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Why Does Soy Reduce Estrogen Levels In Studies?

estrogen soy cancer

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#1 matisvijs

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Posted 14 December 2017 - 02:07 AM


Soy is widely known in health circles as pro-estrogenic and feminizing and men are recommended to avoid it. If that’s actually the case, can anyone explain why serum estrogen levels actually decrease in soy-supplemented groups in studies in both men and women? And why is there an inverse relationship between hormone dependent cancers such as breast and prostate cancer (I suppose all cancers are hormone dependent) and soy consumption? Here are just some of the studies I’m talking about:

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.../pubmed/8770469 - 36-oz of daily soymilk consumption for a month significantly decreased serum 17 beta-estradiol levels in premenopausal women.

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.../pubmed/9839524 - Estrone and estradiol levels were decreased by 23% and 27% at the end of the study in the soy milk supplemented group in Japanese women. The change in estrone and estradiol levels was minor in the control, non-soy group.

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/11303585 - Serum estrone concentrations  decreased in the soy-supplemented group in Japanese men. There was no change in testosterone levels in both the soy group and the control group.

 

Is it that the estrogen circulation in blood decreases from soy but estrogen level inside the cell increases? Is that why soy is so widely considered as ‘estrogenic’?



#2 Believer

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Posted 25 December 2017 - 11:55 PM

I wonder this myself. Could it be a negative feedback loop from estrogen receptor binding since soy flavanoids can bind to estrogen receptors? It's the same thing that happens with androgen receptor agonists, even mild ones, they reduce androgen levels although insignificantly.



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#3 recon

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Posted 26 December 2017 - 04:15 AM

I’d say it is a homeostatic mechanism using negative feedback whereby too much estrogen present will downregulate the body’s production.

Our body’s capacity to maintain the status quo is underrated. Taking things like NR, for example, acutely increases NAD+ levels for the short term but the magnitude decreases in the long-term and I argue that, long enough, will return to baseline regardless. Same goes for huge supplementation of exogenous antioxidant SOD will reduce body’s production of SOD so that supplementation will result in levels like baseline and stopping the intake will acutely drop the levels until recompensation.

I’d say the same may be extrapolated for this case here. Hormonal changes are very well-regulated in the body and the fluctuations are more quickly adjusted so I’d not be surprised if it is indeed our own adaptation.
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#4 Believer

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Posted 27 December 2017 - 01:22 AM

I’d say it is a homeostatic mechanism using negative feedback whereby too much estrogen present will downregulate the body’s production.

Our body’s capacity to maintain the status quo is underrated. Taking things like NR, for example, acutely increases NAD+ levels for the short term but the magnitude decreases in the long-term and I argue that, long enough, will return to baseline regardless. Same goes for huge supplementation of exogenous antioxidant SOD will reduce body’s production of SOD so that supplementation will result in levels like baseline and stopping the intake will acutely drop the levels until recompensation.

I’d say the same may be extrapolated for this case here. Hormonal changes are very well-regulated in the body and the fluctuations are more quickly adjusted so I’d not be surprised if it is indeed our own adaptation.

People always forget that we are highly mutated. These control mechanisms for homeostasis could be dysfunction as they so often are. And what is the "base level" is highly variable due exactly to mutations, especially with hormone levels. So normal could be 1000ng or 500ng.

If you have a mutation in the enzyme that breaks down glutamate to gaba then you will have chronically elevated glutamate and there really is no homeostasis to be found for this lack of enzymatic activity.

 


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#5 misterE

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 12:26 AM

I've always thought that phytoestrogens (the ones contained in soybean and all other plant foods) are basically anti-estrogens.

 

For instance if you have estradiol with a value of 100,000,000 and a phytoestrogen with a value of 1,000 competing for the same receptor, the phytoestrogen (although estrogenic) works as an anti-estrogen by blocking the potent effects of estradiol. This mechanism along with adequate dietary-fiber is thought to be the reason why vegetarian and vegan men and women have lower estrogen levels and reduced risk of estrogenic-related cancers.  


Edited by misterE, 28 December 2017 - 12:28 AM.

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#6 ukw

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Posted 19 January 2018 - 11:17 PM

Incredible I just posted a topic on this very issue.

 

If soy decreases estrogen it's because phytoestrogens are anti-estrogenic as MIsterE said above, contrary to "conventional wisdom." They would block real estrogen from latching onto those E-receptors.


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#7 Darryl

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Posted 20 January 2018 - 03:39 AM

There are (at least) two estrogen receptors, an alpha receptor with pro-proliferative and feminizing effects, and a beta receptor with anti-proliferative effects. Soy isoflavones and their metabolite equol have much higher affinity for the beta receptor, comparable to native estradiol, but only a small fraction of estradiol's affinity for the alpha receptor. At dietary doses, the beta receptor seems to mediate most of the benefits, but above typical dietary doses some alpha receptor effects are seen. 

 

If it reduces native estradiol, there's probably some negative feedback going on.

 

The marked preference for the beta estrogen receptor is common to most phytoestrogens, except the 8-prenylnaringenin found in hops/beer. 


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#8 albedo

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Posted 09 May 2018 - 12:32 PM

There are (at least) two estrogen receptors, an alpha receptor with pro-proliferative and feminizing effects, and a beta receptor with anti-proliferative effects. Soy isoflavones and their metabolite equol have much higher affinity for the beta receptor, comparable to native estradiol, but only a small fraction of estradiol's affinity for the alpha receptor. At dietary doses, the beta receptor seems to mediate most of the benefits, but above typical dietary doses some alpha receptor effects are seen. 

 

If it reduces native estradiol, there's probably some negative feedback going on.

 

The marked preference for the beta estrogen receptor is common to most phytoestrogens, except the 8-prenylnaringenin found in hops/beer. 

 

Informative contribution Darryl, thank you for posting here. I just wonder if you have a take on using I3C/DIM and Chrysin to reduce the aromatase activity on your testosterone. I use soy (dietary) and cycle with DHEA from time to time as chronically deficient.

 







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