided. Considering the implications of the serotonergic system in aggression and homicidal behaviour, if this is indeed through a growth in the serotonergic system, then it's only a question of time being proportional to dosage.

What do you man? SSRIs increasing homicides? Low serotonin is related to aggression in some studies. I don´t understand your comment.

Regardless, the clinical efficacy of SSRIs has only been correlated to the agonism at sigma-1 receptors and it's utterly slow neuroregenerative effects on the hippocampus. I'm pretty sure this can be handled in a more sober manner with newer and more advanced medicines.

Like which ones?

[noos]

So at this point, and cause I also as hooter says: "I enjoy sex too much to take even that risk" I would like to take in consideration other options. Even though I´m not rejecting escitalopram, what is your opinion about St. John´s Wort, specially about perika or kira??

Any user of perika or kira with positive experiences in the treatment of depression and anxiety?? Even though we are talking about natural supplements, kira is used in Germany (where kira comes from) as a treatment and requires a prescription.

Does St. John´s Wort increase serotonin??

Thanks

Which risk?.

SJW can give you the same lethargy as an SSRI, plus photosenditivity (minor problem unless you work under the sun) and alteration of other drug´s metabolism. But it is interesting.

Edited by noos, 24 February 2012 - 03:03 PM.

[Ampa-omega]

Does anyone know what exactly is the underlying biological/neurological basis of OCD? what exactly is going on in the brain?

is the brain getting too active and excited with something?, is the person personally becoming dissociative?,
is it the dopamine or opiate receptors like some kind of an addiction? i know this is a bit simplistic in my wording but.., what makes someone compulsive?
i wonder what the chemical pharmacological basis is for OCD/compulsiveness...

unrational behaviors, unrational fears,

it is a pretty complex disorder, from what im reading there seems to be an compulsive addicton type to it and then the other is more like a distressing and anxiety disorder aspect to it.. again maybe i'm being simplistic here apologies, im just seeing a pattern.

is the addiction aspect connected to the anxiety aspect, perhaps it starts as a anxiety disorder that becomes an addiction disorder?

Compulsive behavior From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Compulsive behavior is behavior which a person does compulsively

in other words, not because they want to behave that way, but because they feel they have to do so. Mental health professionals have identified signs of compulsive behavior in various disorders such as:

Obsessive–compulsive disorder – obsessive, distressing, intrusive thoughts and related compulsions which attempt to neutralize the obsessions.

Drug addiction – a condition where a person takes a drug compulsively, despite potential harm to themselves, or their desire to stop.

so in OCD the addiction is an unrational coping mechanism, or ( an addiction to a unrational coping mechanism) (the delusional "cures") to an anxiety distress problem. perhaps it could also be categorize as a perception disorder because its a problem in perception of what is delusional and reality.. you could say. and if its primarily a disorder with perception (processing input from prefrontal cortex? or pain perception?) that could explain a basis to becoming a anxiety disorder and then becoming an addiction/ritual/coping disorder.

but again im not an expert this is just me thinking late at night..

Edited by Ampa-omega, 25 February 2012 - 05:26 AM.

[Ampa-omega]

possible implications maybe:
perhaps a disorder that has problems with regulating psychological input or fears that may manifest as physical pain,
pain perception? psyco-inflammatory disorder? ( or that could become a side effect)
brain areas regulating higher functions, logic, and behavior regulation are implicated
a mismatch between communication between hemispheres or parts of the brain so that the reasoning of a behavior and the execution of a behavior doesn't manifest itself properly

listen to this podcast, number 13 "unconscious decisions", which may not totally apply to OCD but i found it somewhat did http://podcasts.doub...a&id=zc9S8BnolF

Edited by Ampa-omega, 25 February 2012 - 05:56 AM.

[medievil]

This is my current stack:

Ginseng

Fish oil
glucosamine
Selenium
Zinc
MSM
Lecithin
Brewers yeast for uridine
Reboxetine
Wellbutrin
Mirtazepene

Ran out of

L methylfolate
Pregnenolone
Methylene blue

Edited by medievil, 25 February 2012 - 12:19 PM.

[medievil]

I cured my shizophrenia pretty much permanently except some residual symptions wich still need supplementa; ill post more later

[Ampa-omega]

why the MSM?
and Reboxetine

have you found anything good for OCD?
and what are all your recommendations for motivation (besides taking glutamine)

Edited by Ampa-omega, 25 February 2012 - 06:29 PM.

[hippocampus]

ppl who tried both uridine and brewer's yeast report that yeast doesn't have any of the effect or uridine, even in very high dosages. so the effects you're feeling are probably because of b-vitamins or some others nutrients.

[owtsgmi]

This is my current stack:

Ginseng

Fish oil
glucosamine
Selenium
Zinc
MSM
Lecithin
Brewers yeast for uridine
Reboxetine
Wellbutrin
Mirtazepene

Ran out of

L methylfolate
Pregnenolone
Methylene blue

Thanks for the info! Does the MB work for you or are things just as good without it?

[medievil]

It gives me extra energy and makes me smarter.

I also take supplements for lupus wich is why i take MSM; glucosamine etc.

[choqueiro]

And what about Rhodiola Rosea??

ScienceGuy said in his thread "Treating Anxiety Safely & Effective" that Rhodiola is a safe and effective anxyolitic. In addition, it seems that it can help with mild-moderate depression. See: http://www.medicalne...eases/92465.php I´ve been seraching some depression forums and a lot of users seem to have positive experiences using it. Any opinion about this substance to treat depression??

[ScienceGuy]

And what about Rhodiola Rosea??

ScienceGuy said in his thread "Treating Anxiety Safely & Effective" that Rhodiola is a safe and effective anxyolitic. In addition, it seems that it can help with mild-moderate depression. See: http://www.medicalne...eases/92465.php I´ve been seraching some depression forums and a lot of users seem to have positive experiences using it. Any opinion about this substance to treat depression??

RHODIOLA ROSEA can for some people be very effective in treating both ANXIETY and DEPRESSION; however, it is important to note that some (but not all) people can experience INTOLERABLE SIDE EFFECTS, the most common of which is INSOMNIA, which can prevent them using it. I recommend that individuals try it to see how they themselves respond to it

[choqueiro]

Thanks ScienceGuy. I think that I´m going to give Rhodiola an opportunity before trying escitalopram.

I was thinking in this product: http://www.iherb.com...36210?at=0&l=es

What dosage do you recommend me to start with?? Also, some people suggest to cycled it, because of the quick tolerance and others doesn´t experiment any tolerance in the long term. Do you suggested me to take breaks??

[owtsgmi]

I take about 20-30 drops of the extract each morning with an Emergen-C pack...

http://www.iherb.com...16946?at=0&l=es

[hippocampus]

You'll see, if you develop tolerance you should quit it for a month or two (or maybe start after a week to see, if there is any difference) and then try it again. I only use it during high stress periods, e.g. exam period.

[ScienceGuy]

Thanks ScienceGuy. I think that I´m going to give Rhodiola an opportunity before trying escitalopram.

I was thinking in this product: http://www.iherb.com...36210?at=0&l=es

What dosage do you recommend me to start with?? Also, some people suggest to cycled it, because of the quick tolerance and others doesn´t experiment any tolerance in the long term. Do you suggested me to take breaks??

Please note that what is the ideal dosage varies significantly from person to person, namely 50 - 500+mg daily; hence, you will need to experiment with it to see what is the ideal dosage FOR YOU. For example, some people find the 'right' dosage for them is 500+mg daily, whereas others find that just 50mg is ideal and any more than that they become OVERSTIMULATED, and then there is everything in between.

I'd recommend taking it 5 DAY ON, 2 DAYS OFF (e.g. take it Monday through Friday, then take weekends off); and take a break of 1-2 weeks OFF after every 3 months usage on the 5 DAY ON, 2 DAYS OFF dosing regimen. This should be sufficient to avoid TOLERANCE occuring

If you experience INSOMNIA then you will need to lower your dosage. If you experience INSOMNIA at the 50mg dosage (which can happen) then you basically should opt for something else

[manic_racetam]

My stack for the last three days... relief

Afobazol 10mg upon waking

tianeptine 12.5 x 3 times per day

Noopept 10mg once or twice a day with food (breakfast and/or lunch)

11-OXO 250mg with breakfast

I'll update again in about a week, but so far this is an amazing anxiety stack... the 11-OXO is a cortisol blocker and prohormone, contraindicated in the female population obviously (metabolizes to 11-ketotestosterone).

After I make it through this stressful period I'm going to quit my job! It can't be healthy to be stressed out to the point of developing anxiety disorders. I'm definitely self medicating in response to increased stress, which I have often times voiced opposition to. But at the same time the substances I'm using are probably some of the easiest on the body and brain... if not beneficial in that regard.

My long-term goal is repair to my gaba systems damaged by long term alcohol abuse (I'm hoping afobazol can help with that), and also theoretical repair to my hippocampus after years of serious "physical and emotional truama" (hopefully the tianeptine has already started that process). And with Noopept boosting NGF + BDNF I think I'm on the right track.

Also, the wonderful thing about this stack is that instead of any sort of dulling effects, so far it seems to have a cognitive enhancing effect.... more later.. gotta run

[ScienceGuy]

My stack for the last three days... relief

Afobazol 10mg upon waking

tianeptine 12.5 x 3 times per day

Noopept 10mg once or twice a day with food (breakfast and/or lunch)

11-OXO 250mg with breakfast

I'll update again in about a week, but so far this is an amazing anxiety stack... the 11-OXO is a cortisol blocker and prohormone, contraindicated in the female population obviously (metabolizes to 11-ketotestosterone).

After I make it through this stressful period I'm going to quit my job! It can't be healthy to be stressed out to the point of developing anxiety disorders. I'm definitely self medicating in response to increased stress, which I have often times voiced opposition to. But at the same time the substances I'm using are probably some of the easiest on the body and brain... if not beneficial in that regard.

My long-term goal is repair to my gaba systems damaged by long term alcohol abuse (I'm hoping afobazol can help with that), and also theoretical repair to my hippocampus after years of serious "physical and emotional truama" (hopefully the tianeptine has already started that process). And with Noopept boosting NGF + BDNF I think I'm on the right track.

Also, the wonderful thing about this stack is that instead of any sort of dulling effects, so far it seems to have a cognitive enhancing effect.... more later.. gotta run

Very interesting!

Have you experienced any INSOMNIA or SLEEP DISRUPTION issues with regards to the AFOBAZOLE?

And are you going to CYCLE the 11-OXO?

[choqueiro]

It´s curious. Everyone talks about tolerance when taking rhodiola.

Today I wrote to "Swedish Herbal Institute" asking about tolerance using rhodiola. This is what they answer me:

"I have never heard anything about that rhodiola must be cycled because of quick tolerance. Arctic Root, with the extract SHR-5, is derived from the root of Rhodiola rosea. It belongs to the category adaptogens; an adaptogen must be safe and normalize body functions irrespective of the nature of stressors, and give a quick effect. You can use Arctic Root both for short and long term usage. You always feel the effect, since adaptogens strive to normalize your body.

When ever you need a quick effect – take Arctic Root – it acts promptly (very economical) or you can use it for a longer period with stress and strain. To get the best effect, take 1 capsule in the morning and another one during lunchtime. During hard periods of stress and strain I use to increase the dose to 2 tablets twice a day".

[ScienceGuy]

It´s curious. Everyone talks about tolerance when taking rhodiola.

Today I wrote to "Swedish Herbal Institute" asking about tolerance using rhodiola. This is what they answer me:

"I have never heard anything about that rhodiola must be cycled because of quick tolerance. Arctic Root, with the extract SHR-5, is derived from the root of Rhodiola rosea. It belongs to the category adaptogens; an adaptogen must be safe and normalize body functions irrespective of the nature of stressors, and give a quick effect. You can use Arctic Root both for short and long term usage. You always feel the effect, since adaptogens strive to normalize your body.

When ever you need a quick effect – take Arctic Root – it acts promptly (very economical) or you can use it for a longer period with stress and strain. To get the best effect, take 1 capsule in the morning and another one during lunchtime. During hard periods of stress and strain I use to increase the dose to 2 tablets twice a day".

Please note that RHODIOLA ROSEA has several mechanisms of action; firstly, that of MAO INHIBITION; secondly, that of INCREASING levels of ENDORPHINS and ENCEPHALINS; and thirdly, by INHIBITION of CORTISOL release, thereby lowering CORTISOL levels

TOLERANCE can develop with respect to its MAO INHIBITION effects with prolonged usage without breaks, but not its elevation of levels of ENDORPHINS and ENCEPHALINS, nor lowering of CORTISOL levels. As such to maintain its full effects it is advised to take breaks and cycle it.

I hope this clarifies matters for you

Edited by ScienceGuy, 27 February 2012 - 07:59 PM.

[hippocampus]

Few years ago I've been taking rhodiola for half a year. First month I felt great, but then this effect subsided completely and I didn't get any effect even if I took up to 8 capsules a day (for few days in a row) (and don't ask me why I was still taking it if I felt no effect at all). When I stopped it I didn't feel any difference, so it must have been complete tolerance. And I was under high stress, so my cortisol levels certainly weren't low.

[manic_racetam]

My stack for the last three days... relief

Afobazol 10mg upon waking

tianeptine 12.5 x .........
....
Also, the wonderful thing about this stack is that instead of any sort of dulling effects, so far it seems to have a cognitive enhancing effect.... more later.. gotta run

Very interesting!

Have you experienced any INSOMNIA or SLEEP DISRUPTION issues with regards to the AFOBAZOLE?

And are you going to CYCLE the 11-OXO?

No sleep disruption at all... had no idea that was a possible side effect! Yes, I plan on cycling the 11-OXO, can't take testosterone metabolites chronically, lol. Do you think I'll need PCT with just 250mg per day? (Sorry, I know it's not a body-building website )

[ScienceGuy]

My stack for the last three days... relief

Afobazol 10mg upon waking

tianeptine 12.5 x .........
....
Also, the wonderful thing about this stack is that instead of any sort of dulling effects, so far it seems to have a cognitive enhancing effect.... more later.. gotta run

Very interesting!

Have you experienced any INSOMNIA or SLEEP DISRUPTION issues with regards to the AFOBAZOLE?

And are you going to CYCLE the 11-OXO?

No sleep disruption at all... had no idea that was a possible side effect! Yes, I plan on cycling the 11-OXO, can't take testosterone metabolites chronically, lol. Do you think I'll need PCT with just 250mg per day? (Sorry, I know it's not a body-building website )

You might like to consider using RELORA throughout your 11-OXO OFF PERIOD, sine RELORA's primary mechanism of action is CORTISOL INHIBITION; that way you can retain a continuous CORTISOL BLUNTING effect

I'd recommend limiting your 11-OXO ON PERIOD to 3-4 weeks maximum, and make the OFF PERIOD at least 8-12 weeks; that way with your relatively low dosage I do not think you will need to worry about PCT

[hippocampus]

What effect does lithium orotate have on OCD?

[manic_racetam]

My stack for the last three days... relief

Afobazol 10mg upon waking

tianeptine 12.5 x 3 times per day

Noopept 10mg once or twice a day with food (breakfast and/or lunch)

11-OXO 250mg with breakfast

I'll update again in about a week, but so far this is an amazing anxiety stack... the 11-OXO is a cortisol blocker and prohormone, contraindicated in the female population obviously (metabolizes to 11-ketotestosterone).

After I make it through this stressful period I'm going to quit my job! It can't be healthy to be stressed out to the point of developing anxiety disorders. I'm definitely self medicating in response to increased stress, which I have often times voiced opposition to. But at the same time the substances I'm using are probably some of the easiest on the body and brain... if not beneficial in that regard.

My long-term goal is repair to my gaba systems damaged by long term alcohol abuse (I'm hoping afobazol can help with that), and also theoretical repair to my hippocampus after years of serious "physical and emotional truama" (hopefully the tianeptine has already started that process). And with Noopept boosting NGF + BDNF I think I'm on the right track.

Also, the wonderful thing about this stack is that instead of any sort of dulling effects, so far it seems to have a cognitive enhancing effect.... more later.. gotta run

I retract the statement about afobazole not causing any cognitive difficulties. Turns me into a dimwit to put it nicely. Felt very happy on the above stack... borderline euphoric, but eventually the stupefying effects were too much to bear. So I've stopped the afobazole for now.

[Now]

What effect does lithium orotate have on OCD?

I would also like to know this. I found some information on Wikipedia, but I don't know enough to interpret it correctly.

Some citations:

Serotonin
OCD has been linked to abnormalities with the neurotransmitter serotonin, although it could be either a cause or an effect of these abnormalities. Serotonin is thought to have a role in regulating anxiety. To send chemical messages from one neuron to another, serotonin must bind to the receptor sites located on the neighboring nerve cell. It is hypothesized that the serotonin receptors of OCD sufferers may be relatively understimulated.

Lithium: upon ingestion, lithium becomes widely distributed in the central nervous system and interacts with a number of neurotransmitters and receptors, decreasing norepinephrine release and increasing serotonin synthesis.

Inositol
OCD: In a single double-blind study on 13 patients, myo-inositol (18 grams daily) has been found to reduce the symptoms of obsessive-compulsive disorder (OCD) significantly, with effectiveness equal to SSRIs and virtually without side-effects. In a double-blind, controlled trial, myo-inositol (18 grams daily) was superior to fluvoxamine for decreasing the number of panic attacks and other side-effects.

Lithium: older research suggests that lithium functions primarily by decreasing myo-inositol concentrations in bipolar patients; however the conclusions of this research are unsupported and have been questioned. Other studies suggest that lithium treatment may further inhibit the enzyme inositol monophosphatase, leading to higher intracellular levels of inositol triphosphate, an effect that was enhanced further by administration of an inositol triphosphate reuptake inhibitor.

Glutamate/NMDA receptors
OCD involves several different receptors, mostly H2, M4, NK1, NMDA, and non-NMDA glutamate receptors. The receptors 5-HT1D, 5-HT2C, and the μ opioid receptor exert a secondary effect. The H2, M4, NK1, and non-NMDA glutamate receptors are active in the striatum, whereas the NMDA receptors are active in the cingulate cortex.

The activity of certain receptors is positively correlated to the severity of OCD, whereas the activity of certain other receptors is negatively correlated to the severity of OCD. Correlations where activity is positively correlated to severity include the histamine receptor (H2); the Muscarinic acetylcholine receptor(M4); the Tachykinin receptor (NK1); and non-NMDA glutamate receptors. Correlations where activity is negatively correlated to severity include the NMDA receptor (NMDA); the Mu opioid receptor (μ opioid); and two types of 5-HT receptors (5-HT1D and 5-HT2C) The central dysfunction of OCD may involve the receptors nk1, non-NMDA glutamate receptors, and NMDA, whereas the other receptors could simply exert secondary modulatory effect

Lithium: the excitatory neurotransmitter glutamate could be involved in the effect of lithium as other mood stabilizers such as valproate and lamotrigine exert influence over glutamate. It was also reported that NMDA receptor blockage augments antidepressant-like effects of lithium in the mouse forced swimming test, indicating the possible involvement of NMDA receptor/NO signaling in the action of lithium in this animal model of learned helplessness.