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Looking for a Long-term stack for immune health / neuroprotection / cardioprotection / mitochondrial function

neuroprotection cardioprotection mitochondria

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#1 brosci

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Posted 30 July 2018 - 12:27 AM


I'm currently supplementing:
  • Magnesium
  • Meriva Curcumin
  • B-complex
How does this next stack sound for long-term immune, brain, heart, and mitochondrial support:
  • Fish Oil
  • B-Complex
  • Nicotinamide Riboside
  • Vitamin D3 (2500iu vs 4000iu?) + K2 (maybe Innovix Labs mk4+mk7)
  • CoQ10 (ubiquinol or ubiquinone?... or MitoQ or Idebenone?) + PQQ
  • Magnesium Chelate
  • Creatine Monohydrate
  • Zinc (daily low-dose of Zinc Carnosine or weekly higher dose of OptiZinc?)
  • Vitamin-C + Bioflavonoids (maybe with benaGene, which is oxaloacetate stabilized with C?)
  • Potassium Iodide (or nascent iodine... maybe with marine phytoplankton?)
  • LEF Memory Protect (microdose lithium orotate + colostrinin)
  • Longvida Curcumin (or theracurmin?)
  • Resveratrol + Quercetin + Green Tea + Lutein + Zeathathin + Benfotiamine
I'm curious if anything might make sense to drop, when thinking about long-term daily dosing. I'm also thinking about KSM-66, but the list is getting fairly long. There's a few blends that might cover most of this in one swoop (eg. athletic greens, although they often have ingredients that I'm not too interested in supplementing, like wheatgrass.) Lately, I could really use a boost and want to dial in a more complete "multi" phytonutrient-related sort of stack to sort of set and forget.

 


Edited by brosci, 30 July 2018 - 12:28 AM.


#2 Astroid

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Posted 20 August 2018 - 03:21 AM

Are you taking any Rx meds currently, or have any specific medical issues?

 

Personally, I look for symptoms... to address first. 

 

Let's address the basics... first. 

 

For the Immunity... there is nothing better than ... 3.0-4.5mg of Low Dose Naltrexone @ 4-5 nights a week. 

It primes the body's immunity... to optimize it. 

Naltrexone is a cheap Rx drug from the 60's... and used for AIDS and Cancer patients since 1985 by a Gov't Research MD. 

 

One's immunity starts in the digestive system... mainly with Hydrochloric Acid.. Betaine HCL increases this.. take only with food. 

Reflux is a symptom of low HCL.

 

Sulfur is an essential mineral that is in every cell membrane. It is the 5th most important element in your body... allowing water and oxygen to exchange between the cell walls to detox the cells. It is one of my basic recommended supplements.. for many reasons. Pain, asthma, inflammation, speeds up healing, etc.. 

A MD told me.. everyone is deficient in minerals.. as the soil is depleted.

I recommend taking MSM-Sulfur.. Jarrow Formula is the best tasting.  1-2 tsp in a shot of water.. 1-2x/day initially. 

Race horses take MSM-Sulfur before and after races. It is available in 10 lb buckets in farm coops. 

I like MotherEarthLabs.com multiminerals. 

 

Vitamins don't work without Minerals..

And Neither work without SYSTEMIC ENZYMES... which no one pays attention to. 

 

Systemic Enzymes are involved in 3,500+ body chemical functions.. as catalyst.. 

They recycle vitamins and minerals. 

Most are plant based.. your liver and pancreas make them in abundance... until about age 27... then it falls like a rock.

This is one major reason.. you heal slower. 

 

They reduce inflammation, and thus pain, speeding up healing.. some eat blood clots and scar tissue.

They also lower blood pressure naturally... one should monitor one's blood pressure to adjust the dosage.

Avoid blood thinners while using Systemic Enzymes.. Personally, I say... just use Systemic Enzymes.. instead.. because they do good things for the body.  

If one takes a high enough dose... and exercises.. one can Not Get Sore ! 

 

Ligaments, tendons and nerves are the slowest healing parts of the body.

I ripped both bicep tendons at age 59, deadlifting 500 lbs... as I sort of jerked it instead of lifting. (Yes.. I have blurry photos to prove it.)

After 3 years the Andrews Sports Institute did not have an answer.. "It is not torn bad enough to operate," was their opinion. 

 

A smart friend wrote me and said in Europe and Russia they are big into Systemic Enzymes.. and he used them to heal from a motorcycle accident. 

He specifically mentioned Vitalzym... so I ordered it and took high doses.. and I healed both biceps 90% in 90 days. 

 

Magnesium is hard to absorb, but easy to lose. It is involved in 350+ body chemical functions.

Mostly stored in the heart and brain. 

Magnesium is the main chemical involved in making energy in the body. It fights Calcium. 

Epsom Salt is magnesium.. soaking in a hot tub with 2+ cups for 35-40 minutes is like an IV of Magnesium.

There is also Magnesium Oil available. 

Mag Oxide Pills are only absorbed at about 5 %.  

Magnesium Bicarbonate Water... that you make yourself.. is absorbed at 50%.

Drink without food.

 

1 liter of Carbonated Soda Water + 3 Tablespoons of Plain Milk of Magnesium.

Shake and let settle till clear.. 20-30 minutes.. keep cold.. 

Bottle = 1,500 mg of Magnesium. 

You need at least 500 mg per day.

 

Adrenal Cocktail... 

4 oz of OJ..

1/4 tsp of ground up sea salt.

1/4 tsp of Cream of Tartar (Potassium)

It goes through the liver to balance potassium and sodium in the adrenal glands. 

 

The Liver is the 2nd most important element in your body.

Milk Thistle Extract is the only thing known to flush it out and stimulate healthy cell growth. 

 

Food is your best source of nutrition... but processed food is dead.

Currently I am using Vibrant Health brand - Maximum Vibrance supplement. 

It is the most concentrated super food I can find. 

 

Choline is a B Vitamin that makes 3 essential brain chemicals.. 

One needs 750 mg per day for 7-14 days to see results. 

People with Alzheimer's are deficient in Choline. 

  

 


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#3 brosci

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Posted 20 August 2018 - 05:38 AM

Nope, no Rx meds, and no major medical "issues" to speak of.  Heart disease, cancer, and alzheimer's runs in the family, but these days, I suppose they run in everyone's family.

 

I was looking at the Spectrum Vibrance product, but it seemed a little "carb-rich" for my goals, where I might prefer to go straight for the key ingredients in a stack like that -- although it's unclear which ones those would be for me (blueberry extract?  ashwagandha extract? etc.)

 

I've experimented on / off with supplemental choline, and it seems to often worsen my mood.  I've taken this as a sign that I'm probably sufficient on my intake.  There are some days when I get down on 4 egg yolks, although I'm admittedly often under the RDA (the same goes for calcium and Zinc, thought lately I supplement the latter mineral.)  My favorite vegetables are sulfurous and I'm a big fan of onions / garlic... so I feel like if there's any one mineral I'm good on via diet, it's gotta be sulfur.  I eat enough sulfur that I've thought about molybdenum as potentially useful to supplement.

 

Naltrexone feels a little too pharmaceutical for me personally, but I would like to further explore other immune-boosters (perhaps sleep optimization is another angle.)  I've seen L-lysine mentioned as being decent as an anti-viral prophylactic, but it seems to have negative interactions with cholesterol (and associated gallbladder stones) which works against other goals.

 

Since posting that previous stack, my current one looks like:

  • Magnesium Malate (Source Naturals)
  • B2, B6, B9, B12 (Seeking Health HomocysteX)
  • B5 (NaturalFactors)
  • OptiZinc (Solaray)
  • CoQ10 + PQQ (Pure Therapro)
  • EPA + DHA (InnovixLabs)
  • K2 (Innovix Labs)
  • D3 (Carlson)
  • Potassium Iodide (I'm curious how this compares to Kelp or Nascent)
  • Marine Phytoplankton
  • Microdose Lithium + Colostrinin (LEF)
  • Whey Concentrate (post-workout)

Once I eventually get through some of these, I'm thinking I might

  • Replace Magnesium Malate with bulk Mg Threonate (though it does supply much less elemental Mg.)
  • Replace HomocysteX with HomocysteX Plus (which has TMG)
  • Replace Higher-dosed OptiZinc Zinc with lower-dosed Zn Carnosine
  • Replace the ethyl-ester fish oil with higher dosed TG-form DHA variety (so I can take less -- bonus if I can find one with conjugated PS-DHA)
  • Not reorder the plankton (tastes bad, doesn't feel useful or well studied)
  • Not reorder the LEF Lithium (this one still seems a little sketchy to me)

I might tack on

  • C (+Bioflavonoids?)
  • Resveratrol (not sure on brand?)
  • Curcumin (longvida?)
  • B1 via Benfotiamine
  • Na-R-ALA + ALCAR (ideally low-dosed... maybe with biotin?)
  • Hydrolyzed marine collagen peptides
  • along with creatine monohydrate
  • and maybe B3 via Nicotinamide Riboside or NMN (although this still seems under-studied compared to NR.)
  • Potassium Chloride (lo-salt, basically just to lightly sprinkle on food for extra potassium.)
  • Some adaptogen (KSM-66? Reishi?)
  • Soluble fiber (?)

On one hand, this looks a little excessive.  On the other, this could all probably fit inside one "maximum vibrance" sort of multivitamin and it would essentially be one unassuming supplement scoop.  I wouldn't mind finding some stack that bundles more of these together (eg. I could probably get my D3 + K2 in one bottle if I switch the K2 and D3 to a Thorne liquid.)

 

The concentrace trace mineral liquid drops look like they could be useful as a source of magnesium and microdose lithium, but there's also unwanted stuff in there like arsenic.

 

I'm very interested in Systemic Enzymes.  I've taken DigestGold in the past, but didn't notice much.  For a minute, I was curious if I might have low stomach acid (sometimes bloated when I eat a ton of vegetables) and tried Betaine HCl, but soon found myself with heartburn, so I guess that's not the case.  I was looking at the probiotic and enzymes from the company "Bio Optimizers" but figured I'm already blowing a lot of cash on a lot of supps.  Googling "systemic enzymes blood thinning" does mention that these have that side effect -- just taking 3-4g of fish oil, I seem to get more frequent bloody noses or take longer to stop bleeding whenever I nick myself on something... with resveratrol, it seems to take even longer (bordering on a lot longer)... then tacking on the curcumin and bioflavonoids, I do wonder if this could be an issue.  I also really like the Four Sigmatic coffee with Chaga, but damned if that doesn't inhibit blood clotting / thin the blood too.

 

I'm also intrigued by some of the other potential anti-aging mito-optimizers like MitoQ / Idebenone / BenaGene, or brain-nootropics like aniracetam / noopept (or whatever else has come along since these were the rage), or cardioprotective agents like pomegranate extract.  Psychobiotics and Phages are also pretty interesting.  Perhaps what I need is a good "pareto principle" assessment of the list, or a nice cycling strategy, although guys like Ray Kurzweil come to mind who seem to do ok with exaggerated stacks.  I'm cool with potentially wasting money on making expensive pee with this stuff, but I don't want it to come back to bite me, so it's a little difficult piecing it together for all of my health goals.


Edited by brosci, 20 August 2018 - 06:27 AM.


#4 XenMan

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Posted 20 August 2018 - 09:10 AM

It is your own choice on how you want to approach your long term health. My views are different to most around here, so I won’t write a dissertation, just a few points to think about and research yourself.

 

First there is potential lifespan increases, and then healthspan. There is some overlap, but the simple version is some things will reduce cell turnover and give a bigger lifespan potential, while other things will allow your aged, detuned and body that is prone to disease, minimise the chances of those diseases taking you out too early. There is also importantly feeling good and being able to be active at any age.

 

The emphasis here at Longecity is lots of supplements to increase healthspan. As I have posted somewhere else, my view is that a few supplements will get you to around 90 % benefit of supplements only, with the last 10% a hard fought and potentially risking venture.

 

A good balance of diet, exercise, stress reduction and all round health is just as important.

 

If you have lots of fat on your stomach, don’t exercise, eat lots of meat and carbohydrates, supplements aren’t going to do a lot long term. Also different ages require different protocols.

 

Your question is about supplements only so I would put as a minimum, with following caveat that you eat lots of non-starchy vegetables, and fruit if you are not low carb, as well as having a low/healthy body fat percentage and are mid 40’s plus:

 

For age related reduced levels and hormone modulation:

NMN

COQ10

Shilajit (Primavie only)

PPQ

Ashwagandha (KSM66 only)

Mangosteen

Fish oil

 

ZMA and melatonin to help with sleep.

 

You can add some other supplements to tweak the basics of what you want more of.

 


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#5 John250

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Posted 20 August 2018 - 06:30 PM

For immune function I would add a good form of astragalus like Cycloastragenol or astragaloside IV. Also some Lions mane, cordyceps and red reishi.

Edited by John250, 20 August 2018 - 06:32 PM.


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#6 brosci

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Posted 20 August 2018 - 10:31 PM

For immune function I would add a good form of astragalus like Cycloastragenol or astragaloside IV. Also some Lions mane, cordyceps and red reishi.

 

I've used "Daily C Protect" from MegaFood with astragalus, but it's not a very palatable powder.  I've also tried FourSigmatic's matcha powder with astragalus + Lions mane, but didn't like it as much as straight matcha -- maybe the taste could grow on me.

 

Athletic Greens worked well for me when I tried it, but there's a lot of crossover between my other individual supplements and it's quite expensive (and there's semi-sketchy stuff in it like wheat grass.)

 

If you have lots of fat on your stomach, don’t exercise, eat lots of meat and carbohydrates, supplements aren’t going to do a lot long term.

 

Luckily, I enjoy exercising and stay pretty lean year-round with decent abdominal definition.  Right now, I'm getting up around 8am, going to work, then taking a break at ~2pm to run for 45m (~4 miles), then I do lunch with mostly nuts and vegetables and go back to work.  Dinner usually includes vegetables and wild meat / seafood with plenty of avocado and some olive oil, and I usually go for a 30-60m walk after dinner, before one last dive into work.  30m before my afternoon run, I'm experimenting with some whey protein to try to reduce muscle loss from the intermittent fasting + otherwise lower protein intake, and what would be fasted running -- I might switch this out with Thorne's Aminos (EAAs) and do the whey post-exercise.  Every few weeks, I switch over from running to heavy resistance training which I tend to find a little more grueling on the CNS and muscles / joints.  Overall, it seems to work for body comp, mood / sleep, and keeping my aerobic + anaerobic systems in check.

 

I've experimenting with fully removing meat, or just dialing up legumes + grains, but this really didn't work well for me at all.


Edited by brosci, 20 August 2018 - 10:44 PM.






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