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Another stack review? Yup.


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59 replies to this topic

#1 mitkat

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Posted 02 August 2005 - 08:35 PM


I'm trying to get into a stack that will help with memory, specifically the ability to recall, but also to improve general cognitive abilities. I am a 23 year old vegetarian. Any additions, or info of any kind, would be appreciated.

This is what I have started to ease my way into:
Soy Lecithin 1200mg, 3x daily
Piracetam 800mg, 3x daily
Aniracetam, 700mg, 2x daily
Pyritinol, TBA, but currently 400mg
CoQ10, 80mg phytolipid
Gingko 60mg, 2x daily
L-tyrosine, 1000mg

Also a B-Complex, Daily Multi and one big swig o' flax seed oil.

I'm waiting on some centro and hydergine I've ordered. I've also been thinking about huperzine, plus I have some bacopin I just look at.

Thanks all.

#2 Guest_da_sense_*

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Posted 02 August 2005 - 09:22 PM

More lecithin, like 10-15 gr per day is better (specially as it's your only source of choline). It's good for liver and other stuff.
For a start cut to 2 doses of piracetam and 1 dose of aniracetam daily, you can up it later when you get used. CQ10 won't help you much with cognition. Switch to 50-200mg of idebenone per day. I wouldn't neceserry take Tyrosine daily unless you need it's stimulating and somewhat antideprevise effects.

Do you buy this stuff in caps or bulk? If bulk where did you get hydergine?

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#3 mitkat

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Posted 02 August 2005 - 09:31 PM

Thanks da_sense. I wish the hydergine was in bulk! I'm getting it from biogenesis. I take CoQ10 because I'm a vegetarian, I just thought I'd throw it in here to get all the info down. I want to pick up some idebenone also.

I'll start cutting down dose times.

All of my powders, except the piracetam, I got from nootropikshop.com. Adam is a great source for bulk powders. The piracetam I got from nootropica.com.

#4 Guest_da_sense_*

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Posted 02 August 2005 - 11:01 PM

No more adams shop...bulknutrition, unique nutrition, nutraplanet and custom are good choices, if you don't care too much about COA as some do ;)

#5 mitkat

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Posted 03 August 2005 - 12:50 AM

I know people have beef with Adam, but he's given me nothing but good products. And obviously, COAs ;)

But I don't really want to open that can of worms right now.

Centro also acts as a choline donor, correct? So i could keep the lecithin down once i start on that, and still feed the racetams.

Vasopressin also looks like a keeper, but definately not for any sort of long-term use. I'm doing correspondence research now, so it's not like a i have a huge exam to study for where i could really benefit from it.

Thanks again.

#6 LifeMirage

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Posted 03 August 2005 - 02:53 AM

I'm trying to get into a stack that will help with memory, specifically the ability to recall, but also to improve general cognitive abilities. I am a 23 year old vegetarian. Any additions, or info of any kind, would be appreciated.

This is what I have started to ease my way into:
Soy Lecithin 1200mg, 3x daily
Piracetam 800mg, 3x daily
Aniracetam, 700mg, 2x daily
Pyritinol, TBA, but currently 400mg
CoQ10, 80mg phytolipid
Gingko 60mg, 2x daily
L-tyrosine, 1000mg

Also a B-Complex, Daily Multi and one big swig o' flax seed oil.

I'm waiting on some centro and hydergine I've ordered. I've also been thinking about huperzine, plus I have some bacopin I just look at.

Thanks all.


I would recommend better acetylcholine donors like cdp-choline or Alpha GPC choline....and replacing your Soy Lecithin with either a Phosphatidylcholine complex or pure PPC.

#7 Guest_da_sense_*

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Posted 03 August 2005 - 03:53 AM

I'm not so sure how centro is a good as a source, it definetly has to do with choline but i don't think it's a direct source. I would still keep 10gr of lecithin a day...good stuff...also consider what LifeMirage proposed

#8 xanadu

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Posted 03 August 2005 - 07:22 PM

"I would still keep 10gr of lecithin a day"

da sense, do you mean 10 grains or 10 grams? 10 grams seems like a lot. I take about a gram a day myself.

#9 Guest_da_sense_*

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Posted 03 August 2005 - 10:26 PM

10grams...it's about 2 tablespoons. Many people who don't use nootropics at all eat lecithin because of it's health benefits. look it up on google. i wish i could find lecithin grains here, but i have to order from abroad and shipping is killing me on few kilos. only pretty fatty lecithin here (60% phospolipides rest is oil)

#10 mitkat

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Posted 03 August 2005 - 10:54 PM

i have soy grains also, i've been experimenting with. would that be a more suitable source of choline for now, or should i just invest in some Alpha GPC?

#11 Guest_da_sense_*

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Posted 04 August 2005 - 07:17 AM

as for choline source go with AGPC, soy is not so good for males

#12 johnmk

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Posted 04 August 2005 - 05:36 PM

I don't believe lecithin from soy contains much soy actually, all the compounds some people object to really aren't present.

#13 Guest_da_sense_*

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Posted 04 August 2005 - 06:13 PM

johnmk what you are saying is true for 97% lecithin granules, but in last post mitkat said "soy grains" not lecithin granules, it's 100 % soy ;)

#14 mitkat

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Posted 04 August 2005 - 09:01 PM

whoopsie, sorry, i was being inexplicit. i have no name brand lecithin gelcaps, 1200mg, and also a tub of GNC soy lecithin granules. i'm just going to get some Alpha GPC when these are done.

also, if i take idebenone, do i need to further supplement with CoQ10? that phytolipid stuff can be costly, and if redundant, i'll toss it.

#15 Guest_da_sense_*

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Posted 04 August 2005 - 09:20 PM

if you take idebenone you still can take cq10 since their action is not exactly same, but in most cases idebenone will replace and outweight cq10. i'm only taking idebenone

phytolipid? you mean phospholipids? it's not redudant. you should really do more research on lecithin. i happen to be ok taking piracetam and aniracetam together with no extra choline source. so since my agpc supply is near the end, i won't be buying any extra agpc or other choline sources except lecithin. 10-15gr of it will provide me with at least some choline and other benefits i like, plus it's a great for enhancing bioavailability of idebenone and ala, so i take it together

i also eat about 2 raw eggs a day which is also source of choline

#16 mitkat

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Posted 04 August 2005 - 09:25 PM

no, i mean phytolipid source of CoQ10. it's supposed to have enhanced bio-availability and faster absorption. as a vegetarian, i had been concerned about CoQ10 in the past.

thanks

#17 Guest_da_sense_*

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Posted 04 August 2005 - 10:53 PM

both Cq10 and idebenone should be taken with quality fats for absorption. unique nutr. also sels PEGysomal sublingual idebenone, i've got one bottle...it says 10x potent per mg, but i prefer bulk idebenone with fats, i've tried 200mg of cq10 (liquid caps with oil and vitamine e) and not much effect, but 100mg of idebenone (powder with fats) gives me much more energy and my mood is better

#18 ajnast4r

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Posted 09 August 2005 - 05:27 AM

i also eat about 2 raw eggs a day which is also source of choline


and a great source of disease

#19 wannafulfill

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Posted 09 August 2005 - 05:36 AM

i also eat about 2 raw eggs a day which is also source of choline


and a great source of disease


I really disagree. FDA reports that only 0.003 percent of eggs are infected. The translation is that only one in every 30,000 eggs is contaminated with salmonella. Besides, in the rare case that a healthy person actually eats salmonella, there is little risk of harm.

#20 Guest_da_sense_*

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Posted 09 August 2005 - 07:46 AM

I've been eating from 2 to 6 raw eggs daily since january this year. I ocasionally skip a day, but i eat it regullary. I've never had a single digestion problem, not to mention anything worse than that. Most of these are store bought regular eggs, but i sometimes get some quality free range chicken eggs from a friend in country and you can really tell a difference.
Also i've done blood test last week and my cholesterol and triglycerides were on lowest "normal" value.

#21 mitkat

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Posted 10 August 2005 - 02:35 AM

as a boy, I was deathly allergic to eggs, and I've only really started eating them in the past few years. I've never gone all "rocky" on them and had 'em raw, maybe I'll give it a shot.

#22 Guest_da_sense_*

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Posted 10 August 2005 - 06:13 AM

i used to eat them raw as a kid, so no prob for me, and cholsterol is not bad for you if they're raw

#23 mitkat

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Posted 05 October 2005 - 10:29 PM

I'm reviving this thread from it's grave, to get some feedback on my current stack. Sorry for such a massive bump, but I'd like some comments please! I'm doing a correspondance thesis program, so I'm not going to be in any testing scenerios, but I do need to do some homework everyday, after work that is. So...my main focus is...focus! And memory, general cognitive enhancement as well. I've been toying with pyritinol a little.

Choline Bitartrate 500mg, 2x daily
Piracetam 800mg, 3x daily
Aniracetam 700mg, 2x daily
Hydergine 4.5mg
CoQ10 80mg phytolipid
Idebenone 50mg, 2x daily (upping soon)
Ginkgo biloba 60mg, 2x daily
R-ALA 100mg, 3x daily
Ester-C 500mg
L-tyrosine 1000mg, 1x weekly
Vitalux Time Release
Siberian Ginseng (Eleutherococcus) 260mg, 2x daily
Korean Ginseng (Panax) 500mg
Phosphatidyl Serine 100mg
Eyebright (Euphrasia officinalis) 500mg
Flax Seed Oil, a big swig
Hemp Seed Oil, small tablespoon

I know I need a better choline source, I'm just running it dry. I'm also wondering about the Phos. Serine...It's a little expensive, and I get the feeling 100mg a day just isn't going to do anything. Any thoughts?

#24 scottl

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Posted 05 October 2005 - 10:44 PM

Flax Seed Oil, a big swig
Hemp Seed Oil, small tablespoon

Take some fish oil and ditch both.

#25 gcurrie

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Posted 05 October 2005 - 10:58 PM

My recommendations in order of importance:

Vinpocetine: 5-10 mg 3x day (every meal). Clarity.
Huperzine A: 50-100 mcg per day with food. Helps with memory in particular.
Pyritinol: I like 200 mg, but apparently others like a lot more (400 - 1000 per day). Mental focus.

other comments:

Try Alpha GPC for your choline. It seems to have it's own effect on mental activity, apart from being a great and bio-available choline source.

I found hydergine to be overpriced for it's effect on me.

Phosphatidyl serine had no effect whatsoever that I could tell.

[edit]: If you try vinpocetine, you might drop the gingko. Both are vasodilatory. Vinpocetine is more specifically a cerebral vasodilator, which will help more in mental focus and cognitive enhancement.

#26 rfarris

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Posted 05 October 2005 - 11:10 PM

Flax Seed Oil, a big swig
Hemp Seed Oil, small tablespoon

Take some fish oil and ditch both.

Yeah, but doesn't it give you a happy little feeling to know that you're imbibing a hemp product? :)

-- Rick

#27 mitkat

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Posted 06 October 2005 - 12:12 AM

QUOTE (rfarris) Flax Seed Oil, a big swig
Hemp Seed Oil, small tablespoon

Take some fish oil and ditch both.
_____________
Yeah, but doesn't it give you a happy little feeling to know that you're imbibing a hemp product? :)

-- Rick
_____________

Yes, it certainly does Rick!! Plus, I'm a vegetarian, I don't take fish oil.

Vinpocetine...I have some but have yet to get into it. I like the idea of it's actions, being from a plant I have to hang around with everyday. I also have glasses/contacts, and a history of macular degeneration in my family, so I'm interested in it's microcirculatory properties in and around the eyes more than anything else.

Any thoughts on the Phos. Serine anyone?

Edited by mitkat, 06 October 2005 - 12:33 AM.


#28 scottl

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Posted 06 October 2005 - 12:18 AM

Well...

"Yes, it certainly does Rick!! Plus, I'm a vegetarian, I don't take fish oil."

All I'll say is look at the data on optimal doses of EPA/DHA and look at the controversy over conversion ratesof ALA and see how much EPA/DHA you are getting and see if your policy makes sense to you.

#29 mitkat

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Posted 06 October 2005 - 12:32 AM

And all I'll say to that is I guess I won't be one of the transhumanist astronauts flying off into space in the year 3000. And it's not a policy, it's an ethic. Thanks for your comments

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#30 rfarris

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Posted 06 October 2005 - 02:05 AM

And all I'll say to that is I guess I won't be one of the transhumanist astronauts flying off into space in the year 3000. And it's not a policy, it's an ethic. Thanks for your comments

Ok, I've got one! :)

If we're not supposed to eat animals, how come they're made out of meat?

-- Rick




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