17 replies to this topic

[Matt]

Dont worry... Its just a test!

One of the answers that come from some religious people that I really hate " its just a test! " I was part of a little discussion in a thread about god, prayers and priorities if there were a god.

I see all these people saying that god saved me or one of my family members etc... ( these are people from the western world who are well off, fed well and generally looked after ) and it was all a test but because I believed in god so I was saved.

So I mentioned what makes you think god would give priority to you and not the millions of kids dying over in poor countries every year. Im still waiting for the answers...

They did say that god is testing the people in africa and poor parts of the world... Now I mean that is horrible! but gee... since its 'god' that is doing the testing it must be 'ok' ? [:o]

What going on in these religious peoples minds ? Any examples you have of irrational thought by religious people?

Edited by Matt, 15 July 2005 - 11:21 PM.

[Infernity]

My, my there are plenty of more examples, I mean, nothing is rational once you look up to the eyes of 'God'.

Well, one local expert to the tsunami whom has ratification as an expert on this, claimed in public, it still should have been because the females were too wanton for God's willing.

Man, and people just believe it! Why? because he is an 'expert'...

Yours truthfully
~Infernity

[justinb]

Any examples you have of irrational thought by religious people?

They are synonymous to me.

[jaydfox]

Any examples you have of irrational thought by religious people?

They are synonymous to me.

You should strive to see them as strongly correlated. I think you'll get along better in the world.

[DJS]

Im still waiting for the answers...

Its simple really. The starving people in 3rd world nations are heathens who worship a heathen God. Therefore the "real God" (ie, the Christian God) is punishing them for their sins.

Same thing with the Tsunami. Obviously there was a great deal of sin taking place in Thailand and God had to come and wash away their sins. ---------- and yes, for the record I have heard Christians (people in my family say stuff like this). [:o]

[Infernity]

Yeah, Don, as I said, err perhaps you should impact your religious people in the family to, well just explain them what it seems you have done here pretty good, you know, of where did God come from, etcetera. Perhaps let them read The Da Vinci Code.
Force them )

Yours truthfully
~Infernity

[DJS]

Any examples you have of irrational thought by religious people?

Where to start...










Falwell-Robertson-Bin Laden Quiz

[Cyto]

Same thing with the Tsunami. Obviously there was a great deal of sin taking place in Thailand and God had to come and wash away their sins. ---------- and yes, for the record I have heard Christians (people in my family say stuff like this).

Thats horrible!

[Utnapishtim]

meanwhile an absolutely shocking discovery was reported in the Baltimore Sun today..... Who would have thught?????? [sfty]

Michael Stroh

SUN STAFF

Praying for someone who is ill and preparing to undergo a risky medical procedure appears to have no effect on the patient's future health.

That's the finding of one of the largest scientific investigations of the power of prayer conducted to date. Scientists said the study, published today in The Lancet, will undoubtedly renew debates over whether prayer has a measurable effect on illness and even whether it's a suitable subject of scientific inquiry.

For the study, researchers at Duke University recruited nearly 750 people undergoing heart-related procedures. Religious groups of different denominations were then randomly assigned to pray for the health of half the volunteers. The other half received no organized prayers.

[susmariosep]

Analyzing the OP.

In this thread of Matt, we have here a good OP topic for analysis of content and style.

First, we will give a number each to what appears to be a separate concern in the OP, then we will collect similar concerns together.

1. Dont worry... Its just a test!

2 .One of the answers that come from some religious people that I really hate " its just a test! " 

3. I was part of a little discussion in a thread about god, prayers and priorities  if there were a god.

4. I see all these people saying that god saved me or one of my family members etc... ( these are people from the western world who are well off, fed well and generally looked after ) 

5. and it was all a test but because I believed I am ok.

6. So I mentioned what makes you think god would give priority to you and not the millions of kids dying over in poor countries every year. Im still waiting for the answers...

7. They did say that god is testing the people in africa and poor parts of the world...

8. Now I mean that is horrible!  but gee...  since its 'god' that is doing the testing it must be 'ok' ?  [:o]

9. What going on in these religious peoples minds ?  Any examples you have of irrational thought by religious people?

Now, let's arrange the sentences as numbered into an attempted logical regrouping, thus:

1. Dont worry... Its just a test![/SIZE]

2 .One of the answers that come from some religious people that I really hate " its just a test! " 

5. and it was all a test but because I believed I am ok.

7. They did say that god is testing the people in africa and poor parts of the world...

8. Now I mean that is horrible!  but gee...  since its 'god' that is doing the testing it must be 'ok' ?  [:o]

3. I was part of a little discussion in a thread about god, prayers and priorities  if there were a god.

4. I see all these people saying that god saved me or one of my family members etc... ( these are people from the western world who are well off, fed well and generally looked after ) 

6. So I mentioned what makes you think god would give priority to you and not the millions of kids dying over in poor countries every year. Im still waiting for the answers...

9. What going on in these religious peoples minds ?  Any examples you have of irrational thought by religious people?

See my next post.


Susma

[JMorgan]

You've heard the phrase, seeing is believing.... Well, today I offer a new one:

Believing is seeing.

Because once you have faith, you can see things and hear things as you want them to be. But to everyone else, it's still just bulls**t.

[susmariosep]

Redisplaying the OP.


Here is the OP of Matt again, but we will re-order the groups of sentences thus: Matt-2, Matt-1, then Matt-3, as follow below:

3. I was part of a little discussion in a thread about god, prayers and priorities  if there were a god.

4. I see all these people saying that god saved me or one of my family members etc... ( these are people from the western world who are well off, fed well and generally looked after ) 

6. So I mentioned what makes you think god would give priority to you and not the millions of kids dying over in poor countries every year. Im still waiting for the answers...

1. Dont worry... Its just a test!

2 .One of the answers that come from some religious people that I really hate " its just a test! " 

5. and it was all a test but because I believed I am ok.

7. They did say that god is testing the people in africa and poor parts of the world...

8. Now I mean that is horrible!  but gee...  since its 'god' that is doing the testing it must be 'ok' ?  [:o]

9. What going on in these religious peoples minds ?  Any examples you have of irrational thought by religious people?

Now, let us rewrite the OP -- but I have to be quick because I have to leave now for office, in the following brief paragraph:

I met a lot of people in comfortable circumsances, believers in God. I asked them why there are so many suffering peoples, in particular babies, in Africa and also in other backward regions of the world, but even in our own land. They tell me that God is testing them. Now, isn't that terribly insane?

I will be back later in the evening.

Susma

[JMorgan]

I almost dread where all this analysis is going...

Tell me Susma, if I were to say "I like apples better than oranges." Would you dissect that statement too? And number my sentences for reference and cross-reference? Would you seek to know WHAT kind of apples? (I like red delicious if you want to know.) Or could you simply accept the statement as fact that I like apples and dislike oranges? (Maybe you'd want to know the universal sense of what it means to like something?) Or perhaps you'd like to analyze it as a metaphor, trying to ascertain why I would post my fondness for the red fruit in a religion forum?

If you wanted to know more about apples, you can just ask me. Likewise, if you want to know more about Matt's opinion (or question) you could just ask him.

I've grown up in a religious household and still go through all the motions of going to church to make my life more comfortable. (Since arguing about it is alot more painful than actually going.) I haven't heard too many people say "it's just a test" but I have heard other ridiculous statements....

Like the one where September 11th happened because our nation turned it's eyes away from God, and that it was a "wake-up call" (a phrase I've heard far too often) for us to turn back to God and repent.

Now, I believe that there is no way to know the truth for sure. There may be a God, there may not be a God, but I am increasingly convinced that religion (especially extrememe fundamentalism) will tear this world apart if we aren't able to connect it quickly enough. We wouldn't be dealing with terrorism right now if it wasn't for the damn Christians and Muslims who hate each other. Personally, we need more of the kind of Christians and Muslims who like each other.

Sorry for the rant... and no offense, Susma. I was just picking on you because it's fun.

[justinb]

You should strive to see them as strongly correlated. I think you'll get along better in the world.

I entertain their childish fantasies. Especially if I am interested in correlating their schedule with mine.

[Infernity]

LOL Joel, You are cracking me! [g:)]

Yours truthfully
~Infernity

[amar]

The power of prayer for healing? The mind seems to have an impact on physical health, as shown in the movie "What the bleep do we know" but for some reason the prayer experiment didn't work. I wonder why that was. Some religions are like demons in angel's clothing, Christianity included.

[susmariosep]

Learning is fun, that’s the idea.

[quote=Malchiah}Sorry for the rant... and no offense, Susma. I was just picking on you because it's fun.
[/quote]

I have a confession to make: I am here for the fun, that’s the unspoken drive, but explicitly I am after learning here. When we put learning and fun together which we should all of us here, then that is the best combination.

Honestly, I don’t mind at all being picked on if the picker acquires some good learning as he picks.


Matt has not returned to his thread; I wish he would drop by to visit his thread, and see whether I had done him justice with my rewriting of his OP, according to my criteria of BEC writing, i.e., brief, easy, and clear.

[quote]
I met a lot of people in comfortable circumsances, believers in God. I asked them why there are so many suffering peoples, in particular babies, in Africa and also in other backward regions of the world, but even in our own land. They tell me that God is testing them. Now, isn't that terribly insane?

[/quote]

I like to impart a new lesson to Matt, about religion, namely, religion is not a rational behavior of man, but an emotional one.

So when you, Matt, get disgusted with religious people telling themselves that less lucky (read that, favored by God) people are just being tested by God, you should not stop at the rational or irrational content of their utterance, but you should consider its emotional import.

And what is that emotional import?

I am also trying to figure out, but tentatively I would say that religious people who are not being tested by God are on the one hand also fearful that they might be also and eventually undergo some testing; and they might be telling people who are currently being tested, to continue with their emotion of hope and trust, notwithstanding.


I myself find that kind of emotional sugar-coating also unacceptable, both from the standpoint of religious people and from the standpoint of their God -- assuming that He is around.

But that's precisely what I would consider an insight into religious behavior being emotional instead of rational.
Susma

[susmariosep]

Regrets and apologies to Matt here.


As I said in my thread on:

Poll on Susma to leave, I need help to make one on myself.

http://www.imminst.o...730

http://www.imminst.o...730

(Page 4 of that thread... please.)

I am sorry for the posts I wrote here, my regrets and apologies to Matt.

Susma