43 replies to this topic

[therapist]

Has anyone here ever used pheromones? I've read lots of stuff on the internet, some say they do subtly, some say they don't, so I'm not really sure what to believe, but in other animals they're pretty powerful at attracting mates and turning people on to you.

Thoughts/comments/opinions/experiences?

[Logan]

Has anyone here ever used pheromones? I've read lots of stuff on the internet, some say they do subtly, some say they don't, so I'm not really sure what to believe, but in other animals they're pretty powerful at attracting mates and turning people on to you.

Thoughts/comments/opinions/experiences?

Hopefully you naturally have good ones that attract many people. I think diet can impact how your pheromones smell. Maybe stress and exercise have an impact as well. I'm not sure there is anything definitive on this subject though.

[Now]

''Some body spray advertisers claim that their products contain human sexual pheromones that act as an aphrodisiac. In the 1970s, "copulins" were patented as products that release human pheromones, based on research on rhesus monkeys. Subsequent to this, androstenone, axillary sweat, and "vomodors" have been claimed to act as human pheromones. Despite these claims, no pheromonal substance has ever been demonstrated to directly influence human behavior in a peer reviewed study. The role of pheromones in human behavior remains speculative and controversial.''
http://en.wikipedia....eromones#Humans

''Few well-controlled scientific studies have ever been published suggesting the possibility of pheromones in humans. Using a brain imaging technique, Swedish researchers have shown that homosexual and heterosexual males' brains respond differently to two odors that may be involved in sexual arousal, and that the homosexual men respond in the same way as heterosexual women, though it could not be determined whether this was cause or effect. The study was expanded to include homosexual women; the results were consistent with previous findings meaning that homosexual women were not as responsive to male identified odors, while their response to female cues was similar to that of heterosexual males. According to the researchers, this research suggests a possible role for human pheromones in the biological basis of sexual orientation. In 2008, it was found using functional magnetic resonance imaging that the right orbitofrontal cortex, right fusiform cortex, and right hypothalamus respond to airborne natural human sexual sweat.''
http://en.wikipedia....bomb#Background

Maybe you can try a healthy lifestyle and an odorless deodorant.

[Now]

Do you have an attractive face?

A number of double-blind studies have found that women prefer the scent of men who are rated as facially attractive. For example, a study by Anja Rikowski and Karl Grammer had individuals rate the scent of t-shirts slept in by test subjects. The photographs of those subjects were independently rated, and Rikowski and Grammar found that both males and females were more attracted to the natural scent of individuals who had been rated by consensus as facially attractive. Additionally, it has also been shown that women have a preference for the scent of men with more symmetrical faces, and that women's preference for the scent of more symmetrical men is strongest during the most fertile period of their menstrual cycle. Within the set of normally cycling women, individual women's preference for the scent of men with high facial symmetry correlated with their probability of conception.

http://en.wikipedia....ness#Body_scent

[smithx]

There's actually quite a bit of compelling evidence for something like human pheromones.

I use pheromone products daily, and I've found that the ones which work have a subtle but very noticeable effect. For me, the main effect is that women react to me more positively if I approach them. In the past, I used to get a good proportion of negative reactions, but with pheromones I get, at worst, neutral reactions and usually at least somewhat positive ones.

No, women don't throw themselves into my arms or suddenly start making out with me (although that can happen even without pheromones), but starting with a more positive response is definitely a good thing.

There are a bunch of pretty good references on this pheromone company site (coincidentally one of the two companies whose products I use regularly):

The claim that "no pheromonal substance has ever been demonstrated to directly influence human behavior" really depends on what you are consider "human behavior" to be. It certainly influences how women rate men's pictures, how they report the quality of their moods, and where they sit (I'm alluding to 3 different studies with these examples). Those are examples of "human behavior" in my book.

What I think the authors of that paper were alluding to is that there has not been anything like a human "releaser pheromone" demonstrated. A releaser is a type of pheromone which directly causes a behavior. For example, in the pig, androstenone is a releaser which causes the female pig to adopt a mating posture. Instead, what I think we see in humans is a lot of examples of pheromones which have more subtle effects, and are not in the category of "directly producing a particular behavior".

A list of the different types of pheromones is found here on wikipedia. What I think we see in humans is information pheromones, and possibly a very weak version of sex pheromones.

[abelard lindsay]

i've actually used them. They certainly do something but my significant other was disturbed by it because she said I smelled like another guy and it was just too weird to be sexy.

[Deckah]

i've actually used them. They certainly do something but my significant other was disturbed by it because she said I smelled like another guy and it was just too weird to be sexy.

Did you try it in a social area? People that already know your pheromone signature tend to get iffy results in most cases. Smelling like someone else could just be the change in fragrance/oil/carrier that it used, pheromones are supposed to be more subtle.

[friable vitreous carapace]

A list of the different types of pheromones is found here on wikipedia. What I think we see in humans is information pheromones, and possibly a very weak version of sex pheromones.

That list is intriguing, and almost certainly incomplete/incorrect.

Regarding the topic at hand: I have been monitoring various peer-reporting communities for some time, lately also conducting some of my own tentative bioessaying, and am left in no doubt as to the efficacity of topically applied neurosteroids. In fact I'm quite surprised that there's been little discussion of these compounds to date here.

Sex pheromones have been quite heavily studied, but neuroactive steroids in general, and their regulatory function within the endocrine system, are somewhat less well understood.

As per usual with novel substances and such similar, there appears at present to be something of a chasm between the published literature on this subject (peer reviewed), and the information which can be gleaned from forums/blogs and so on (peer reported).

There are many 'putative pheromones' (and no doubt there are countless others yet to be synthed/isolated), but at this time, there are around 20 (publically) known human pheromones, some of which function as sex pheromones.

Regarding the latter:

Young, fit athletic males produce larger amounts of adrenostenone, which often turns women on, somewhat viscerally (subject to genetic factors, and time of the month).
Unfit men produce a greater amount of adrenostenol, which is a social lubricant. It's been shown to be GABA-ergic.
As men age, a greater amount of adrenosterone is produced (elicits respect, gives an aura of responsibility).
Then you have compounds such as DHEA sulphate, a beautifier (inhale it, then look at someone. You are bound to observe some hitherto unrecognized inner beauty radiating from their countenance).
IIRC around eight or nine active neurosteroids have been identified on male skin to date.

AFAIK with females the situation's similar, albeit with certain different neuroactive end metabolites (estratraenol, etc).

Copulins are also referred to as pheromones, though they are structurally different from the neurosteroids. Copulins are fatty acid chains, naturally found in the vagina, synthetically reproduced and topically applied, by both sexes, for different reasons, but chiefly for their testosterone enhancing effects (on men).

There is a growing body of (anecdotal, peer reported) 'evidence' describing various non-sexual effects of certain compounds e.g. pregnenolone, THDOC, cholecalciferol (Vitamin D), proprietory preparations sold by companies like 'Androtics Direct' such as "Instant Shine", and so on. The field here seems wide open - it's like a new frontier, a blank slate for experimentation..

I wouldn't necessarily recommend experimenting with these substances willy-nilly, however. Reports of unwanted effects abound, ranging from a mild 'crash' when the effects wear off, through to full-blown serious illness involving a dna adduct of reagent grade steroid, apparently resulting from chronic exposure to a certain 'pheromone mix'.

Caveat emptor..

Edited by friable vitreous carapace, 20 May 2012 - 06:02 AM.

[vtrader]

Learn more at pherotruth.com, like longecity forum but for pheromones.My advice read as much as you before buying anything. Like supplements you will find which company works better for you, and don't want to waste your money either without knowing.

[Godot]

There's some good info about pheromones here: http://hackingthehiv...ain/pheromones/

[Luminosity]

The concept seems manipulative. If it worked, I think we'd have heard more about it. People are way more complex than animals in their courtship behaviors. Learn to flirt, make yourself as attractive as possible, learn to talk to women, learn to court them and learn to be a good boyfriend. Having the F word in your signature isn't helpful in meeting people. Not most people anyway.

[vtrader]

Guys, you need to realize that pheromones are not some absoulte guranteed wonder maker. It is a double edge sword. How well it works is really upon the wearer, you got to be in a upbeat positive mood otherwise they backfire if your in a negative mood. If you get it wrong it can scare people away. You still need game. It's just that finishing extra 10%.

[The Immortalist]

Do you have an attractive face?

A number of double-blind studies have found that women prefer the scent of men who are rated as facially attractive. For example, a study by Anja Rikowski and Karl Grammer had individuals rate the scent of t-shirts slept in by test subjects. The photographs of those subjects were independently rated, and Rikowski and Grammar found that both males and females were more attracted to the natural scent of individuals who had been rated by consensus as facially attractive. Additionally, it has also been shown that women have a preference for the scent of men with more symmetrical faces, and that women's preference for the scent of more symmetrical men is strongest during the most fertile period of their menstrual cycle. Within the set of normally cycling women, individual women's preference for the scent of men with high facial symmetry correlated with their probability of conception.

http://en.wikipedia....ness#Body_scent

What if the person had cosmetic surgery to make his face really attractive and symmetrical?

Also does this symmetrical thing also apply to how the overall proportion of your limbs are?

[medievil]

They do work; there's a huge forum if you google pheromone forum with a ton of anecdotes; i noticed them working too but it may all be placebo too so read around and make your own conclusion.

[Godot]

One of the interesting things about pheromones is that the self-effects they produce. For example, most people report being more talkative while wearing the social enhancement product Glace. Could be useful for people with social anxiety.

[JohnD60]

Up until recently I flat out rejected the idea that Pheromones had any effect on humans because there is no specific sense organ in humans to sense them. But I read an article in Scientific American a couple of months ago. It was on plants, not pheromones, but the bottom line was that plants reacted to other plants via pheromones despite the fact that plants do not have any specific sense organs to detect pheromones. So, now I believe it is probable but not certain, that humans do react to pheromones. The bigger question as I see it is... can you trust any product you buy off the internet that claims to have pheromones in it? i went and purchased some anyway, various kinds, but the kind that interests me most is the kind that is supposed to encourage trust. Another large problem with their use is, as I understand it, you have to be in close proximity to your target for as much as five minutes before there is an effect. That is practical in only rare situations for me.

[smithx]

I would have to look them up, but there were studies which showed that the receptors which are found in the vomeronasal organ in other mammals, and which react to pheromones, are actually present in the human olfactory nerves. In other words, although the VNO is vestigil in humans, the receptors are still working.

That the receptors are there and are working has been proven by the research of Ivnaka Savik at the Karolinska institute in Sweden. She used fMRI and showed that straight males respond to andtrostadienone as an oderant - their brain's olfactory centers are activated - but gay males and straight females respond to it as they would to a pheromone: their olfactory centers are not activated, but their hypothalamus' are.

[kevinseven11]

Apparently theyre strong for anxiety. Im interested in trying.

[shp5]

funny how this thread attracts new members, seems like the scent of money is still the best pheromone of all...

[wiserd]

I see one new member?

[machete234]

Arent pheromones an easy to do scam since people cant possible prove that they work or not?
So when you would say that their pheromones dont attract people they can still tell you that you probably look ugly etc.

And dont we do the best to wash away our natural pheromones everyday?
With a shower every 24h and me hardly sweating at all how much can there be excreted?

Edited by machete234, 18 January 2013 - 03:38 PM.

[AdamI]

pheromones may excrete more in sweat, but just because u don't sweat, I'm sure u still excrete it. If your good looking that is, study show that it's the better looking guys that do it. One have to have symmetric face both halfs are similiar and u have the right proportions (golden summetrical 1,62 times if I remember correctly, same proportions in tress and all living things down to how ur DNA spirals are built up). People with those charateriztics have better immune system as well, soo mostlikely many other things works better too.(better looking men earn 22% more, beautiful people are also more intelligent according to reason study)

I'm sure u know if ur an Alfa male or not, the women say that to u... or something like "ur a father figure, I feel secure with u"
If ur fast in bed then ur not, since the "beta" males needed to be fast not to get caught with a female. Then the alfa male would have dissposed of u... while alfa male surely last as long as they like:)

Homo sapiens is only 117 000 years old

[machete234]

I'm sure u know if ur an Alfa male or not, the women say that to u... or something like "ur a father figure, I feel secure with u"
If ur fast in bed then ur not, since the "beta" males needed to be fast not to get caught with a female. Then the alfa male would have dissposed of u... while alfa male surely last as long as they like:)

Homo sapiens is only 117 000 years old

Explaining eveything with evolution is really boring and also I, like most people who gain a little control over their pc muscles, can pretty much go as long as I want.

[AdamI]

yes it was way to long text, sure u missed alot of ur life there

[nupi]

I'm sure u know if ur an Alfa male or not, the women say that to u... or something like "ur a father figure, I feel secure with u"
If ur fast in bed then ur not, since the "beta" males needed to be fast not to get caught with a female. Then the alfa male would have dissposed of u... while alfa male surely last as long as they like:)

Hear, hear, so SSRIs make you alpha, who knew...

(although I guess there might actually be some truth to it, the often described emotional blunting might come across as aloof...)

Edited by nupi, 06 February 2013 - 04:52 PM.

[Doktor]

I'm sure u know if ur an Alfa male or not, the women say that to u... or something like "ur a father figure, I feel secure with u"
If ur fast in bed then ur not, since the "beta" males needed to be fast not to get caught with a female. Then the alfa male would have dissposed of u... while alfa male surely last as long as they like:)

Hear, hear, so SSRIs make you alpha, who knew...

(although I guess there might actually be some truth to it, the often described emotional blunting might come across as aloof...)

haha. SSRI medication did NOT make me alpha, it made me indifferent. Wellbutrin and Vyvanse have definitely made me more energetic, less anxious, and far more confident/outgoing though.

Also, I once invested in a bottle of pheromones in hopes of both advancing scientific research while simultaneously "getting my dick wet". I already consider myself a fairly attractive guy; Have the whole symmetrical face. blah blah blah... I did not notice a single difference with the pheromones in responses from women. Although it did smell fucking great, so w.e...

[machete234]

I saw something on TV where some scientist said that men smell bad for women unless they are ovulating so good luck smearing pheromones on yourself when they only have a chance to work when your "target" is ovulating.

[smithx]

[ I did not notice a single difference with the pheromones in responses from women. Although it did smell fucking great, so w.e...

Many products which claim to have pheromones actually don't. And if it smelled great, that makes it even more likely to have not been pheromones. It's not that pheromones don't work -- it's probably that you tried the wrong product.

I saw something on TV where some scientist said that men smell bad for women unless they are ovulating so good luck smearing pheromones on yourself when they only have a chance to work when your "target" is ovulating.

Some pheromones have been shown in some studies to produce a negative or neutral response in women who are not ovulating. This is particularly true of androstenone. On the other hand pheromones such as androstadienone have been found to produce a positive response in women regardless of their ovulatory status.

By the way, the fact that a pheromone works only on ovulating women can be a good thing if you wear it when you go out to a club to meet women. This is because women who are ovulating are more likely to want to get dressed up, go out, and dance. They're also more likely to want to hook up.

So a pheromone which is attractive only to ovulating women could be quite a good thing for those situations.

[Godot]

Here's a really interesting examination of one particular neurosteroid that is among the most widely recognized potential human pheromones. Especially read the PDF posted in comment #6 http://pheros.net/di...drosterone-rone

[Godof Smallthings]

Since I started mindfulness training, I notice the info from my senses much more clearly than before, and along the lines of this subject,one thing I noticed is that there is a huge difference between how my wife smells during ovulation and menstruation (in the way you would expect - smells great during ovulation and like a turnoff during menstruation (there's nothing wrong with her personal hygiene and she does not sweat much as a rule, but even through her perfume I notice the difference very clearly). I am sure similar differences are subtly detected by women from men as well. Also, as somebody said above, scent is just one part of all the cues in the interplay...