21 replies to this topic

[Diesel]

After a traumatic event 6 years ago, my emotions vanished and my long-term memory became so shit. I feel dead inside. I don't respond to music anymore. I'm incapable of falling in love. My best friend died in a car accident then another died of stroke 2 months later. I felt nothing for them. I haven't grieved their deaths.

I don't feel human anymore and life seems extremely bland. The only things that help are Gabapentin/Pregabalin. They give me mild fleeting emotions but later induce severe depression as a rebound.

Recently, I came across reports that NSI-189 make people over-emotional. I cannot acquire that substance, but it seems to work via increasing hippocampal size and neurogenesis.

Lithium/Valproate are known to increase neurotrophic factors and hippocampal size, but I react horribly to them.

Montelukast induces rapid hippocampal neurogenesis. Is it worth a try?

Antidepressants were useless in my case. I don't have access to stuff like threshold dose psychedelics or MDMA and probably won't try them even if I do.

Do you have other suggestions?

Much thanks.

[PeaceAndProsperity]

Please, I hate to say this and don't misunderstand me, but look before you are posting. I had a topic about literally 100% the same subject with multiple replies that could help you.

This thread is located here http://www.longecity...s-after-trauma/

One of the tags is "blunted emotions".

 

In this thread you will find that, at least for me, NSI-189 is not helpful - it was practically useless.

 

Sct. John's Wort SOMETIMES fully brings back my emotions, but this is very unreliable. Same with SAM-e, but even less reliable.

Pregnenolone is the most reliable, safe drug that I have found for bringing back my emotions - and trust me when I say that I've tried a LOT of different things. But even pregnenolone doesn't do it all.

 

In my case, it seems extreme exhaustion or fatigue makes me psychotic, thus giving me blunted emotions--I mean LITERALLY blunted emotions, not just a teenager's symbolic "not feeling anything"-- as well as visual disturbances and more.

Being very careful not to do too many things seems to work the best for me. Too rapid movements can even worsen my symptoms. Any stimulant seems to work for me.

[Diesel]

I've also tried a plethora of drugs and supplements over the past 6 years. I know exactly what you mean by derealization and a literally blunted affect.

I lost the fear response along all of my emotions and it put me in dangerous situations where I was too apathetic and fearless. Driving recklessly. Got in trouble with people I shouldn't get in trouble with. Yelling profanities in public places. It was bad but now I mentally inhibit my behavior.

Amitriptyline is about the only drug that helps my emotions consistently, but it's pretty mild at that. I'm currently taking it.

Unreliable things that induced transient emotions:
- Saint John's Wort. (Randomly)
- Gingko Biloba (really high dose).
- Glycine. (I too suspected prodormal schizophrenia.)
- ALA
- Levothyroxine (brought on my emotions for 2 weeks, but nothing more)
- Vincamin

I tried Naltrexone btw, both at low and very high doses. It does nothing - not even side effects. It's like I'm taking a sugar pill.

I'm immune to acute high dose of Tramadol. I can't feel any opioid effects. Immune to cannabis too. Normal D1 receptor function is needed to feel the opioid effect. D1 is hypofunctional in schizophrenia and those people need stimulants to feel opioids. 

I'll try Pregnanolone. Thanks for the suggestion.

[Sleepdealer]

Hi Diesel.

 

Montelukast sounds like a bet, if you can get it prescribed by your doctor, I guess. Otherwise you have NSI-189. It doesn't work for everyone, but there is a chance. Jaiho, a guy on here who also lives in Australia, who's also suffering from emotional anhedonia, has stated that he reaped some results from it in that department. How do you mean you can't acquire it?

 

I see that Kappa Opioid Receptor (KOR) Antagonists seem to show a lot of promise in the areas of anhedonia and depression, etc. (I haven't read into it that deeply myself yet). Maybe it's worth looking into it, see if it can do anything for you.

[Diesel]

Hi Diesel.

 

Montelukast sounds like a bet, if you can get it prescribed by your doctor, I guess. Otherwise you have NSI-189. It doesn't work for everyone, but there is a chance. Jaiho, a guy on here who also lives in Australia, who's also suffering from emotional anhedonia, has stated that he reaped some results from it in that department. How do you mean you can't acquire it?

 

I see that Kappa Opioid Receptor (KOR) Antagonists seem to show a lot of promise in the areas of anhedonia and depression, etc. (I haven't read into it that deeply myself yet). Maybe it's worth looking into it, see if it can do anything for you.

I believe that Amitriptyline works for me because it's a Trka/Trkb agonist. Probably the only direct agonist on the market for those neurotrophic receptors.

Also, the significant deterioration of my memory points towards hippocampal atrophy. Probably via chronic heightened cortisol release.

I already tried Cerebrolysin but I also reacted horribly to it. Same with Lithium and Valproate. I'm going to try Montelukast. If you guys have any other suggestions feel free to share.

[Sleepdealer]

7,8 Dihydroxyflavone might do something, but the support is on the light side, so to speak. Scroll down to schizophrenia and Retts syndrome: http://examine.com/s...hydroxyflavone/

 

Tht.co has it in their store I see.

 

Other than that, I'm waiting with great anticipation to hear how montelukast works out for you. Hopefully someone else has something more to contribute with that hasn't been covered.

[Diesel]

I'll leave Montelukast as a last resort option if all else fails. There are many horror anecdotal reports saying that it can induce permanent nasty side effects. I still consider it, though.

For the record, I suffer from the following conditions. Depression, anhedonia/apathy, excessive daytime sleepiness, and severely blunted affect. Basically a sleepy zombie.

All of them started simultaneously after the traumatic event. I did countless blood tests, MRIs, endocrine profile, immune tests, etc nothing is showing up. Doctors are puzzled and my psychiatrist just tells me to 'live with it' now.

Excessive daytime sleepiness:
Stims don't help at all. I discovered by accident that it responds to 30 mg Vincamine but only after adding 400 mg Pentoxifylline SR was I no longer having any problem with this.

Current Regimen:

150 mg Sertraline
50 mg Amitriptyline
60 mg Vincamine (I know about the DOPAC studies, but being awake is worth it)
800 mg Pentoxifylline
40 mg Olmesartan (For hypertension)

Nootropics/Supplements:
Omega 3 + 4.8 g Piracetam.
L-carnitine.
Centrum

Sublingual B-complex.

In case of not being able to stay awake (PRN):
Hydergine + Gingko Biloba + Caffeine (usually green tea).

[ceridwen]

Sounds like a thyroid problem to me. Have you been tested?

[ceridwen]

I've ordered Montelukast so if it arrives hope to be trying it soon.

[ceridwen]

Does Levothyroxine stop you feeling tired?Can take 6 weeks to work

[PeaceAndProsperity]

Well, doubtlessly it seems we're experiencing the very same thing in terms of psychosis (in the broadest sense).

 

Out of curiosity, do you also experience that:

1. All of your symptoms or almost all of them are bettered during stimulant withdrawal such as caffeine withdrawal, during the phase where one gets a headache and terrible tiredness?

2. Just even slightly doing something which requires energy, even talking, can worsen all symptoms and especially so that the tiredness can no longer be felt (i.e. there's an extremely fragile balance between the psychotic stage and the healthy stage)?

 

I'm glad you mentioned Naltrexone being useless as I was about to try it.

 

I don't think a shrunken hippocampus is the problem for us. Mind you that I tried NSI-189 for approx. 2 months, and it hardly did anything.

 

In my own case, I suspect genetic factors as my father is like myself in terms of being gone in his facial expressions, never really feeling pain, and more. Strangely, my father who constantly drank caffeine reports not having ever experienced caffeine withdrawal--this is very unusual. More strange, my father reports pregnenolone not being stimulating at all and not doing anything to him mentally apart from when he first took it and he experienced tiredness and sexual thoughts at night (he is in his 70s).

 

The blunted emotions allows me, like yourself, to do some odd things without feeling shame, fear or anything.

And being adults, more is expected from us.

Personally, though, I like not feeling petty emotions like fear and guilt. My problem is almost always I can't feel exhaustion or pain, which is supposed to help me abstain from doing certain things (such as exercising too much).

 

I've been like this constantly for over 10+ years, where it has worsened since I reached into my 20s. Though now at least I know that something is wrong, which I wasn't much aware of before.

 

Maybe we're experiencing hypomania? This is common if one is extremely exhausted.

Lithium could maybe help that? Lithium, as I've taken for over a week now, seems to have been a good purchase with slight benefits to my symptoms, but still far away from being as effective as pregnenolone.---

[Sleepdealer]

Once again I would like to mention that Jaiho, a member that you might have seen around here, reports positive results from NSI-189 and he also has suffered emotional anhedonia like you two. Now you have already mentioned that you can't acquire it Diesel. However, if in the future you would actually be able to, then by all means try it out, unless you have found something else that works for you. You and Ratherbeunknown might suffer the same symptoms, but the source mustn't necessarily be the exact same for each of your problems. Or Jaiho is just some lucky exception.

 

Anywho... Even if you don't experience the emotions, do you ever notice that you experience the physical reactions of those emotions? Like racing heartbeat, flushing, tension or anything like that, to relevant stimuli? Because there's something called alexithymia, where this phenomenon occurs, and some researchers mean that it could be a problem of the connections between the two brain hemispheres.

[Diesel]

As I mentioned before, my hormones are normal. I did the thyroid profile 4 times over the years. Countless blood tests and scans. Nothing is showing up. This is not an endocrine problem.
 

Out of curiosity, do you also experience that:

1. All of your symptoms or almost all of them are bettered during stimulant withdrawal such as caffeine withdrawal, during the phase where one gets a headache and terrible tiredness?

2. Just even slightly doing something which requires energy, even talking, can worsen all symptoms and especially so that the tiredness can no longer be felt (i.e. there's an extremely fragile balance between the psychotic stage and the healthy stage)?

 

1. Nope, they get much worse. I get a headache that feels like someone is pouring lava down my skull. Without caffeine it's always uncomfortable.

It's interesting to note that orgasms also feel like molten iron is being poured inside my skull kinda headache. Painful. Followed by the worst post-orgasmic depression one can imagine.
 

I'm afraid that none of my family are like this. In fact, they are all overly emotional.

I can say things that are very inappropriate sometimes without realizing how awkward it is and I go on and on until the person I'm talking to stops me. I've become shame-free and I forgot what a normal topic should go like (Well, no emotions for 6 years + social isolation kinda screw up your EQ).

 

Personally, though, I like not feeling petty emotions like fear and guilt. My problem is almost always I can't feel exhaustion or pain, which is supposed to help me abstain from doing certain things (such as exercising too much).

 

I've been like this constantly for over 10+ years, where it has worsened since I reached into my 20s. Though now at least I know that something is wrong, which I wasn't much aware of before.

 

 

 

Sometimes I get fleeting sadness and I enjoy it despite of being a negative emotions. At the moment I'm desperate to feel anything at all.

 

Maybe we're experiencing hypomania? This is common if one is extremely exhausted.

 

 

Lithium could maybe help that? Lithium, as I've taken for over a week now, seems to have been a good purchase with slight benefits to my symptoms, but still far away from being as effective as pregnenolone.---

 

I don't have the same problem of not feeling exhaustion or pain. That said, NMDA antagonists make me like this - seemingly infinite energy and high pain tolerance. It seems like you get into a zone of derealization triggering hypomania, perhaps? You should still try low dose or ultra low dose Naltrexone. It's worth a shot.

Once again I would like to mention that Jaiho, a member that you might have seen around here, reports positive results from NSI-189 and he also has suffered emotional anhedonia like you two. Now you have already mentioned that you can't acquire it Diesel. However, if in the future you would actually be able to, then by all means try it out, unless you have found something else that works for you. You and Ratherbeunknown might suffer the same symptoms, but the source mustn't necessarily be the exact same for each of your problems. Or Jaiho is just some lucky exception.

 

Anywho... Even if you don't experience the emotions, do you ever notice that you experience the physical reactions of those emotions? Like racing heartbeat, flushing, tension or anything like that, to relevant stimuli? Because there's something called alexithymia, where this phenomenon occurs, and some researchers mean that it could be a problem of the connections between the two brain hemispheres.

Sure thing. I'm willing to try anything.

No, I don't have the physical reactions. I'm expressionless, dull, and cold. 

[jaiho]

I have identical symptoms. I've had it for about 3 years, and really don't want to draw it out much longer.

Originally i thought Zoloft triggered it, but it was probably a traumatic event from a breakup and stress at my job, which led me to crying at the doctors, without even expecting that to happen.

The ability to cry i lost for years, when i tried the hallucinogen, Psilocybin mushrooms. This drug breaks through Anhedonia, and shows you what it was like being a child again, the nostalgic amazing feelings.

It's been an extremely gradual thing though, each month it seems to get a little worse, where even a year ago i was searching for cures, but thinking back to then, i was in a much better spot, and looking ahead, all the drugs i've tried don't seem to make a difference, i've also made a few mistakes with drug combinations that probably made me worse. In particular, a SSRI + TCA + taking a tab of LSD. Bad idea.

 

Now onto NSI-189. When this stuff kicked in, consistently around the day 22 mark, some filter that was over my eyes had lifted and i could feel things again. Not too far off the movie Limitless.

I see those of us with Anhedonia as the guy before he took the drug, and the drug cured his depression, and the lights turned on. NSI-189, it gave me remission until around the 6 month mark, where it was pooping out, i was feeling tired and bored again suddenly.

 

Then i noticed, the packet of NSI-189 i've left open for weeks, surely it's gone bad. So instead of buying from China this time, i bought some off Strangelove here on the forum. The two NSI-189 types that worked for me, originally sold by Ceretropic, which was freebase, it was a fluffy powder, and it gave me that first relief of Anhedonia, i then bought 10 grams from China of phospate, and this also worked, until i left the packet open.

Since using Strangelove's NSI, it had no effect whatsoever. I also tried TeamTLR's original NSI, and that didn't work either, until i bought more from Ceretropic, it worked again.

 

I have no answer why this is, since the method of action for NSI-189 is unknown, and we don't know if freebase or phosphate is the best to take.

For people who NSI-189 didn't work, i would ask to try a different supplier. try the Phosphate.

 

Currently im trialling 75mg Nortriptyline + 30mg Parnate.

Amazingly, this combo feels more normal than any SSRI by itself i've tried. I don't feel drugged at all, just clean.

Parnate is also starting to hit the Anhedonia like NSI started to do, so i'm waiting to see the full benefit this combo could have, and i think it could, considering the low dose im on, and how Parnate becomes much more effective at higher doses, and again, without side effects. Increase doses on SSRIs and you're in for zombieville.

 

 

 

 

[Diesel]

I think Amitriptyline is helping.

I remember that before losing my emotions 6 years ago, I used to get very vivid emotional dreams where I re-live the traumatic event all over again and I often did wake up in tears. After months, those dreams vanished along with my emotions. My memory became so hazy.

I neither experience flashbacks nor panic so I doubt that it's PTSD-related. It seems that my brain dealt with the trauma by suppressing memories and emotions whilst making memory recall difficult.

Today, I had one of those dreams for the first time in years. I've been taking 50 mg Amitriptyline for a week or so. I woke up feeling sad for a few minutes before I became completely blank again.

I tried many ADs in the past including other TCAs, so I'm thinking maybe my response is directly related to TrkA and TrkB agonism of Amitriptyline.

I also want to add that I often feel dissociated so the psychotic theory may hold up. Genetic predisposition to reacting this way to trauma.

I guess we will never know what happened exactly. I'll keep you updated on the Amitriptyline.

[jaiho]

The suppressed trauma is causing the emotional blunting. Some people break through to their subconscious via hallucinogens, this is the fast track way. The other way is meditation and psychotherapy but i haven't had the patience for these

[Meggo]

Seems to me like dissociation. Meditate your ass off for a year, see what happens.

[Sleepdealer]

"Seems to me like dissociation."

 

I read it like dislocation, like of the hippocampus.

 

 

Nice to hear that there is some progress here. During a lack of emotions, even sadness is good. Keep 'em coming.

[xxxxxxxx]

"suppressed trauma"  sounds mighty Freudian. A traumatic event sets off a biological stress response that has a specific, predetermined effect on your brain. Some brains are just more prone to getting fried than others, and some people's adrenals are more trigger-happy to release stress hormones than others. The only thing you can consciously control somewhat, is your exposure to the initial stressor (let's say you lost your job; might not have if you had more skills) and good coping skills to prevent further re-traumatisation from not having emergency money or good new job search skills. Finally, just a broad outlook "a few years from now I will look back and laugh, because everything was ok" will do wonders. 

 

Psychedelics help because they literally press on the chemical switches for reactivating your emotions. They didn't "reveal" anything magical. I guess people feel lasting effects because re-experiencing emotions they hadn't felt in years or decades gave them the aforementioned hope that everything will be ok, as their brains are still capable of recovery. 

[Diesel]

Here's an update:

Amitriptyline keeps working for my blunted affect. However, it only makes me feel gloom and sorrow, very dark inside. Which is far better than being a zombie, I admit. I'm still taking Amitriptyline since it's tolerable. Having any emotion is a big thing for me even if it's sorrow.

Phenibut, on the other hand, unlocks positive emotions like joy and love but they feel chemical to me. Side effects are intolerable since it gives me severe migraine, that doesn't respond to anything, and diarrhea.

I tried Tramadol for some serotonin release, but it proved useless. I'm considering MAOIs.

[ThreeKings12341]

any update diesel?

[Echos]

NAC works great for derealization - 2g to 4g per day... 2g should do it