• Log in with Facebook Log in with Twitter Log In with Google      Sign In    
  • Create Account
  LongeCity
              Advocacy & Research for Unlimited Lifespans

Photo
* * * * - 4 votes

Update on the status of Ichor's C60 research

ichor antoxerene c60

  • Please log in to reply
21 replies to this topic

#1 kmoody

  • Guest, F@H
  • 202 posts
  • 239
  • Location:Syracuse, NY

Posted 23 August 2017 - 11:07 AM


I have received tons of communications from members of this community inquiring as to the status of Ichor's C60 research. I wanted to post a brief update for the community as to our current efforts and future directions.

 

Ichor has formed an affiliate subsidiary called Antoxerene (see www.antoxerene.com), which is the small molecule drug discovery and development arm of the Ichor family. Antoxerene has just closed an oversubscribed $1.5M seed round. It will engage in traditional drug discovery around the p53/FOXO4 and p53/MDM2 pathways. All of our C60 research will also be conducted through this entity.

 

Most of our C60 related work for the past several months has been focused on bringing online more robust analytical techniques. The chemical properties of C60 make it challenging to study minor disturbances in the cage structure, such as oxidation states. Given the overwhelming number of possible degradation intermediates and breakdown products, tracking these components is a daunting challenge we are only just starting to dive into.

 

As many of you know, we have previously posted reports stating our concern about the safety of vendor supplied C60. These concerns are based on inconsistencies between label claims (i.e. concentration) and our intramural measurements, our own observations that C60oo is highly reactive when light exposed, and that light exposed C60oo either had no effect or was acutely toxic. Further, to date not a single vendor has been able to provide quality control information supporting their label claims, though several were kind enough to send us back our own data that we posted on these forums.

 

Our current interest is in determining whether the profound positive health effects published by Baati et al are true, particularly in light of duplicate images in the histopathology and other sources of contention in the paper, and non-encouraging results observed in my laboratory.

 

We have developed stable manufacturing processes in house so we can quality control the supply of C60oo we are using for our experiments. This has been a surprisingly non-trivial undertaking, but improperly characterized C60oo or vendor supplied C60oo has been a source of variance that made it difficult to accurately answer questions about the Baati claims. This is adequately online now.

 

We have developed a theoretical framework that could reconcile the observed toxic effects of light-exposed C60oo with the claimed positive effects of pristine C60oo. We are now conducting experimental work to support or refute our proposed mechanism of action. If correct, we expect to have clear mechanistic data that fully explains these divergent observations within a few months, and clear the path for a legitimate translational effort around C60.

 

Additionally -- what we all care about -- is whether or not the lifespan effects of C60oo reported by Baati are real. To this end, we have started a small lifespan study (initiated May, 2017) using freshly prepared, carefully quality controlled C60oo. Our animal model is a C57BL/6 BALBc F1 cross. Animals (n=10/group) are being treated with olive oil or C60oo in exact accordance with the Baati dosing schedule, starting at age 24 months. Although we typically prefer to run lifespan studies with n=35 or greater, we should achieve statistical significance with this group size if the lifespan effect is true. We have also begun building relevant IP around the space so that we can move forward with an FDA compliant translational pathway if positive results are observed.

 

I will share interim results when one of the two groups (control or treatment) reach 50% mortality. We expect this to occur sometime around January 2018.


  • Informative x 23
  • like x 2
  • Good Point x 2
  • Dangerous, Irresponsible x 1
  • Unfriendly x 1

#2 Mind

  • Life Member, Moderator, Secretary
  • 16,116 posts
  • 2,000
  • Location:Wausau, WI

Posted 23 August 2017 - 04:22 PM

A cautionary tale in regard to supplements.


  • Good Point x 4
  • Agree x 3

Click HERE to rent this advertising spot for C60 HEALTH to support Longecity (this will replace the google ad above).

#3 Nate-2004

  • Member
  • 2,268 posts
  • 308
  • Location:Philadelphia
  • NO

Posted 02 September 2017 - 01:01 AM

Aren't these mice the ones with the NNT mutation? Will that matter?


  • Good Point x 1

#4 YOLF

  • Location:Delaware Delawhere, Delahere, Delathere!

Posted 19 September 2017 - 06:58 AM

Is Ichor available to do small scale research similar to the original C60 trial with other research materials? Are there figures we could reference somewhere to get an idea of how much money we need to raise?



#5 kmoody

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest, F@H
  • 202 posts
  • 239
  • Location:Syracuse, NY

Posted 19 September 2017 - 07:47 PM

Is Ichor available to do small scale research similar to the original C60 trial with other research materials? Are there figures we could reference somewhere to get an idea of how much money we need to raise?

 

We do CRO work, not sure what exactly you have in mind regrading "small scale research... with other research materials." Please PM with specific study designs to discuss pricing or if you're looking to brainstorm project ideas, the project forum might be a better venue to discuss this. We do have a 2,000 capacity vivarium and plan to expand next year.


  • Informative x 3
  • Dangerous, Irresponsible x 1
  • Unfriendly x 1

#6 long68

  • Guest
  • 7 posts
  • 3
  • Location:F

Posted 23 September 2017 - 06:44 PM

Hi Kmondy

 

Did you validated your conclusion that competitor C60oo cause cancer in your test ?

To validate these conclusions the mice have to survive without cancer under identical  test conditions with your in house formulated C60oo.

 

Did You made this control test and did the mice survived cancer free?

Thanks


  • Good Point x 2
  • Pointless, Timewasting x 1

#7 IgG

  • Guest, F@H
  • 19 posts
  • 2

Posted 31 January 2018 - 03:36 AM

Moody, the January is over. Could you please share the interim results?

 


Edited by IgG, 31 January 2018 - 03:39 AM.

  • like x 1

#8 golf

  • Guest
  • 4 posts
  • 2
  • Location:North
  • NO

Posted 04 February 2018 - 10:50 PM

Hey kmoody, I'd be thankful if you could share some updates with us on your experiment, even if the mortality rate hasn't yet reached 50%.

 

Thank you for the serious work and commitment.


  • Agree x 2

#9 sensei

  • Guest
  • 792 posts
  • 97

Posted 13 February 2018 - 02:27 PM

Hey kmoody, I'd be thankful if you could share some updates with us on your experiment, even if the mortality rate hasn't yet reached 50%.
 
Thank you for the serious work and commitment.


They won't publish the data - ever.

It would ruin their entire business model.

Go to the Ichor Therapeutics website, read what they do, then ask yourself "would I EVER, EVER, EVER, release the data the people on longecity are asking for?
  • unsure x 2
  • Good Point x 1
  • like x 1
  • Agree x 1

#10 thedarkbobo

  • Guest
  • 152 posts
  • 25
  • Location:EU

Posted 20 February 2018 - 05:31 PM

Well, maybe they will - we are looking forward to it .... :)



#11 Phoebus

  • Guest
  • 627 posts
  • 132
  • Location:Upper Midwest, US

Posted 17 March 2018 - 10:36 PM

"I will share interim results when one of the two groups (control or treatment) reach 50% mortality. We expect this to occur sometime around January 2018."

 

well....? '

 

hows it going mr moody? whats the story? 


  • Enjoying the show x 1
  • Unfriendly x 1

#12 QuestforLife

  • Member
  • 604 posts
  • 255
  • Location:UK

Posted 01 June 2018 - 05:56 PM

Think I can explain Kelsey Moody's findings with the immunocompromised mice now. This is something I posted elsewhere:

Anyone posted this paper yet?

https://onlinelibrar.../mawe.201300082

Abstract: In vitro experiments have shown that C60 fullerenes exhibit cytotoxic effects against tumor cells and modulate the cytotoxic activity of immune cells. In vivo therapeutic experiments on the model of Lewis lung carcinoma showed that C60 fullerenes exhibit an antimetastatic effect (reduction of metastases by 27%), which is realized by activating macrophages and stimulating the synthesis of humoral factors, which significantly increase the cytotoxicity of treated animals serum.

What was interesting is that it worked by activating the macrophages - which we know from the Baati study were absolutely chock full of the stuff in the spleen. So it looks likely that C60 is anti cancer because it activates the innate immune system. Yet through its antioxidant action it actually suppresses the acquired immune system. In the study I linked to using a cancer vaccine with C60 fullerenes actually caused the cancer to spread more, yet both were effective individually.

I find this extremely interesting because old school cancer treatments, which were often able to completely cure even advanced cancer, involved infecting the patients so that they got a fever; see:

https://www.ncbi.nlm...98/#!po=62.0000


I'm betting Kelsey's mice didn't have the requisite immune function with macrophages and naive T Cells required for C60 stimulation.
  • Good Point x 2
  • Informative x 1

#13 Nate-2004

  • Member
  • 2,268 posts
  • 308
  • Location:Philadelphia
  • NO

Posted 01 June 2018 - 08:23 PM

Mice are a really poor but inexpensive model for what happens in humans anyway. As you know, Turnbuckle's hypothesis is that fusion is a factor in all this.  What kind of mice did Baati have? 



#14 QuestforLife

  • Member
  • 604 posts
  • 255
  • Location:UK

Posted 01 June 2018 - 08:33 PM

Yes Turnbuckle is trying to stimulate his pool of stem cells to increase in size, and thinks that may have been responsible for the lifespan extension in the Baati study, which used Wistar rats.

Although I like Turnbuckle's protocol, i'm not sure about what caused the lifespan extension.

Here I'm purely talking about how the rats in the Baati study didn't get cancer, but how Kelsey's immunocompromised mice with implanted cancer, got even worse cancer when using C60. I think it's to do with the fact C60 stimulates the innate immune system but can suppress the adaptive immune system; the former was used in the past to cure cancer via giving the patient's an infection.

Edited by QuestforLife, 01 June 2018 - 08:37 PM.

  • Needs references x 1
  • Good Point x 1

#15 Nate-2004

  • Member
  • 2,268 posts
  • 308
  • Location:Philadelphia
  • NO

Posted 03 June 2018 - 06:14 PM

I am still wondering what Ichor's results were with last year's attempt on 24 month old mice.


  • Agree x 2

#16 sthira

  • Guest
  • 1,953 posts
  • 389

Posted 03 June 2018 - 07:28 PM

Me, too.
  • WellResearched x 1

#17 YOLF

  • Location:Delaware Delawhere, Delahere, Delathere!

Posted 04 June 2018 - 02:46 AM

Kelsey's last login was back in January. As I understand it, his company has gotten alot more funding and alot more work in the last year or so with the Pharma stuff they're developing. I imagine he's VERY busy these days and may have had to give up some hobby work like this... or maybe the results were just plain inconclusive and will require another round of research that is going to require more commitment than he's available for at present..


  • Needs references x 2
  • Ill informed x 1
  • Disagree x 1

#18 QuestforLife

  • Member
  • 604 posts
  • 255
  • Location:UK

Posted 04 June 2018 - 07:41 AM

Yes Turnbuckle is trying to stimulate his pool of stem cells to increase in size, and thinks that may have been responsible for the lifespan extension in the Baati study, which used Wistar rats.

Although I like Turnbuckle's protocol, i'm not sure about what caused the lifespan extension.

Here I'm purely talking about how the rats in the Baati study didn't get cancer, but how Kelsey's immunocompromised mice with implanted cancer, got even worse cancer when using C60. I think it's to do with the fact C60 stimulates the innate immune system but can suppress the adaptive immune system; the former was used in the past to cure cancer via giving the patient's an infection.

 

To whomever wanted references, they are in post 12 above!



#19 Mind

  • Life Member, Moderator, Secretary
  • 16,116 posts
  • 2,000
  • Location:Wausau, WI

Posted 04 June 2018 - 05:30 PM

Kelsey has told me he is well aware of the continued interest in C60oo and will post in the forum when he has completed the latest studies in mice.


  • like x 3
  • Enjoying the show x 2
  • Informative x 1
  • Cheerful x 1
  • Agree x 1

#20 Kalliste

  • Guest
  • 1,047 posts
  • 118

Posted 26 August 2018 - 02:03 PM

We are thirsting. Also waiting for SKQ1


  • like x 2
  • Off-Topic x 1

#21 Kentavr

  • Guest
  • 128 posts
  • 30
  • Location:Москва
  • NO

Posted 01 September 2018 - 06:12 PM

We are thirsting. Also waiting for SKQ1


I do not believe that SkQ1 can significantly prolong life. It helps the body to remove active oxygen, but in studies SkQ1 prolongs life a little. Sam Skulachev avoids direct talks on this topic.

Most likely, SkQ1 is a good synergist, but not an independent geroprotector.
  • Off-Topic x 1
  • Good Point x 1
  • Informative x 1

#22 Kalliste

  • Guest
  • 1,047 posts
  • 118

Posted 05 September 2018 - 02:44 PM

I do not believe that SkQ1 can significantly prolong life. It helps the body to remove active oxygen, but in studies SkQ1 prolongs life a little. Sam Skulachev avoids direct talks on this topic.

Most likely, SkQ1 is a good synergist, but not an independent geroprotector.

 

My only expectation for Skq1 is healthspan (cancer, infections, neurodegeneration). This also goes for C60, it won't keep humans alive for many more decades.


  • Pointless, Timewasting x 2
  • Off-Topic x 1
  • Ill informed x 1
  • Disagree x 1





Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: ichor, antoxerene, c60

0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users