20 replies to this topic

[jasen]

BACKGROUND

Like many others on this forum I have ADD as well, meaning I tend to jump around, so please just try to be a little patient.

I have used nootropics ("NOOPS") on and off for a few years now, which I can genuinely notice an overall difference/increase in my cognitive abilities. Even when I stop using them for a while I still retain some residual smartz.

I don't mind taking 20 - 100 + pills a day, especially when I can realize the benefit. HOWEVER my biggest problem lies with control, I have none, and I don't like it.

Let me explain this another way, lets say my BrainPower ("BP") is currently 141 and I start on a well planned stack similar to LifeMirage's and my BP increases to say 175 over the next few months (this is an example for the sake of simplification and BP is my politically correct term for IQ).

Wow, I feel really smart, great, focused, etc., I can even solve some of the world's problems, but hey I still got that ADD thing going on, whereas I forget to refill/order my NOOPS. Sh*t, I hope I can get them fast because over the next few days my BP drops to 155, which is still a lot better then I started with,

but, THE BIG BUT,

I no longer have the enlightenment that I did at 175, oh I remember what it was like though. Now I feel stupid, albeit 15 points on the plus side of giftedness, this doesn't stop me from calling myself Bubba Gump at this point.

Its similar to being poor, then rich, then poor again, except being poor the 2nd time around is far worse because you KNOW the difference.

As I stated this is about control, to maintain the gifts of the increased intelligence I have obtained, I must rely on SEVERAL people:

the drug makers
the distributors
the mail/ups carriers,
my own cash
my government on whatever whim of a new law that is/will affect my ability to freely purchase these products.


RANT #1 (BUT STILL ON TOPIC)

I have homes in Michigan and Texas, the difference between these 2 states is incredible, I can't even imagine some of you who live in even more controlled countries.

As of recent it is more difficult for me to buy CO-ADVIL here in Texas then it is to get my script of 180 10mg tablets of branded Adderall (which is a schedule 2 drug). That's just pitiful, oh but its in our best interest as we don't want those damn kids making meth, it seems like it would be even easier to fake ADD and get some Dexedrine? If I am not mistaken Dexedrine is straight meth, a smaller dose but very pure.

Hell when I was 15 if I wasn't allowed to buy co-advil when I tried, and they told me NO cause "it can be used to make meth" that's EXACTLY what I would have THEN went home to find out how, and then make some - nothing like giving me the idea -(see my ADD is getting me sidetracked).


MY IMPOSSIBLE GOAL

I plan to figure out/design/develop a way to make these increases in my intelligence PERMENANT, whereas I take the drugs, grow my BrainPower, then I all done. Call it a cure of my control issue, or my gump-ness, oh wait we don't do that in pharmacology, we only make drugs which have recurring revenue streams, oops - me bad forgot!

So my ridiculous plan is this

To use NOOPS and other means(future post for any one interested) to jump my BrainPower to lets say 300 (so I have lofty goals), my reasoning is that if I am operating with 300+ brainpower I will have a much easier time solving this dilemma of mine (Zoolander should appreciate my simple plan of attack/hack).

Thereby doing the impossible and "going beyond my GENETIC POTENTIAL" that IS purportedly genetically fixed.


RANT #2 (WAY OF TOPIC)

Hey yo - JUSTINB who set my limit, - GOD, Darwin, or my Mommy, if it was my Mommy did she ask Daddy or did she come up with MY maximum GENETIC POTENTIAL on her own?'

Its a good thing I didn't live 100 years ago I would have really had a hard time with all those experts telling me that my new and brilliant idea of talking with someone in Australia from an object that fits in my hand was just outrageous explaining to me "its just physics man - ITS NOT POSSIBLE, we don't really know why OTHER THEN BECAUSE WE SAY ITS NOT, IT JUST ISN'T SO DON'T BOTHER THINKING ABOUT IT- you dumb dreaming idiot".

Sorry I am new to this forum and got the joy of reading 5 pages of many helpful members providing logical and reasonable examples and explanations all the while being argued with by 1 self-centered bipolar boy. What a waste time.


RESEARCH, PHARAMACHOLOGY, AND IN NEED OF LIFEMIRAGE'S BRILLIANCE

I have taken acetyl-l-carnitine 400mg (8cc) in a d5w 250cc IV Drip over 30 minutes twice now. The affect is awesome, taking 4 of my 500mg tablets doesn't even come close in comparison.

So LifeMirage, can you help me with your wisdom, I want to use any/all the other primary NOOPS via IV and/or worst case in an IM Injection.

I haven't yet studied enough of the pharmacology on them to answer my own questions and since you have the proven knowledge and experience I would love your help/input/assistance.

My initial thoughts (keep in mind I am purely guessing) are :

1. Aniracetam would be best used in IM Injection mixed with some form of oil/glycerol, or maybe lidocaine would be simple enough. With Aniracetam's longer half-life it seems a muscle might be good place for superior distribution?

2. Piracetam, Procaine, GPC, Huperzine A, Pyritinol, Oxiracetam, mixed with distilled/sterile water then all added to d5w 250cc drip for 30 - 60 minutes, or maybe do them separate with a heparin flush between drips? As with acetyl-l-caritine, the dosage would be much smaller.

3. Last question, is there some solution that can quickly break the blood/brain barrier easily that I could use as the carrier for any of the above? Just thinking out loud, if more pure product was able to get to brain maybe it would demonstrate better results?

I plan to log all results for those who may be interested. Further when I do achieve the impossible, which I will, I plan to publish all my research in the public domain, since I don't need that recurring revenue stream. I will post here as well so you all can be free.

I realize I have big goals but if I don't do it someone else will and were back to my problem 'control' I don't have the patience to wait for anyone else, or should I say why do I need to?

Jasen

[exigentsky]

I wish you the best of luck at achieving 300% brain power.

[enemy]

Hey jasen, do you know any guys named adam, by any chance? Guys living in your head, maybe?

[fitos]

Let me explain this another way, lets say my BrainPower ("BP") is currently 141 and I start on a well planned stack similar to LifeMirage's and my BP increases to say 175 over the next few months (this is an example for the sake of simplification and BP is my politically correct term for IQ).

Have you ever noticed some "BP" changes while on nootropics? I mean, any mesuarable ones?

Lifemirage, i never read you reference any IQ increases from your personal experience (i believe you want to do some tests on subjects for your book?).
The only article i remember reading about IQ increses was with creatine.

PS (to jasen):
It's your life.. maybe your findings will help some others, with more emerging needs
So, good luck.

[jasen]

enemy - no adam sorry, cybill maybe but no adam.

[jasen]

da sense - nootropic abuse you say, I doubt it as with my iv of acetyl-l-carnitine it is much lower dosage they I am sure you take. Just a means of more efficient delivery, plus less tramatic to my stomach. Good site reference though, thanks!

[sally]

Jasen-

Are you administering this drip to yourself single-handedly?

[wannafulfill]

Most of the nootropics we take are completely orally bioavailable. This idea is begging for death.

EDIT - This idea clearly shows unrealistic and dangerous expectations for nootropics. This is the type of misconception that occurs when 'brain power', intelligence, and learning are repositioned from the realm of rigorous and disciplined reading, memorization, and practice to the area of pharmacology. Taking it one step further, I think this type of thinking (though this jackass gives us an extreme and dangerous example), is an outgrowth of a forum discourse in which will power, discipline, and proven learning techniques are sorely lacking. We shouldn't assume everyone has exhausted these more traditional methods to increase their "cognitive functioning". I'd really love intelligent disagreements with these ideas or if possible, how to correct these forum imbalances that probably exist.

[lifemission]

Jasen,
I would read up THOUROUGHLY before doing this with anything, to think that IV or IM injection would somehow achieve permanent results is not founded, all drugs are absorbed and processed differently. While you might achieve better instant effects and a likely rush (especially with something like ALCAR) you might do more harm than good in the long run.
Procaine in particular, I'm pretty sure that I read that this MUST be taken orally to attain nootropic benefits, otherwise I think it's just a local anesthetic (Correct me if I'm wrong.) and thats just ONE example.
BTW, Dexedrine is Dextroamphetamine.. Methamphetamine is a another beast altogether. The prescription namebrand for Meth is "Desoxyn" and is rarely prescribed anymore. It's the most addictive and abused amphetamine.
Nowadays they prescribe what you take.. Adderall which is a mixture of Amphetamine salts. Adderall has several different forms of amphetamine>
EACH TABLET CONTAINS 5mg 10mg 20mg 30mg
Dextroamphetamine Saccharate 1.25 mg 2.5 mg 5 mg 7.5 mg
Amphetamine Aspartate 1.25 mg 2.5 mg 5 mg 7.5 mg
Dextroamphetamine Sulfate USP 1.25 mg 2.5 mg 5 mg 7.5 mg
Amphetamine Sulfate USP 1.25 mg 2.5 mg 5 mg 7.5 mg
Total amphetamine base equivalence 3.13 mg 6.3 mg 12.6 mg 18.8 mg

If you are trying to raise your "BP/IQ" then you might consider gradually ramping down your dosage in order to get off of this neurotoxic drug and replace it with some things like pyritinol, vincamine, centrophenoxine and other nootropics. Staring with a well balanced diet and exercise (yeah sounds boring and lackluster but the body is'nt really used to these white powders, good food has the right packaging to properly deliver)
Depending on how long you have been taking this drug, getting off/over it may be very difficult.
I have gone through an amphetamine habit in my past and it's hard to recover from, but it can be done.
I'm no doctor so don't go and stop cold turkey, this is just a suggestion. I don't think that anyone can handle taking adderall forever so it might be a good idea to consider dealing with that, before you start with all of the nootropics.
I dunno, maybe adderall is just the only answer for some folks, but I don't really believe that myself.. Starting with nutrition is #1, then go from there..
Maybe I'm just jealous that you have a script for it, he he, but it seems like you're having some really illogical, maniacal ideas about what to do with nootropics etc. Come'on man... needles are'nt magic, slow down before you really F*** yourself up.
As for the ADD... no offense but thesedays most people to some degree can be easily diagnosed with ADD, it's from the overstimulated society and crappy sugar and exitotoxin filled diet that we are presented. It's all in how a person chooses to deal with it and who they choose to believe..
I must have it myself...I'm supposed to be working instead of posting a novel here, arrgh.
Namaste'

[xanadu]

Using needles is a very dangerous thing to do. It also tends to bring unwanted attention to this website. I agree with the previous poster, go to bluelight or some similar place if you are into that. It is not possible to pernanently increase your mental functioning, as far as everyone else has been able to discover. Using substances in larger amounts or by IV will not increase the effects, it may in fact reduce any benefits you were getting.

[losty]

Wannafulfil

Definitely, nootropics are just tools and not the be all and end all.

I find they help me to get down to the incredible amount of mental work required to achieve my goals.

That state of deep concentration where you are completely absorbed in the task at hand.

"Effortless effort"

I find I can maintain this state alot longer now with nootropics.

[enemy]

Bump. (This is great comedy.)

[jasen]

1. I didn't mean to offend anyone in regards to "needles" or "IV therarpy".

2. No I am not doing this single handed, by myself, that would make me pretty damn talented if I could, still wouldn't but talented all the same.

3. Any and all IV therapy that I would ever consider to have administered is done professionally through my doctor.

4. This post was my attempt to explain a concept/thought that I would like to pursue if it had any validity. - Meaning in the end it must have some logical reasoning behind it.

5. Yes I was mistaken I mixed up Dexedrine and Desoxyn thanks for correcting I was sidetracked on my rant - (emotional, it happens) I was prescribed both at different times - hated them.

6. As for Adderall, yeah it has been with me for a long time. However the only reason is with everything that exist (that I know of) for ADD it has been the most effective, which mean about 40-50 %. --- But nothing is worse then stratera(sp), that shits evil (for me at least).

Some idiot doc gave me effexor for my ADD back in 97, that was an experience, I guess those who are not depressed or alergic get an ride, nothing joyed about it though.

Ritilan sucks unless brand, even then its crash is worse then none at all, I was never good enough to take it before it was out of my system. Concerta is okay, nothing special maybe 35% benefit.

Generic Adderall sucks, could be just me but it makes me itch, so I get very focused on ITCHING. -- Oh yea whether anyone knows it - when Richwood Pharm. (makers of adderall before Shire bought them) manufacturing plant in mexico blew up in the late 90's adderall has never been made the same, something changed on purpose or lost in explosion I don't know.

Further as a general rule I take 2 tablets 3x daily, but only for 3 weeks, then I stop it for 2 - 3 weeks and use L-Tyronise and a little provigil. I do this mainly because the change in my system seems to make all of it much more effective for the ADD. I can now take 1500 mg of just L-Tyronise and focus fairly well, I do believe it related to switching.

Thankfully one of the positive things I get from ADD is I do not have an addictive personality. The only withdrawal that I have gotten from flushing Adderall from my system (which I highly recommend at least quarterly) is very tired first day off and larger appetite, but I rarely experience either anymore with what I now do. As for getting rid of Adderall, that's the plan the same as any drug. I want to rely on nothing. As far as ADD goes I think the simplest test is can you take Adderall to help you sleep? Without it I don't sleep as well, I can take 20mg at 11pm and be sleeping awesome by 12am.

7. I wrote my post the way I did because it was the best way I could get the mess/concepts out of my mind onto paper.-=AM I really as delusional as I sound, and think I can jump my IQ to 300. NO, but that wasn't my point.

8. I never said in any way that I think that taking IV nootropics would make anything permanent, re-read the post if you are confused by this.

What I am proposing is the best available method for using nootropics to provide the most gain --- short term/temporarily to assist in my attempts at solving a permanent solution. IE use the magic wish to give me the wisdom to be a wish maker. Stupid analogy, but thats the point.

9. Nor do I plan on doing anything that is more "risk" then what is already done by the members of this board who take any nootropics.

10. I am coming from the stand of researching this in a controlled environment. I could have already simply called my local compounding pharmacist and went forward but I would prefer to look at every angle. In addition I REALLY WANT TO hear what LifeMirage has to say because of his knowledge in NOOTROPICS. I have comprehensive knowledge with antibiotics and other meds, but not these drugs.

11. Lastly, what I propose done correctly in a controlled environment is far safer then oral ingestion of pills (just on your stomach alone). Any med is toxic to the body in some ways, nooptropics or at least Piracetam appear to be one of the least toxic chemicals known to exist.

Worst case is either they will not be as effective or the same, which in that case I wouldn't waste my time.

I feel that this will most likely be the case with Piracetam, since it seems to have a 100% absorption in the blood which would make an IV a mute point.

12. Again I didn't mean to offend anyone nor am I needle junkie, reckless, or just plain crazy.

Further I never did any RECREATIONAL drugs in my life other then pot (when I was younger) WHICH DOES exactly opposite of what I desire to achieve. I did have some acid slipped to me once but I didn't choose to take it. Never done coke either I figured I would like it so why tease myself, with something horrible, and gee I would've been self medicating who knew?

I hope I made a little more sense.
j

Edited by jasen, 12 September 2005 - 12:18 AM.

[sally]

By the way- what is "bump"?

I was really asking about the drips because in some cases ( viruses for instance), drips of C or glutathione for example can be really good. They are of course expensive, so I was wondering if Jasen knew a way to do this for himself. I do understand that its not something to undertake lightly ( if at all) to be sure. Mainly curious.

Thanks.

[worldeater]

I'm at a loss for words.

[jasen]

worldeater - me too from your loss that is?! lol

[jasen]

Sally, your line of thinking is exactly what got me ever considering this in the first place. Lets just say a wife with chronic Lyme for 8 years and several PIC lines later for many months at a time gives one lots of knowledge.

So to answer your question yes it is expensive what I am proposing, however if its something that proves to be benificial and viable and safe of course, I have ways to assist in bringing the cost of such a thing to a reasonable level.

First thing first though.... --

j

[exigentsky]

"By the way- what is "bump"? "

Writting "Bump" is a simple way to bring a particular thread to the forefront when one is too lazy to provide meaningful insight.

EDIT: No offense was meant.

Edited by exigentsky, 12 September 2005 - 07:11 AM.

[sally]

OK-

I apparently need more nootropics.

[outsider]

If you want permanent changes I don't think nootropics will do much good, not deep enough. The only way that I can see would be reprogramming your subconscious. You could do it with ibogaine or ayahuasca (healing spychedelics). But misuse of those substances could be dangerous. Can't mix it with SSRI or other drugs. Can't take it if you have certain medical condition etc.