10 replies to this topic

[normalizing]

i keep reading and reading about the overated CILTEP stack, i decide to piece things together and try it. of course i go in with not much hope as i know from history, people keep praising something to such extent, it becomes invalid.

 

anyway, i get the artichoke extract 500mh std 7% caffeoilquinic acids, forskolin (2 different brands just in case), Phenylalanine 500mg, up to 200mg+ caffeine from espresso.

 

i followed this site for the ciltep stack if anyone cares to know; http://www.whatareno...ciltep-regimen/

 

anyway, for a week of regular combos NOTHING. i can usually feel the caffeine tho, and phenylalanine is noticable without any of the other crap added so it wasnt a big deal.

eventually i started bumping the amounts. artichoke extract, up to grams. forskolin, 4 caps from the first brand i got then i switched to the second one which was less dose for more percent forskolin (50mg for 18% vs 250mg for 10%) and again i switched in betwen them on and off by hitting 4-6 caps at times NOTHING. i bumped up phenylalanine to 2 grams, NOTHING. i even had coffeine bumped to 300mg regular dose and still just irritance and insomnia!

 

anyway, i decided to check the claims done on artichoke extract being PD4, and i couldnt find reliable info. artichoke extracts all over the stores claim to have standardization of various percent caffeoliquinic acids, BUT there is not a single source to tell me caffeolquinic acid is PD4 inhibitor. now, i know im grasping at straws here, because if that ciltep stack works at all, it wont matter this specific detail since i used good high grade reliable brands to stack em together as i have been guided and it still wouldnt help me at all, so i think the whole stack is a scam at the end. regardless of the flaw being that people support the idea artichoke extract is PD4 inhibitor or not. Im especially dissapointed in forskolin since i used 2 different brands and even before the ciltep stack, i used to do few caps here and there at random to check if anything at all, it was always useless. im confused as to why since forskolin has actual documentation of various psysiological effects.....

 

 

anyway, in my experience, and my opinion, ciltep stack is a scam, useless!

[SirReal]

And of course you base this on actual before/after comparisons of objective tests, and not just subjective "feelings"..... right?

[normalizing]

its only way to test it is on yourself. i base it on how i felt before, during and after effects. not sure how anyone can experience the ciltep effects without testing them on themselves...

the person who proposed this ciltep stack has tested on himself and he charges a lot for the actual formula. i think its much smarter to buy the ingredients in bulk cheaper and test them in combo yourself and its the only way to report what you experience unless you own rats to test it on them, but then this is hard to observe since its much more than simple anxiety test or simple memory test that rats might be useful for.

 

anyway, im curious if anyone cares to help me here with some natural PD4 sources, i think its better idea to just get those and experiment instead of using forskolin.

[normalizing]

so i still didnt get any response to as to why people assumed artichoke extract acts as PD4 inhibitor? i checked all extracts claim to contain some percent of coffeolyquinic acid, which i researched for any PD4 activity and there is no literature about it. so how did people come up with this?

[Major Legend]

lutein

[abelard lindsay]

Luteolin-7-glucoside (a.k.a luteolin 7-0-glucoside)

http://pubchem.ncbi....cgi?cid=5280637

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/22251096
. "The main polyphenols detected were chlorogenic acid, cynarin, luteolin 7-O-rutinoside, and luteolin 7-O-glucoside."

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/15476679

"Luteolin-7-glucoside exhibited dual inhibition of PDE2/PDE4 with an IC(50) value of around 40 microM. "

Edited by abelard lindsay, 23 May 2014 - 01:19 PM.

[scitris]

yeah normalizing, you are totally right. There is no such possibility of effectiveness, if you are seeing it not working on yourself, besides of the scientific knowledge and the many positive reports. I mean if you say that something is not working, then it cant work. So the best thing for the humanity is to let us getting leaded by you. As being the only human on this planet that can differ between truth and false, you have the responsibility to try all substances on this planet to let us know, what the substance really is and what it does, but let us being honestly you are so intelligent that u dont need to try all that stuff. I mean look, you knew before you tried ciltep that it is a scam. Im really glad that i have THIS person on a board where i am active, what we would do without you? I really dont know. Give me enlightenment.

[normalizing]

^ your bitching and crying is not appreciated in my threads. if you have problems, take them to your mom.

[normalizing]

Luteolin-7-glucoside (a.k.a luteolin 7-0-glucoside)

http://pubchem.ncbi....cgi?cid=5280637

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/22251096
. "The main polyphenols detected were chlorogenic acid, cynarin, luteolin 7-O-rutinoside, and luteolin 7-O-glucoside."

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/15476679

"Luteolin-7-glucoside exhibited dual inhibition of PDE2/PDE4 with an IC(50) value of around 40 microM. "

 

im not sure why tell me this i already knew. i think you missunderstood. i said, from all the artichoke extracts on the market, and the ones i tried, it keeps mentioning they are standardized to a percent of caffeolyquinic acid. and then i asked, why would they be standardized to that acid spcifically since i couldnt find any indication of it being associated with PD4 activity. why arent there artichoke extracts with luteolin standardization? anyway, i knew what contents are present in artichoke and there are even more that you didnt actually post. but anyway, if i could find an actual artichoke extract of actual luteolin standarzation, i might try this ciltep stack again. until then, its proven useless until proven otherwise.

[abelard lindsay]

You can try Zembrin for the PDE4 inhibitor.  It's an extract of Kanna that's standardized for a strong PDE4 inhibitor : mesembrenone.  It's a little strong though.  When I took it as the PDE4 inhibiting part of CILTEP it I found myself longing to go home and watch math lectures, much to the detriment of my social life.  I was doing 4 coursera courses at once and keeping up with the homework, but I didn't want to do anything else.   Artichoke, IMHO, is much mellower.

Edited by abelard lindsay, 24 May 2014 - 01:29 AM.

[normalizing]

i did straight kanna powder extract, it knocked me down once. it was a long time ago so i dunno if that new zembrin extract is any good.

 

but i wanna try something with high luteolin content to add as PD4 inhibitor if possible. i sure hope some standardized extracts of that exist out there otherwise i have seen it being sold as isolated chemical but you have to buy a lot and at higher cost...