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Giving noots a second chance -Sunifiram-

sunifiram

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#1 uubiduu

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Posted 09 January 2014 - 06:21 PM


Didnt have much luck with aniracetam/alpha-gpc in the past (literally did anything for me). After some readings i decided to try sunifiram, phenylpiracetam and noopept (but not at the same time). Yesterday i started with 5mg of sunifiram in the morning. Perhaps its placebo but i do have the impression that i'm already noticing an improvement when it comes to discussions with other people. Furthermore i have more attention when im listening to people.

My main questions are: How long would it be advisable to use sunifiram without interruption? Are there already some dosing schemes (x days on/y days off) out there? Somewhere i read that trials were only 7-12 days? Does this mean after this timespan i should quit? And how long should the following break be then? Do you think 5mg is a good dosage for a 180lbs person?
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#2 zocco

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 01:08 AM

I recommend you to not take it every day. Maybe first time, take it two or three days 5mg only and don't mix it with other substances, and then skip for a day or two. Less is more and better. While on it try to do something useful, don't slack around.

One dose seems to have effect at least 5 days for me and is most interesting substance i tired so far. I really wish to know more details how it works and what it does. Also i would like to know how it is different from unifiram, coluracetam and maybe others.

For me it seems to work in similar way as users Rethar and thedarkbobo described in other thread. The best effect is that i sleep better and time on clock seems to run slower. More is processed. But i need to sleep full time, around 8h to have best effect. Then next day i feel i am me in my best shape. It seems quite good for recall, i didn't notice short term memory problems like on noopept or any irritability. Also it seems to be a mild antidepressant. When i was sad about something it didn't make me too emotional, was just aware and kinda ok with situation. It's very good for outside activities, and it seems it makes me more extrovert person. I recommend going out to run, walk or to gym every few days. Just to get easy tired, not too much and you will feel even better. Running on it is much more enjoyable. While on noopept and going out i don't look much around and have some some cycles of thoughts inside me. Another positive thing for me is it seems it reduces tinnitus to barely noticeable. Not always immediately, but few hours later for sure. I think libido is better on it, but that could be result of good sleep.

Few times i tried to change my sleeping cycle on it and it didn't went well, but maybe that might be fixed after more days and not taking it too much or taking it at different times of day. Also to me it seems that cup of light coffee cancels some effects of it, so for example if sunifiram makes you stay up too long, you can drink cup of light coffee some hours before intended sleep. Another, not so negative thing is that you might need a short nap. If you feel tired, go lay down and close eyes. Good thing is it takes really short time and makes you feel really good, 15-30 minutes mostly. Another negative thing i had few times is mild headache on top of the head. It might be related to eating too much or wrong food, but weird location of headache seems to be related more to sunifiram or ACh depletion from it? I noticed i need to drink much more water and i enjoy eating good food(eggs, meat, cheese, pasta, chocolate...). I don't think it increases appetite but, bad eating habits might cause weight gain and some headaches, so don't try to eat too much.

Generally i'm positive about it, but i still need more to know.

Edited by zocco, 13 January 2014 - 01:16 AM.

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#3 uubiduu

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 10:48 AM

Im taking it for 7 days without break now. So you all think its time to quit for now? And if yes for how long? Im only taking choline bitartrate with it and sometimes melatonin before bed. Im drinking lots of coffee though.

#4 Geoffrey

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Posted 15 January 2014 - 02:11 PM

Try five days on, two days off (e.g., weekends off). I did this, but often felt it was still accumulating too fast. I now use it on an occasional basis, approx. once every three or four days, interspersing other nootropics on the other days. Have just started some nefiracetam 250mg, on its own (apart from CDP choline). Wow -- that stuff is strong. It kept my mind buzzing for two days solid, and even caused insomnia (heart racing, head thumping at night...) that I had to dampen down with melatonin. I wouldn't recommend either suni or nefi to anyone with high blood pressure... (or at least, keep the dosage really, really low).

#5 zocco

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Posted 18 January 2014 - 03:11 AM

Geofferey, do you find effects of sunifiram and nefiracetam any similar (some people reported so)?

#6 Geoffrey

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Posted 18 January 2014 - 11:29 AM

Geofferey, do you find effects of sunifiram and nefiracetam any similar (some people reported so)?


I find the effects of sunifiram to be very similar to that of most racetams. The main difference, for me, is a hormonal effect -- sunifiram seems to increase libido (not necessarily a good thing, especially if you want to concentrate) and produce thermogenesis, although the latter effect was only really noticeable in the first few weeks of taking it, then it disappeared. Nefiracetam I found to be very strong the first couple of times I took it, even though I divided the 500mg tablet in half, and it was quite similar to sunifiram but without the (seeming) hormonal effects. Maybe because it tends to reduce testosterone rather than increase it? (Although that might just be urban legend based on its effect on dogs' testicles.) I felt a definite tingling in my brain on nefi, like a concentration of energy in the area just behind the crown of the head (hard to describe precisely). It also made my thoughts zip around my head and made me quite talkative, and wired. On the second day I took 250mg in the morning and 250mg late afternoon, and although I was wired all day, by about 10pm I had bloodshot eyes and a mild headache -- I felt physically fatigued but mentally awake. When I went to bed it took a long time to get to sleep, even with melatonin

But I have to warn you that almost all nootropics I have tried, including sunifiram, have had strong effects for the first few days of administration, sometimes lasting up to a month. But homeostasis inevitably kicks in and they lose their more "manic" effects, and often seem to stop working all together, or produce paradoxical side effects.

So I have had to resort to cycling them for a more permanent effect: one day phenylpiracetam, the next just aniracetam, the next some suni with oxi, the next prami, etc.So far this seems to be working, but maybe my brain will work out how to block the whole racetam class soon. :mellow:
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#7 Climactic

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 06:32 PM

Sorry, but sunifiram is an excitotoxic neuroinflammatory drug with significant potential for dangerous drug interactions. I wouldn't take it once a week if you paid me USD 1000 a month for it. It would seem that people have forgotten all of its history among users on Longecity. It doesn't even work reliably. I am so much happier with armodafinil which actually continues to work day after day with little tolerance. Add to that green tea, sometimes phenylpiracetam, and an occasional 2mg nicotine gum, and I am god.

Edited by Climactic, 01 March 2014 - 06:34 PM.

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#8 Babychris

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 06:46 PM

Man that's funny but Armodafinil triggered in me a permanent depersonalization so, don't forget that your science is not absolute and I'm PRETTY SURE that a combo of phenylpiracetam Nicotine and Armodafinil is absolutely not better than a sunifiram little dose
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#9 Climactic

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 07:05 PM

Man that's funny but Armodafinil triggered in me a permanent depersonalization so, don't forget that your science is not absolute and I'm PRETTY SURE that a combo of phenylpiracetam Nicotine and Armodafinil is absolutely not better than a sunifiram little dose

I find this report a bit unusual, given that modafinil is used off-label for depersonalization disorder.

Most people who use sunifiram don't just use a little dose, implying fractions of a milligram. They use a large dose of several milligrams. Moreover, the bigger problem is that no one uses sunifiram in isolation. People are almost always taking other LTP promoters, and that's when shit hits the fan with sunifiram. I can and do take all of armodafinil, caffeine, theobromine, phenylpiracetam, and nicotine in one day with no worries about harmful interactions except some temporary overstimulation. But I could never do this with sunifiram.
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#10 Babychris

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:00 PM

Yeah but you know brain is a complex thing, I took yesterday a fish oïl teaspoon, and I'm now suffering from a TERRIBLE headache.. And it is certainly the cause of vasodilatation and nevertheless it feels like a brain tumor patient who tooks a combo of 1 Kg of PIracetam coupled with 1g of amphetamine..
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#11 Climactic

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:12 PM

Sunifiram's primary action is to activate NMDAr; it has no brakes. This action is associated with numerous very harmful neurological diseases caused by excitotoxicity. This logic should be sufficient to avoid sunifiram use.

If you get a headache from 1 teaspoon of fish oil, that's quite unusual too. I would examine the ratio of EPA:DHA in it and try taking less at a time.
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#12 Geoffrey

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Posted 02 March 2014 - 01:23 PM

Sunifiram's primary action is to activate NMDAr; it has no brakes. This action is associated with numerous very harmful neurological diseases caused by excitotoxicity. This logic should be sufficient to avoid sunifiram use.


Actually sunifiram acts on the glycine binding site of NMDA receptors. This is by no means the same as direct NMDA activation: at the very least the glutamate binding site needs to be simultaneously activated for the ion channel to open. Therefore there is at least one obvious brake, and that is the concentration of glutamate available at the receptor site.

These mechanisms of action are almost identical to those of nefiracetam without the potentially toxic metabolites. Lots of other drugs – including some very interesting ones in commercial development such as GLYX-13 – act via the glycine binding site of NMDAr, which is an essential site for the mediation of Long Term Potentiation and hence for the enhancement of memory and learning. It is disingenuous to claim that such agonism is automatically neurotoxic.

Numerous people have been taking sunifiram regularly without negative side effects of this order. If it were neurotoxic, then given the number of people on this board and elsewhere who have taken / are taking sunifiram (sometimes in frighteningly large doses), why are we not seeing numerous cases of hospitalizations due to excitotoxic symptoms or reports of glutaminergic storms? Injected doses of 1mg/Kg of body weight in mice failed to show any toxic symptoms. Multiple scientific studies in animals, as opposed to two or three anecdotal forum reports in humans, show sunifiram at high doses to have no known neurotoxic effects in said animals. Those anecdotal reports need to be weighed against the many anecdotal reports claiming positive effects on motivation, attention, memory, sociability, etc., especially when co-administered with with a high-quality choline source.

Having said that, it is wise to avoid mixing sunifiram with stimulants, expecially high doses of caffeine, amphetamines, etc. On its own (plus choline supplementation) in doses of ~5-10mg per day it appears to be safe over the short term and over the medium term (in my case, up to three months continuous usage, with breaks at weekends, although I have not taken it continuously, as opposed to sporadically, for several months now).
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#13 Climactic

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Posted 02 March 2014 - 04:31 PM

Sunifiram's primary action is to activate NMDAr; it has no brakes. This action is associated with numerous very harmful neurological diseases caused by excitotoxicity. This logic should be sufficient to avoid sunifiram use.


Actually sunifiram acts on the glycine binding site of NMDA receptors. This is by no means the same as direct NMDA activation: at the very least the glutamate binding site needs to be simultaneously activated for the ion channel to open. Therefore there is at least one obvious brake, and that is the concentration of glutamate available at the receptor site.

These mechanisms of action are almost identical to those of nefiracetam without the potentially toxic metabolites. Lots of other drugs – including some very interesting ones in commercial development such as GLYX-13 – act via the glycine binding site of NMDAr, which is an essential site for the mediation of Long Term Potentiation and hence for the enhancement of memory and learning. It is disingenuous to claim that such agonism is automatically neurotoxic.

Numerous people have been taking sunifiram regularly without negative side effects of this order. If it were neurotoxic, then given the number of people on this board and elsewhere who have taken / are taking sunifiram (sometimes in frighteningly large doses), why are we not seeing numerous cases of hospitalizations due to excitotoxic symptoms or reports of glutaminergic storms? Injected doses of 1mg/Kg of body weight in mice failed to show any toxic symptoms. Multiple scientific studies in animals, as opposed to two or three anecdotal forum reports in humans, show sunifiram at high doses to have no known neurotoxic effects in said animals. Those anecdotal reports need to be weighed against the many anecdotal reports claiming positive effects on motivation, attention, memory, sociability, etc., especially when co-administered with with a high-quality choline source.

Having said that, it is wise to avoid mixing sunifiram with stimulants, expecially high doses of caffeine, amphetamines, etc. On its own (plus choline supplementation) in doses of ~5-10mg per day it appears to be safe over the short term and over the medium term (in my case, up to three months continuous usage, with breaks at weekends, although I have not taken it continuously, as opposed to sporadically, for several months now).


I don't believe it's true that the glutamate binding site has to be simultaneously activated. The NMDA receptor can be activated on one of any number of independent sites. I believe the disingenuous claim is entirely yours. Think about it. If glutamate can activate the receptor, then what is the glycine site there for? If glycine can activate the receptor, then what is the glutamate site there for?

Sunifiram is irreversibly excitotoxic when you take it along with other LTP promoters, as many do. Glycine alone is one of them. Taking sunifiram means you cannot take any serious stimulant with it.

Your number of two or three is quite off. I know many more who have had disastrous side effects. With harmful chronic side effects of persistent pressure headaches, insomnia, vertigo, and tinnitus, it would have never passed clinical trials. Regarding hospitalizations, beside myself, I know at least one other person who ended up there too because of sunifiram.

The acetylcholine source will help but it is not going to save you from excitotoxic hell.

GLYX-13 may make sense only in those who are severely depressed, and while ensuring that they don't take any other NMDAr activating drugs.

Edited by Climactic, 02 March 2014 - 04:52 PM.

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#14 mrd1

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Posted 03 March 2014 - 05:17 AM

The Glycine receptor is there because it allows the ion channel to be more efficiently opened in response to a glutamate or aspartate (lesser so than glutamate) binding. Keep in mind when we talk about glutamate, glycine, and aspartate in the nervous system it is totally different then consuming these orally. Here the glycine receptor is to function as a co activator to glutamate binding. Simply put, glutamate binding w/o glycine equals less then glutamate binding during the presense of glycine receptor activation.

According to J. Moskal, D. Leander, R. Burch (2010)'s Unlocking the Therapeutic Potential of the NMDA Receptor research paper, "Glycine-site NMDA receptor agonists are now viewed with great interest for the development of new drugs with anxiolytic, antidepressant and analgesic effects without obvious psychotomimetic activities. "

Claims of sunifiram causing excitotoxicity either alone, long term, or with certain other compounds is a interesting. However, I have yet to see any body of research supporting that this is the case. Now that doesn't mean it doesn't cause excitotoxicity, just that I don't see evidence to support this at this time.

Also, while it is wise to exercise caution, I have yet to see any research suggesting that sunifiram would need to be cycled. However, this is probably because of how new this is. So, it is really anyones guess if this truly needs to be cycled.


As for "Also i would like to know how it is different from unifiram, coluracetam and maybe others." I can find very little research providing clues to any possible subtle difference between uni and sunifiram so ill group them together.
Suni/uni -firam are ampakines capable of altering AMPA activity probably through at least partly action at the NMDA- glycine site.

Coluracetam- I personally love this compound in perticular because it seems to work by altering activity at the high affinity choline transporter and may produce lasting changes much longer than it is detectable in blood. Even days after.

Coluracetam- has been studied in very high dosages (40-80 MG!) for reducing anxiety and depression.

Sunifiram- while lacking research as a antidepressant, it is theoretically possible given the ability of the glycine receptor to induce antidepressant effects.

Aniracetam- has metabolites that activate the nicotinic receptors, dopamine type 2, and, 5-ht and has a antidepressant in old rats when given at 50-100 mg/kg

Interestingly, I have taken sunifiram without side effects in the dosage of 5-15 mg (mostly 5-10 mg) 1-3x a day till I used up all 2 grams.

I was and currently still take all of the things that seems to be hypothesized here to induce excitotoxicity and many side effects. For example, 55 mg of adderall /day aniracetam 1250 1-3x a day, piracetam 4.8-9.6g 1-3x a day, nuvigil 225 mg /day, noopept either 10 mg or 135 mg 1-3x a day, coluracetam 5-10 mg 1-3x a day with at some points 20-40 mg 1-3x a day when I first got it (which I took with sunifiram), over 900 mg of caffeine a day etc. Obviously this is quite odd that I can tolerate all this and just because I seem to be OK that doesn't mean it is safe for anyone to try this. However, I just hope this shows that perhaps sunifiram doesn't cause the negative issues reported here.

#15 Climactic

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Posted 03 March 2014 - 05:51 AM

Unlike substances like piracetam, noopept, and others, sunifiram has never been clinically tested in humans. It could be having effects we don't know, including PKCa based cancer accelerating effects. I know I am spreading FUD in my preceding statement, but there is a scientific basis for it, including the cancer risk. In general, is it really worth the risk to take untested substances?

If the glycine and glutamate site connection on the NMDAr is true, then there is even more theoretical danger of an interaction, coming separately from glycine agonists, glutamate agonists and calcium channel agonists. Note that the side effects in many people were essentially irreversible, i.e. really long lasting - far beyond any reasonable washout period. We already know from drugs like coluracetam that effects can be quite long lasting, but sunifiram went further in some of us.

There was the ampakine drug Farampator which also had headache side effects in some people but not in everyone. It was discontinued, and for good reason. Drugs are supposed to be safer than that.

And yes, you're on quite a lot of drugs there. I was on some other stuff too like inositol, glycine, and NALT, all of which affect NMDAr activity. Have you first covered all your essential vitamins, minerals, essential amino acids, and omega-3s in close to optimal amounts?

Edited by Climactic, 03 March 2014 - 05:55 AM.

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#16 Geoffrey

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Posted 03 March 2014 - 08:10 AM

I think it's quite clear from all the scientific literature that, as mrd1 states above, the NMDA ion channel is gated and requires the presence of at least two co-agonists, the neurotransmitter glutamate and either glycine, aspartate or theoretically some other substance (e.g. (s)unifiram, nefiracetam, or even piracetam) that binds to the glycine site in order to allow the passage of sodium and calcium ions into the postsynaptic cell. It is quite likely that a number of nootropic substances act at least partially on this or related NMDA sites, since the NMDA gate is an essential modulator of Long Term Potentiation and hence of memory and learning. Piracetam itself “may have an effect on NMDA glutamate receptors, which are involved with learning and memory processes. Piracetam is thought to increase cell membrane permeability.[19][20] Piracetam may exert its global effect on brain neurotransmission via modulation of ion channels (i.e., Na+, K+)” (Wikipedia article on piracetam).

Would sunifiram have passed human safety trials? The two cases of hospitalization Climactic mentions (out of hundreds of apparently harmless cases of regular dosing of sunifiram with some reports of pressure-related or choline-defficiency headaches), seem to have been caused, if I’ve understood correctly, by relatively high doses of sunifiram co-administered with glycine and modafinil and/or extremely high doses of caffeine. A high dose of caffeine itself can lead to hospitalization. Combine it with a high dose of an AMPA agonist (whether direct or indirect) and you’re asking for trouble: overdosing on any two stimulants can easily land you in hospital.

Compare with paracetamol: take one or two pills and you’ll cure / mask a headache. Take five in one go, especially co-administered with, say, a couple of shots of whisky, and you’ll end up in hospital with a failing liver. Did that prevent paracetamol from passing safety trials?

By the way, there is no way that human safety trials would pick up any cancer-promoting activation of PKCα pathways, since any such effects would presumably be on a much longer-term scale than the length of a normal human trial. But by this analogy, we should avoid trying to form new memories through intellectual stimulation, as learning and memorization activate PKCα pathways and promote synaptic neuroplasticity (horror of horrors!).

Edited by Geoffrey, 03 March 2014 - 08:17 AM.

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#17 Climactic

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Posted 04 March 2014 - 03:45 AM

Geoffrey, you're basically seeing what you want to see and believing what is most convenient for you in the short term. I guess you can also extend your logic to say the same thing about the persons who experienced SE from farampator. It was their fault, or they misrepresented the facts. Why not? Surely you seem like you know what's going on, more so than the numerous people who have actually experienced chronic headaches and neuroinflammatory symptoms as a direct result of the drugs. But let's cast your convenient beliefs aside for a moment.

Under certain conditions having to do with the co-presence of certain agents which you can't all determine in advance, sunifiram can activate NMDAr PERMANENTLY (on the glycine site). This is where the danger lies and where excitotoxicity comes in. Once this happens, it's so severe that you won't be able to sleep at night, you'll have tinnitus all day, your sense of balance will be sub-par, and nausea will be your friend.

Edited by Climactic, 04 March 2014 - 03:56 AM.

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#18 Sanguine_Rogue

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Posted 04 March 2014 - 04:07 AM

Recently started taking Sunifiram alongside Tianeptine with a few other mild nootropics (Piracetam, and CDP choline). I have to say that Sunifiram and Tianeptine are some of the strongest nootropics I have ever taken, I was used to not so much "feeling" the nootropics but these two definitely give me a uppy pep feeling while keeping me feeling tranquil and in a good mood.

I definitely recommend taking these two together, simply due to the various overlapping areas of benefit that the two have with each other. I of course ordered mine through Smart Drugs for Thought due to their prompt shipping time and over all great customer service. They have a good deal of information on their website regarding the two and i'm sure they could answer just about any question thrown at them regarding the two nootropics.

#19 jly1986

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Posted 09 March 2014 - 11:17 AM

I've been taking about 5mg sunifiram 7 days/week for the past several weeks. Generally positive effects: better sleep quality, lucid dreams, improved libido, more motivation, enhanced reading speed / comprehension / retention. Plan to continue taking it.
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#20 Babychris

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Posted 09 March 2014 - 06:59 PM

Do you stack it with Choline ?

#21 jly1986

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Posted 14 March 2014 - 09:10 AM

Do you stack it with Choline ?


Not choline directly, but in the form of eggs and a small amount of Centrophenoxine (10ish mg/day).

Still taking around 5mg sunifiram daily. It seems to be quite agreeable with me.

#22 WillHen

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Posted 26 June 2014 - 04:00 AM

Hi Climatic, i'm sorry to hear about side effect you got from sunifiram, i would like to try unifiram, do you think it safer than sunifiram?
Thank you.

#23 branks

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Posted 26 June 2014 - 03:42 PM

Climactic is the guy who mixed a ton of stimulants with Sunifiram and got a bad reaction, and continues to tarnish it across the internet with false claims of massive toxicity.

He consumed large doses of caffeine and modafinil, as well as phenylpiracetam to increase the stimulant effects, and continued to dose even after he was showing negatives. He was chasing a stimulant high, and gave himself a wicked headache.

Take what he did as an example why you should be cautionary with untested substances and not mix them with anything willy nilly, to "see what it does to you". Also take what he says with a grain of salt, because there have been people who have done the same as him without any adverse reactions, and reports of people mixing sunifiram with street stimulants without having the side effects he's purporting sunifiram to have around the net.

Personally I found Sunifiram to be massively helpful, and without side effects other then a little difficulty falling asleep at first. Within 7 days of trialing it at 10mg, two times daily, a depression I had been dealing with for 6 months remitted, I felt like I regained my personality and the "edge" I used to have when I was younger. I became motivated to do things again, to socialize, to work hard. It fixed years of substance abuse issues for me, and intense, lasting, left over side effects caused by an overdose of conscious anesthetic (valium and demerol) and returned my brain to a baseline I thought I'd never reach again. To go from living in a fog for years, with complete anhedonia, amotivational disorder and suicidal ideation to feeling like the god-king I was in my teenage years again, is worth nearly any risk.

Its quite a unique substance that when used properly, can really paint your life with magic and beauty, like it was when you were young, innocent, not jaded or damaged. Its like having the cobwebs between your ears shredded while someone gives your visual processing a polish.

Edited by branks, 26 June 2014 - 03:43 PM.

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#24 noot_in_the_sky

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Posted 26 June 2014 - 04:03 PM

I agree with you, branks, that Climatics did made some bad  combinations. Nonetheless, we should be very caution with Sunifiram.  Me personaly only use 5mg/d with  weekends and sometimes  Wednesday off. I also use  L-Theanine with it, and  Ashwagandha at night.  Which I belive help protect the brain from  excitotoxins.

 

Using yourself as an example is questionable, since you where already ill. 

 

  • a depression I had been dealing with for 6 months
  • overdose of conscious anesthetic (valium and demerol)
  • living in a fog for years, with complete anhedonia, amotivational disorder and suicidal ideation

 


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#25 branks

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Posted 26 June 2014 - 07:44 PM

I didn't use myself as an example, I gave my experiences with the substance. To have such dramatic recovery from a variety of things that had been holding me back for extremely long periods of time, to all symptoms and issues remitting within days and me feeling like a younger version of myself, means I'm an excellent example for what sunifiram could for people with the same/similar issues.

#26 WillHen

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Posted 27 June 2014 - 12:06 AM

Thanks for the replies!
I will give it a try soon.
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#27 branks

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Posted 27 June 2014 - 07:05 PM

Goodluck, and let us know how it goes! :)

#28 noot_in_the_sky

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Posted 01 July 2014 - 04:40 AM

I didn't use myself as an example, I gave my experiences with the substance. To have such dramatic recovery from a variety of things that had been holding me back for extremely long periods of time, to all symptoms and issues remitting within days and me feeling like a younger version of myself, means I'm an excellent example for what sunifiram could for people with the same/similar issues.

 

Sorry, I  miss understood you.

 

 

Also here are few things I forgot to add before.

 

1. I'm 5'10, 185lb and ~10% body fat. So if your smaller you may want to consider starting with a smaller dose.

 

2. If the increase of libido or sociability bothers you, add pramiracetam 50mg or less is enough. It can help balance out does two effects. Noopept can also lower your libido, but I haven't try it with sunifiram.

 

3. Some people mention how it gives them realistic flash backs. This has happen to me, where I can begin to connected and remember vividly past events to the present. Ex. If I walk by an old store I may vividly begin to remember how I use to go there when I was a child. I'll rember what I bought, its taste, texture and smell.   So if you had a bad childhood it may not be so good for you.

 

4. The effect I describe above didn't happen immediately. It took about 2 or 3 months, perhaps because of the small dose I was using.  After I discontinue using sunifiram the recall lasted about a week or so.


Edited by noot_in_the_sky, 01 July 2014 - 04:42 AM.


#29 Geoffrey

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Posted 10 October 2014 - 11:18 AM

Noopept and sunifiram do stack quite well together. Suni seems to smooth out the noopept aggression (it makes me at least bad-tempered on its own), and noopept seems to calm the libido-inducing effects of suni (I don't really want that while studying!). However, I find it very hard to dose consistently both of them, as they or their effects accumulate too fast.

I'm currently having quite good results with micro-dosing sunifiram (1-2mg, as needed through the day, but no more than 3 times a day) co-administered with magnesium l-threonate (what I use, though magnesium is the important thing). I feel the magnesium makes suni's effect less spikey, spreads it out more smoothly. But this is highly subjective. It is also thought to act as a brake on potential excitotoxic mechanisms.

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#30 Lobotomy

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Posted 16 October 2014 - 07:38 PM

Man Sunifiram is a really dirty nootropic. If you want the benefits from Sunifiram, take 5g Piracetam, L-Theanine, and a dose of Unifiram.


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