6 replies to this topic

[StevesPetRat]

There are a variety of threads discussing the exogenous sugar Neu5GC, but none of them mention this recent study:

Prevalence of Anti-Neu5Gc Antibodies in Patients with Hypothyroidism
Phaedra Eleftheriou, et al

N-Glycolylneuraminic acid (Neu5Gc) is a sialic acid synthesized by animals, but not by humans or birds. However, it can be incorporated in human cells and can trigger immune response. In the present study, we detected anti-Neu5Gc antibodies in samples of the general population and of patients suffering from hypothyroidism/Hashimoto’s disease, which is known to have autoimmune origin. Methods. Antibodies were measured using enzyme-immunosorbent techniques. Results. Serum anti-Neu5Gc IgG antibodies were higher in patients with hypothyroidism (mean: 14.8 ± 15.9 μg/mL, median: 10.0 μg/mL, P = 0.0003, Mann-Whitney) and even higher in the group with Hashimoto’s thyroiditis (mean: 31.1 ± 16.3 μg/mL, median: 27.2 μg/mL, P < 0.0001, Mann-Whitney) compared to the general population (mean: 5.3 ± 4.7 μg/mL, median : 4 μg/mL). All anti-TPO positive samples had anti-Neu5Gc antibody concentration higher than the mean value of the general population while anti-TPO concentration was increased as anti-Neu5Gc concentration increased. Low concentrations of IgA and IgM antibodies were measured in both general population and patient groups. Conclusion. The increased values of anti-Neu5Gc antibodies in patients with hypothyroidism/Hashimoto’s disease and the correlation of anti-TPO incidence with increased anti-Neu5Gc concentration raise the possibility of an association between anti-Neu5Gc antibody development and autoimmune hypothyroidism.

This seems pretty damning, though I have two caveats: 1) it isn't the most high impact journal and 2) the extremely high variance in the hypothyroid group indicates that there will be some cases for which these antibodies are not present (in elevated numbers).

Another interesting point is that other great apes naturally produce Neu5GC (and therefore do not react and produce antibodies to it) and also do not seem susceptible to autoimmune hypothyroidism:

Spoiler

Thyroid autoantibodies are rare in nonhuman great apes and hypothyroidism cannot be attributed to thyroid autoimmunity.
Aliesky H1, Courtney CL, Rapoport B, McLachlan SM.
Abstract
The great apes include, in addition to Homo, the genera Pongo (orangutans), Gorilla (gorillas), and Pan, the latter comprising two species, P. troglodytes (chimpanzees) and P. paniscus (bonobos). Adult-onset hypothyroidism was previously reported in 4 individual nonhuman great apes. However, there is scarce information on normal serum thyroid hormone levels and virtually no data for thyroid autoantibodies in these animals. Therefore, we examined thyroid hormone levels and TSH in all nonhuman great ape genera including adults, adolescents, and infants. Because hypothyroidism in humans is commonly the end result of thyroid autoimmunity, we also tested healthy and hypothyroid nonhuman great apes for antibodies to thyroglobulin (Tg), thyroid peroxidase (TPO), and the TSH receptor (TSHR). We established a thyroid hormone and TSH database in orangutans, gorillas, chimpanzees, and bonobos (447 individuals). The most striking differences are the greatly reduced free-T4 and free-T3 levels in orangutans and gorillas vs chimpanzees and bonobos, and conversely, elevated TSH levels in gorillas vs Pan species. Antibodies to Tg and TPO were detected in only 2.6% of adult animals vs approximately 10% in humans. No animals with Tg, TPO, or TSHR antibodies exhibited thyroid dysfunction. Conversely, hypothyroid nonhuman great apes lacked thyroid autoantibodies. Moreover, thyroid histology in necropsy tissues was similar in euthyroid and hypothyroid individuals, and lymphocytic infiltration was absent in 2 hypothyroid animals. In conclusion, free T4 and free T3 are lower in orangutans and gorillas vs chimpanzees and bonobos, the closest living human relatives. Moreover, thyroid autoantibodies are rare and hypothyroidism is unrelated to thyroid autoimmunity in nonhuman great apes.

I also found this study related to Kawasaki disease, which sounds fun but actually, believe it or not, sucks.

Unfortunately I am unaware of anyone offering commercial anti-Neu5GC antibody testing. It could make a huge difference in terms of dietary choices. It is present in milk, though I wonder if, as a sugar, it could be degraded by fermentation.

Thoughts? I am not out to make anybody a vegan; if I had those antibodies, I would probably just start eating more fish and free range chicken organs.

[StevesPetRat]

Does not look like it is degraded by fermentation into cheese, so I don't see why it wouldn't be in yogurt either 
 Screen Shot 2015-02-18 at 2.09.04 PM.png   146.18KB   2 downloads
All fruits and vegetables tested (Orange, lemon, lime, banana, strawberry, peach, apple, carrot, cucumber, lettuce, tomato, potato, olive oil, tofu) had 0 Neu5GC and Neu5AC as you might expect.

[FunkOdyssey]

Great topic.  Until the Neu5gc antibody tests are available, we'll all be living in fear, speculating as to whether or not we are affected by this issue.  Paul Jaminet published some excellent blog posts on Neu5Gc recently:

 

http://perfecthealth...n-disease-part/

http://perfecthealth...hypothyroidism/

Edited by FunkOdyssey, 18 February 2015 - 09:42 PM.

[StevesPetRat]

Great topic.  Until the Neu5gc antibody tests are available, we'll all be living in fear, speculating as to whether or not we are affected by this issue.  Paul Jaminet published some excellent blog posts on Neu5Gc recently:
 
http://perfecthealth...n-disease-part/
http://perfecthealth...hypothyroidism/

WOW! These are fantastic. Thanks!
So much to think about!
Like how does ferret cheese taste? And where can I buy free-range, grass-fed capuchin?
But also, Neu5Ac as brain food just slipped under the radar -- is cheddar cheese the ultimate nootropic?

As far as living in fear, if 85% of us have the antibodies as Jaminet states, I suppose it's better safe than sorry. Going to cut out all mammal meats and dairy except my daily dose of colostrum and see how that feels.

[Chupo]

Neu5GC has been discussed for years in the vegan community. It's like the gluten of the paleo world. You could always get your milk from a new world monkey I suppose, if you're lactose tolerant that is. One thing I like about Jaminet is that he isn't afraid to change his recommendations based on new evidence.

Edited by Chupo, 19 February 2015 - 07:12 AM.

[StevesPetRat]

from: Biju et al
Table 2. Sialic acid secretion of three consecutive days in bovine and goat milk
mg/L         Cow     Buffalo    Cross(breed) cow     Goat milk
Mean
Neu5Ac   218.3       260                296.7               62.3
Neu5Gc   2.02        6.17                 5.13                68.9

 

I've been drinking and eating only goat dairy products... blerg

 

Edit: If anyone has any information on the lifetime of sialic acid in the cell membrane, it would be super awesome. Thanks.

Edited by StevesPetRat, 19 February 2015 - 06:55 PM.

[ta5]

It's been 8 years since the last post here. What's the status of Neu5Gc now?

 

I see recent studies saying: 

"N-glycolylneuraminic acid (Neu5Gc) is a non-human Sia capable of potentiating cancer and inflammation in the human body."

"Red meat-derived sialic acid (Sia), N-glycolylneuraminic acid (Neu5Gc), promotes the risk of carcinoma and inflammation"

 

I really don't want this to be true.