6 replies to this topic

[StevesPetRat]

Are there any supplements shown to actually reduce fibrin (and preferably remove it from veins, capillaries, arteries) *in vivo*, when administered orally? I am familiar with serrapeptase, nattokinase, and lumbrokinase, but I have my doubts that they do much via the oral route. I mean, people also promote them for gut biofilm dissolution, so if they get used up in the gut, how would they reach the bloodstream?

 

I have a super highly elevated galectin-3 level (I'm in roughly 99th percentile). This lectin promotes fibrin deposition (google galectin-3 fibrosis, it's terrifying). It can be slightly lowered by oral modified citrus pectin, but the studies I saw showed a modest 30% or so decline in rats, and I would need to drop it by at least twice that; the HED dose would be roughly 15 g of the stuff a day for the 30% reduction, also.

 

I have a bunch of symptoms many of which would be explicable by poor microcirculation / poor oxygen delivery to tissues / microclots (or perhaps pseudohypoxia due to mitochondrial dysfunction, but that's a topic for another post).

 

Also, such a treatment would need to be cycled, no? Since fibrin does play a role in wound healing, angiogenesis, and so forth, right?

Thanks.

 

Edit: I have also found articles suggesting that arginine and vitamins A, D, and E either increase plasminogen or decrease tPAI so they should help too.

Edited by StevesPetRat, 14 June 2014 - 12:15 PM.

[StevesPetRat]

Anyone? Bueller?

[8bitmore]

I researched serrapeptase quite a lot in connection with endometriosis for a family member - there did not seem to be any in vivo data on the fibrin aspect when I last had serious search - yet the anecdotal and in vitro data is so encouraging that I would suggest a pro-active combination of serrapeptase/turmeric/ginkgo-biloba/l-arginine/modified-citrus-pectin and grape seed extract, you are almost guaranteed to see some effect on the micro-circulation and galectin-3 levels. I agree reg. need to cycle the serrapeptase, I would personally do 4 days on 3 days off cycle as a starting point.

[StevesPetRat]

Hey, great, thank you. I will try that stack, maybe using pycnogenol instead of ginkgo as it gives me a rash.

[studentlost]

Have you looked into acetyl-l-carnitine? It has a lot of support for improving Peyronie's disease, and fibrin is critical in the development of Peyronie's. I think it would be worth looking into.

[rwac]

Aspirin might be worth looking into.

 

High-Dose Aspirin Is Required to Influence Plasma Fibrin Network Structure in Patients With Type 1 Diabetes

[studentlost]

Not sure why Dolph disagrees, but here is some literature--decide for yourself.

 

"Clinical research suggests that Peyronie’s disease represents an aberration of localized wound healing. Fibrin deposition is one of the initial consequences of microvascular injury, and fibrin has been localized in the tunical tissue in most plaques, some years after development of the disease"

http://www.ncbi.nlm....les/PMC1473022/

 

"Deposition of fibrin in plaque tissue is consistent with the hypothesis that repetitive microvascular injury results in fibrin deposition in the tissue space and has served to provide insights into the pathophysiology of Peyronie's disease. We propose a model that accounts for the clinical and biological features of Peyronie's disease."

http://www.ncbi.nlm..../pubmed/8976287

 

"Acetyl-L-carnitine, 1 g twice daily, was compared with tamoxifen in a randomized study of 48 patients. With a short follow-up, the patients who received acetyl-L-carnitine had greater decreases in penile pain and plaque size, with fewer adverse effects, compared with those who received tamoxifen"

 http://www.ncbi.nlm....les/PMC1473022/

 

"because fibrin persists in the plaque tissue, we hypothesize that fibrin may play a key role in the pathogenesis of human PD."

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/12780843

 

"Acetyl-L-carnitine was significantly more effective than tamoxifen in reducing pain and in inhibiting disease progression. Acetyl-L-carnitinereduced penile curvature significantly, while tamoxifen did not; both drugs significantly reduced plaque size. Tamoxifen induced significantly more side-effects than acetyl-L-carnitine."

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/11446848