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Lack of wherewithal following lysine (and olive leaf)

depressed epstein barr ebv social

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#1 Sicko

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Posted 07 December 2019 - 03:20 AM


Hi, I posted a little while ago about my experience after taking mainly Lysine for a little over a week, for my Epstein Barr virus (I also have Hashimoto's and Bartonella). I did take olive leaf extract for a couple days within the same time span as the lysine, so either one or both might be contributing to how I'm feeling now, but I think the Lysine definitely has something to do with it.

 

So I took lysine for 8 or 9 days, I started with 500mg, then after a day or two went up to 1g at a time, per day. At the same time, I cut chocolate and sunflower seeds out of my diet. My reasoning for doing these things were that I had a diagnosis of Epstein Barr (Mononucleosis) from earlier in the year, which appears to be chronic, as I don't have it acutely, and don't remember when I did have mono acutely before. But the idea was to increase the lysine:arginine ratio which would help tame the epstein barr virus, since epstein barr is a herpes virus, and herpes viruses replicate in the presence of arginine.

 

So I started taking lysine, and pretty much right away I could tell that I felt different. First I thought it was a good thing, less anxious, more foggy, but I thought it was fine. But then it stayed the same, and got worse. I stopped taking it after 8 or 9 days. So now it's been over 2 weeks since I stopped taking the lysine, but I still feel messed up by it.

 

I feel like I've lost my social wherewithal. I feel out of it to the degree of not caring, or not having the ability to care about people or things as much. This makes me anxious because I feel stupid in social situations now. I've always had a pretty keen social acuity, which lead to anxiety, but now I feel stupid and lost, which also leads to anxiety and depression. I'm quite fatigued as well, sleeping more than usual. 

 

I thought maybe the lysine actually activated the epstein barr virus more, or activated my body against it, so now I'm experience more of the symptoms of epstein barr? Or maybe the lysine screwed up my immune system in the wrong way (I believe I'm more TH2 dominant, and I have high thyroid antibodies). I've taken some other things that have messed me up concerningly for long periods of time (indefinitely). Back in 2015 I took a multivitamin and another spray just for a few days (https://www.holistic...0-capsules.html and https://www.holistic...gaba-spray.html) from a company that really screwed me up for a couple years (high anxiety, not able to express myself normally).

 

Then I tried low dose naltrexone (LDN) 4 separate times for about a week each. The last time I took it, when I was on it, I felt like I was kind of on cocaine in a way, then I crashed really hard. After that things drastically changed in my life, as it was the first time I had experienced deep depression before. That took maybe a year to resolve, if at all, because I still experience depression in that way.

 

So I have experience with things really messing me up for a long period of time from taking them for not a long period of time. I guess my body is pretty sensitive, or my immune system is messed up and if it's activated wrong, it will wreak havoc on me.

 

But with these new symptoms, I'm concerned, and I hope they go away. Does anybody have any idea of why that might have happened with taking the lysine, and why I'm still feeling messed up from it more than 2 weeks after stopping taking it?


Edited by Sicko, 07 December 2019 - 03:22 AM.


#2 Sicko

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Posted 07 December 2019 - 03:30 AM

I suppose it could partly be a placebo effect from cyclical thinking of me worrying about not having social wherewithal, then thinking that I don't. But I still think there's something to it, because I also feel really out of it, bordering on confusion. I just can't get grounded, so I don't want to do anything, and can't process situations correctly.


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#3 Sicko

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Posted 29 February 2020 - 05:24 AM

Maybe lysine caused higher ammonia levels in me? 

 

https://academic.oup...9/9/943/5676681 - Evidence is assembled that lysine acts as an intracellular hydrogen ion acceptor, causing increased ammonia formation and increased potassium excretion in certain disease states.

 

and 

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.../pubmed/6476119 - These results indicate that arginine mitigates ammonia intoxication in the rat by increasing ornithine carbamoyltransferase activity through increased ornithine availability and not via activation of N-acetylglutamate synthetase.

 

fuck

 

But there's also this

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/10831173 - We thus conclude that an acute increase in plasma lysine caused minimal clinical or biochemical untoward effects in patients with LPI (lysinuric protein intolerance). Moderate increases in plasma lysine after low-dose oral supplementation with lysine or well-absorbed lysine derivatives are probably well tolerated in LPI.

 

 

But maybe I fucked my brain up with the lysine causing extra ammonia.


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#4 Turnbuckle

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Posted 29 February 2020 - 04:24 PM

I thought maybe the lysine actually activated the epstein barr virus...

 

 

Possibly. See this paper--

 

The results show that L-lysine amino acid excess is characterized by significant increased of HIV-1 RNA copies in enriched peripheral blood mononuclear cells plasma samples of HIV-infected patients. There was evidence for an association between L-lysine supplementation and HIV-1 RNA replication and the level changes of this host essential nutritional element play a key role in the synthesis of the virus proteins and in transcription initiation of the retrovirus life cycle. High intake of L-lysine amino acid may increase the risk of high viral load...

https://www.ncbi.nlm...les/PMC5890499/

 

 


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#5 Sicko

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Posted 03 May 2020 - 05:08 AM

This is an update, I don't know what happened, but I'm still not back to myself, feeling similar things to what I reported before, and I am constantly uncomfortable. 

 

Thanks Turnbuckle for the reference, that is interesting.



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#6 Turnbuckle

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Posted 03 May 2020 - 09:10 AM

Dr. Jill Carnahan recommends a treatment for EBV that contains a couple of items in addition to lysine and olive leaf--

 

 

Monolauren: 1800 mg twice daily
Olive Leaf: 1000-1500 mg twice daily
L-Lysine: 1000-1500 mg twice daily
Cat’s Claw tincture: 30-60 drops twice daily

 

 
 It's possible that what you are experiencing is the enhanced apoptosis of an expanded T-cell population--

In conclusion, the massive expansion of IM T cells is not caused by EBV infection of these cells but merely represents an intense immune reaction. Through altered expression of Bcl-2/Bax and Fas/FasL, the activated T cells are subject to enhanced apoptosis while residing within the lymphoid tissue

 

 

The first supplement Dr. Carnahan mentions downregulates T-cell activity--

Glycerol Monolaurate (GML) inhibits human T cell signaling and function by disrupting lipid dynamics
several studies have suggested that GML suppresses inflammatory processes, indicating that GML may also have an immunomodulatory role. 

 

 
As for cat's claw, it is successfully used by some to treat epstein barr, if you believe comments on Amazon.
 
 

Edited by Turnbuckle, 03 May 2020 - 09:13 AM.






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