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Lebanon's Official War on Israel


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136 replies to this topic

#121 Athanasios

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Posted 21 July 2006 - 01:18 AM

Although, that is precisely what you do when you brainwash someone...create a seperate reality that can be reinforced, but make some aspects so strange that it alienates.



not that i know anything about that type of stuff [wis]

#122 DJS

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Posted 21 July 2006 - 02:34 AM

hankconn

Don I don't know why you insist that I am brainwashed.


Do you know when I think of Nazi Germany? I think of it whenever I hear the talk radio blasting out of someone's car, or when I see the "quasi-facist automotive fads". You in particular vex me, hank, because I see a lot of my former self in you. The moralizing. The flag waving. The ra-ra cheerleading for the US. Literally every time you post something on politics or world affairs I think to myself, "holy s***, I use to be JUST like that." (go look at my really old posts in the politics forum - when I went by the name "kissinger").

And then one day I woke up and realized that nationalism can be the most virulent of moralities - even for those of us who pride ourselves on being rational.

I think Michael Savage's ideology, and some of the consequences of that ideology in his belief system, are completely invalid. Some of his rhetoric is extraordinarily good though.


Yes exactly, it's rhetoric - dialog aimed at winning a point, not arriving at the truth.

When you listen to someone like a Savage, or a Rush, or a Hannity - it's the same f-ing thing, day after day afer day after day. It's good and repetitive and I think that's because they want to work it into your brain really good. Not consciously, mind you. They're infected just like you are - they think they're doing you a favor. But still, I can see now the repetitive patterns of daily attendance, just like with church services.

Conservative talk radio is like a cult to me -- "The Church of WABC". It's just one more self reinforcing memeplex that tricks you into willing against yourself.

#123 jaydfox

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Posted 21 July 2006 - 02:50 AM

Hank, check out this post.
http://www.imminst.o...&f=56&t=4551&s=

While I don't expect it to change your mind (though it changed mine, and IIRC, it even had an effect on Don), it should help put a different light to the flames that conservative rhetoric (like Savage's) is fanning.

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#124 DJS

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Posted 21 July 2006 - 02:53 AM

I haven't listened to Savage since about 2002. The first time I listened to him was on 9/11/2001


I was raised with talk radio from when I was a young child. Back in the day, I remember listening to Rush and Bob Grant. Hannity came later. Savage later still.

I was also very active on CSP "Promoting Peace Through Stength" and PNAC, had a pretty lengthy email dialog with Gaffney (wish I could find it on my computer), read almost every book ever written by Henry Kissinger - I was a diehard neo-con.

Now I find myself getting frustrated because I I have a hard time conveying to neo-cons the error of their ways. Perhaps the lesson of morality is one that can only be learned through experience...

#125 DJS

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Posted 21 July 2006 - 02:59 AM

Jay

IIRC, it even had an effect on Don


No, I had started to lose my "faith" in the summer of 03.

#126 jaydfox

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Posted 21 July 2006 - 03:06 AM

Oh, my bad...

#127 jaydfox

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Posted 21 July 2006 - 03:06 AM

BTW, when I said "it ... had an effect on Don", I didn't mean it was the catalyst to your turn from the neo-con philosophy... I remember you were impressed by the article (BTW, for those reading this, I didn't write the article myself), and I vaguely remember your referencing it once or twice here at ImmInst in political discussions where Iraq or terrorism came up... But perhaps I'm just misremembering...

#128 DJS

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Posted 21 July 2006 - 03:07 AM

It's a great article! I must have referenced it to atleast a couple of dozen people.

#129 jaydfox

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Posted 21 July 2006 - 03:09 AM

Heh, cross posting compounded by post-post editing (post-"post", hehe...)

#130 Live Forever

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Posted 21 July 2006 - 03:59 AM

Wow, great stuff, Jay. I had never read it before. I think bin Laden could be subbed just for radical fundamentalist Islam in general, however. Eerily telling about the strategy looking at the current conflict. Thanks man. [thumb]

#131 jaydfox

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Posted 21 July 2006 - 05:00 AM

Hmm, Don, looking at it now (considering that it's basically buried, except to those of us who know what to look for), should we pin it maybe?

BTW, I originally linked to that article in this very discussion (and no one seemed to comment on it...):
http://www.imminst.o...=pid&pid=120871

However, I was drunk at the time (don't worry, first time), so I don't really recall how I even found it. Did I search for it? Did I just go through the politics forum, one page at a time?

Anyway, looking back, I'm surprised that the post was as cogent as it was, considering I had tunnel vision and had to get about 8 inches from the screen to read what I'd typed... I even made decent use of italization, etc.

Er, so, getting back to the article I linked to... should we pin it?

#132 eternaltraveler

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Posted 21 July 2006 - 08:10 AM

sure go for it

#133 Trias

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Posted 21 July 2006 - 01:40 PM

Harold,

As (almost) always, I agree with your point of view: harming innocent Lebenese civilians is wrong. Israel should focus its efforts on Hizbullah targets exculsively; it should put more care in making sure no civilians get in the way.

Jeez, that Nasralla guy is a tough nut to crack.
Be that as it may, every dog has its day...

#134 RighteousReason

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Posted 21 July 2006 - 08:08 PM

it's the same f-ing thing, day after day afer day after day


Uh not really Don. They aren't going to change their beliefs/values/POVs, but there is new stuff every day.

#135 RighteousReason

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Posted 21 July 2006 - 08:47 PM

Haha [lol]

I love this place

#136 FunkOdyssey

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Posted 21 July 2006 - 08:55 PM

Oh and **** YOU Don:
QUOTE
Every time I see one of your posts with an expletive in it, I am going to delete the whole post.  thumb.gif


What the ****!? If you delete my post, I'm leaving ImmInst forever, and if I can, I will **** this site up (and specifically YOU up) as much as possible.

Does that seem extreme? Maybe it's because I don't give a shit. If you want to be a fucking asshole, I will just fuckin leave, and if I can **** anything up on the way out, all the better exit for me.

See, this is what happens when you subscribe to catharsis theory and regularly "let off steam" by trashing your room. So angry! [tung]

#137

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Posted 22 July 2006 - 05:10 AM

Remarkable.. (the situation with Hank). Was he being serious?




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